Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[RoseMarie1]

Well I started my FF this morning at 10:30 and it's already bubbling! Yep it's 90 plus here now and over 100 with the heat index. Although it's not THAT hot inside thank the Lord!!! It's about 78 in here. I put it in the utility room since that's a warmer area. I'm just fermenting the chick crumbles. MAYBE I wont be seeing anymore cock roaches crawling across their food!

I just put water in mine, no ACV.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Every time I stir mine, I have to add more water! UGH I started out with the biggest clear glass cookie jar thing a lot of you are using and it was ONLY 1/2 full or less of food and water. Now it's all the way to the top lacking only about 2 in. or so. I only started it at 10 something this morning. Looks like might have to take some out to feed them shortly if this stuff keeps growing.

I'll have to not put AS MUCH in there next time. This is the starter grower chick feed that I am fermenting.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Sounds like you will have to invest in a sheller of some kind. It will probably pay for itself in the long run.

When the chooks are done with this grain mix, I may buy some fresh milled laying mash and mix in the barley and rolled oats. I like the sound of soybean meal for protein... but then I don't like the sound of some of it's properties, so if I have it in the laying mash ingredients at all(I'm sure there will be some there) it will be in smaller amounts than if I mixed it by bulk grain into my feed mix.

Bee, I don't understand what you are saying? You don't like the soybeans in your food OR the amount in the already mixed store bought? Do they have a high content of soybeans in the laying mash or something? I'm new at this and haven't bought any laying food for mine since they're not laying yet.

 

[RoseMarie1]

I read on another thread about someone had gone through 500 lbs of feed for 6 wks with their FRs. My CX will be 4 wk. on the 19th and I've used 50 lbs of chick starter and approx. 50 lbs of whole grains.

The free ranging is, I'm sure, also a big supplement to their feed as I've never really seen any chicken I've owned all these years forage as much and as well as these little CX are doing. They've got all the leaves at the woodline churned up like a flock of turkeys have been in there and they are constantly on the move. I'm sure they would be larger right now if they weren't running all their fat off!

I put a roost in the coop the other day and some are using it...I hope it catches on and they all start using it.

How's everyone doing on their fermented feeding? Notice any changes in feed intake? My CX are down to once a day feedings and are still growing and looking great. I'll take some pics on Thursday of their progress.

Bee what is CX?

 

[RoseMarie1]

I think you are on the right track with your quest for more knowledge...meat birds are an investment, the way I figure. I switched mine over to whole grains at 2 wks, after their chick starter was done.

With you having a feed mill close, you are in a great position to get some good grain mixes that are fresh. I'll tell you something I've found out, though...for the past few years none of my chickens really want to clean up cracked corn. Use to be they would gobble it first thing but something has changed...I'm thinking it is the GMO and I have read studies done that indicate that animals just don't prefer it and even some wild animals will leave it and not eat it at all. Whatever the change, it makes the cheapest grain also the less preferable to the chickens...and I had forgotten that fact.

Even these meaties, who will eat anything that moves and most things that don't, will leave the corn and some of the wheat in the bottom of the feeder. When next I make a grain purchase, I'm sticking with barley as the biggest percentage and then adding some oats, then maybe will add some layer mash to fill it out.

See? I'm already doing it myself...that adjusting things when you observe they aren't the most ideal for the situation. I do it so often that I rarely even notice that I'm making those little adjustments as I go along. I think you will be the same and you will get into a flow that suites your chicken paradigm.

I wanted my CX to grow slower than is normally recommended and it is happening right on cue...but they are growing and you can see it almost daily. They are much bigger today than they were yesterday! I'm amazed at the capacity of these birds to grow and put on meat no matter what you feed them. The last group were raised on layer mash, whole grains and free range also and they were at finishing weights by 8 wks just like those raised on broiler feeds free choice. I waited for a couple of weeks to see if they would gain even more weight but they seemed to level off, plateau really, and gained no more weight.

You really can't go wrong with these meaties...I find them extremely hardy and active. I had one get it's whole flank peeled back by the rooster....I treated it with NuStock and I can't even find that particular bird anymore. Healed and you wouldn't even had known he was injured. I had a couple in the last batch that suffered similar grievous injuries and they didn't show any outward signs that they were hurt, healed completely and quickly and you couldn't tell who had been injured at butchering time.

The only thing I see on these forums that can kill these birds is overfeeding of high pro feeds and confinement to small spaces on moist bedding...that would kill any bird eventually. Take away that factor and you have a pretty easy bird to raise!

Bee what do you mean when you say high pro feeds? What's that? Sorry I'm new and trying to learn.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Gotcha! I have a few big blue barrels I can use for that (that's where I normally store feed, they have locking lids and everything).

Where so you find the blue barrels with the locking lids? I worry about ants getting into mine so I have it in the house in the utility room. They are sooooo bad here in the south!

 

[RoseMarie1]

The holes around the bottom of the sides is the secret for me. I did as Bee said she did, and put a rope up to the rafters after putting 3/32 size holes in a bucket, and it works very well. Helps that I found a bucket at a dumpster that was already kinda chewed up anyway. Have another that I put big holes in and covered the holes with screening, doesn't work as well. No idea why, shoulda worked better, but it doesn't.

Is the inside bucket smaller than the outside bucket with the feed in it?

 

[RoseMarie1]

I built a trough feeder out of rain guttering. Mounted it on 2x4 "feet" and mounted some perches on either side made from old tomato stakes. It is approximately 6 ft. long. When these meaties are out of here, I'll scale it down to suit my layers. It keeps the bedding out of the feed and when they are bigger, I'll remove the side perches altogether. Easy to dump, easy to clean, easy to fill....I like easy.

Oh I'd love to see a pic of this! I have a vinyl gutter I mounted onto the wall in their pen and used the gutter guard on it to keep them OUT of their food! I cut small round holes in it so they could feed from the round holes. The little boogers STILL wanted to STAND ON the gutter guard! UGHHHHH SO I just got me a long piece of poultry wire and folded it in half so it would be sturdier and stapled that to the wall above the feeder. Just left enough from for their little heads to go into the holes on the gutter guard. So far it's worked!
I have 23 BA's and 15 RIR's so I really really NEED to have mine like yours so they can feed from BOTH sides of this feeder and not just one side so there wont be sooooo much pushing and shoving.

They always act like they've not eaten in a month of sundays and their trough is NEVER empty! lol

 

[Beekissed]

Bee, I don't understand what you are saying? You don't like the soybeans in your food OR the amount in the already mixed store bought? Do they have a high content of soybeans in the laying mash or something? I'm new at this and haven't bought any laying food for mine since they're not laying yet.

Poultry feed will have protein from a few sources...soybean meal, fish meal or animal by product meal...meal is just the ground up version of each.

Bee what is CX?

Cornish Rock Cross birds that are commonly grown as meat birds, broilers, etc.

Bee what do you mean when you say high pro feeds? What's that? Sorry I'm new and trying to learn.

High Protein percentages in the feed. Broiler, or meat birds, are commonly fed continuous offerings of high protein feeds to get them to pack on weight very quickly before processing time.

Is the inside bucket smaller than the outside bucket with the feed in it?

No. No more than one plastic cup stacked within another one is smaller than the other. Buckets can stack, or nest, within one another and still be the same size.

Oh I'd love to see a pic of this! I have a vinyl gutter I mounted onto the wall in their pen and used the gutter guard on it to keep them OUT of their food! I cut small round holes in it so they could feed from the round holes. The little boogers STILL wanted to STAND ON the gutter guard! UGHHHHH SO I just got me a long piece of poultry wire and folded it in half so it would be sturdier and stapled that to the wall above the feeder. Just left enough from for their little heads to go into the holes on the gutter guard. So far it's worked!
I have 23 BA's and 15 RIR's so I really really NEED to have mine like yours so they can feed from BOTH sides of this feeder and not just one side so there wont be sooooo much pushing and shoving.

They always act like they've not eaten in a month of sundays and their trough is NEVER empty! lol

Yeah...sometimes they get in it. It doesn't matter...I only put out what they can eat in that meal, so it isn't getting dirty before they can eat it and the deep litter absorbs any mess that's created. You can prevent this by wrapping the feeder in wire fencing, tightly, that has squares big enough to allow heads and not feet...but I don't bother now that I feed wet feeds. Usually if they get inside they don't stay there long.

 

[RedRidge]

Random thoughts.
Ingredients... I never use soybean meal... .
I sell a LOT of eggs and a LOT of meat... it's my business.
Many of my customers refuse to eat anything fed soy, or anything fed any gmo ingredients (lots of WAPF customers).
That said... soybean meal is also not animal protein.
I could go on... let's just say I hate soybean meal.
Field peas will bring the protein level up some - I love field peas.
But again, animal protein is necessary... so my grains are primarily corn, field peas, and oats and I feed fish meal for chicks and BSF for adults (BSF have too much calcium for chicks). I am raising enough BSF right now that I am freezing batches daily so I'll have them to feed over the winter. I wasn't certain with our late spring that my production would pick up enough to double the output I needed for winter feeding, but it finally has and I'm teaming with BSF right now.

=.

As far as how to feed CX... I have found over the years arguments for every type of management system out there.
I've tried it all.
I think the "kiss" method works best... keep it simply stupid.
Raise them in the fall or spring when temperatures are moderate. Feed a good quality feed. Walk away.
There is no reason to make growing out CX a complicated matter... I've made it complicated... it doesn't have to be.
I put fresh feed out daily, top off the big PVC waterer that has chicken nipples on the bottom, and walk away.
In 8-9 weeks (usually mid-Nov), we slaughter... it's brainless.
I simply do not like the idea that CX are not self-sustaining, so that is one of several reasons I am raising a more dual purpose bird - I'd like to get away from the CX. I considered Freedom Rangers, but they are not self-sustaining either being a hybrid. I know a few who have tried, they simply do not breed true worth a darn.
I fed out 42 CX last time... didn't loose one... didn't have one problem. Nothing special, no extra vitamins other than the nutribalancer I added to feed.
I balanced, ground, and fermented a good quality ration that was 20% protein (very similar ration to what I feed my chicks), made sure it had enough animal protein in it, and free fed for 9 weeks - slaughtered all 42, they all had great fast growth and great looking organs (the ultimate test of a slaughtered animal's health).
I can "claim" they free ranged... but trust me, by week 4 they never wander further than the feed pan and waterer - which I always put in different places to just make them get some exercise. So yes, they can go where ever they want... they just have no reason to.
I don't have to worry about predators since I have maremma, so everyone free ranges... I have a momma and 3 week old pups with the chickens right now (start the pups with chicks and then move them to larger livestock and they will easily come back to be good poultry guardians as adults).
In my experience, depriving CX of feed 12 hrs out of the day just makes them gorge the remaining 12 hrs... that creates other problems - lots of them.
I've done it both ways. They eat less over the 8 weeks if they free feed than if I dole it out, and they grow better.
It's a lot like feeding bottle lambs... I have fed out as many as 300 in a 60 day period when I owned the sheep dairy - free feed milk milk replacer and they don't gorge, don't have health issue, and eat less.

Feed pans... for anything fermented I avoid any metal that isn't stainless steel.
Leaching can be a problem... I'm a cheesemaker, so I'm a little weird this... but I only use food grade plastic and stainless for feeding FF...

I have toyed with the double bucket method for FF, but have never tried it.
Mostly I'm worried about the weight of the top bucket when lifted out.
Has anyone had trouble with this? Seems like a lot of dead weight lifting that much... I tend to have this philosophy as I am not as young as I used to be... work smarter and not harder. I just have no desire to dead lift 50 lbs on a daily basis.

I currently feed about 20 lbs of FF a day ( have a LOT of chicks I'm growing out this year), so I have FF in 2 buckets all the time.
Before I get to serious cockerel culling this fall I will be feeding about 35 lbs/day, so I will be adding a 3rd bucket shortly.
If I didn't grind and mix my own ration I could never afford the $20 or more for a 50 lb bag of quality feed that some folks are paying... I understand some in the closest city to me a few hours away are paying $33 for a bag of organic layer.

I can't imagine! I love my job, my livestock, but... it's not a hobby and I can't afford to loose money. Animals that do not pay for themselves quickly leave our place. As my husband likes to say, "We have 2 requirements for you to live here... you have to have shoulders, and you have to have a job."