Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[Triple Willow]

I'll tell you what I did ages ago with a dog that loved to kill my birds... if you promise not to tell anybody! 

I had always heard that to break a dog from killing chickens, you take one of the birds he killed and tie it around his neck as tight as you can and let it stay there and rot.  Well, the dog we had at the time killed about half of my chickens in one afternoon.  So I was plenty mad at him.  Then I think it was about a week after that when he got hold of another one.  I tied that chicken to his neck and after about an hour I look out the window and there he is in the yard eating that chicken.  He got it off his neck somehow! 

This is the part that worked:

I was so mad, I marched right out there (he saw me coming but apparently didn't care much about what I thought) and he stood there as I walked up to him, grabbed his collar to hold him and then picked up that big rooster by his feet.  Can you guess what happened next?  Yep!  I beat that dog for about 10 minutes with that big rooster!

He never ever looked straight at a chicken again for the rest of his life!  He would glance at them sideways and put his head down! 

Hey there Lacy. I am still carrying around this doodad I'm my purse but haven't caught up with my friend yet. I haven't forgot!

I tried that with my dog and didn't phase him a bit. Today I grabbed him up by the scruff of his neck and told him about it... when I got done he was jumping around and wanting to play! Ahhh dang dog! If he kills another one I am gonna make him wear it. I was wondering if I went and bought one from the store and made him wear it if he would figure it out. I believe it is going to take some electricity.

 

[Triple Willow]

Naw...I've never made cheese but it's on my list of things to accomplish in life.  I love good cheese and I like feta cheese...here's a video you might appreciate! 

Funny! LOL

 

[Windy Bay Farm]

It's a little off this threads topic, but can anyone tell me at what age the girls should stay laying ? I have some RIR's, BR's and a couple black sex links. They're about 19 weeks now.

 

[Triple Willow]

It's a little off this threads topic, but can anyone tell me at what age the girls should stay laying ? I have some RIR's, BR's and a couple black sex links. They're about 19 weeks now.

Good morning WBF. My Black Australorps, Columbian Rocks and Speckled Sussex started laying at 19-20 weeks. The SS are still not too reliable but the rest are doing real well. I imagine yours should start soon. Do any of them have real red combs yet? Anybody squatting?

I am waiting on my young group too. Oh boy I just checked and mine are 17 weeks! Waiting on eggs is exciting! I hope most of mine have started by the end of this month. I am wondering if ones that start laying this late in the year like ours will lay longer into cooler weather?

 

[BCMaraniac]

It's a little off this threads topic, but can anyone tell me at what age the girls should stay laying ? I have some RIR's, BR's and a couple black sex links. They're about 19 weeks now.

I am by no means an expert, but usually between 18-24 weeks. Just prior to beginning to lay, their combs and wattles will get really red, and when you reach down to as though to pick them up, you may see them squat in anticipation of a rooster. You may also see them start having interest in the nesting box, sometimes even trying it out. You may find their first eggs in a variety of places, however, before they get the hang of. I found one once on top of a bag of mulch that was sitting upright and leaning against a fence! They usually figure it out pretty quickly, however.

The decreasing daylight going into the fall can delay it, though. However, from some things I have read, the older they are when they start laying. the more the pullet weighs, and the bigger their eggs will eventually be....there was some study I read about it basically saying not to worry if they don't lay early, because the upside is larger eggs when they do.

I had a black copper marans late spring pullet who didn't start laying until the following February, and her first egg was 59 grams....a large egg. She now consistently lays extra large to jumbo eggs! I had a Barred Rock who laid early, and to this day she lays a small egg. Perhaps it is a coincidence, perhaps not.

It is so hard not to get impatient with them, though.

 

[jajeanpierre]

Hey there Lacy. I am still carrying around this doodad I'm my purse but haven't caught up with my friend yet. I haven't forgot!

I tried that with my dog and didn't phase him a bit. Today I grabbed him up by the scruff of his neck and told him about it... when I got done he was jumping around and wanting to play! Ahhh dang dog! If he kills another one I am gonna make him wear it. I was wondering if I went and bought one from the store and made him wear it if he would figure it out. I believe it is going to take some electricity.

Whether anything works or not has a lot to do with how motivated the dog is and how good your timing is when applying an aversive. Think about a cat--do you honestly believe that doing anything other than crippling it would stop a very dedicated cat from hunting? Prey drive is innate and stronger in some animals than in others.

Do you really believe a dog will associate a rotting chicken around its neck with killing it days ago? The two events are not related. As well, most dogs will roll on rotting animals, so why is that supposed to be an aversive?

A dog that is committed to killing chickens will likely always be committed to killing chickens. Huskies; terriers; sight hounds like Greyhounds, Borzoi, etc.; Dachshunds are notorious for always going after their prey regardless of how much adversity they face in their quest. Dachshunds were bred to go to ground and kill badgers--that's one tough adversary so they are incredibly driven and dedicated.

Years ago researchers were trying to research morality in children. Of course, you couldn't experiment on children, so they set the test up with dogs. The responses of the dogs were so dramatic, they decided to break it down by breeds.

This is how I remember it as it was presented to me in a lecture many years ago.

In a room, there was a hungry dog, researcher in a lab coat, a dish of meat and dry kibble. Hungry dog immediately went to the meat, was reprimanded and learned to leave meat alone when researcher present. Then the researcher was removed from the room and the amount of kibble removed to a negligible amount. Here is where it got interesting. Some dogs, German Shepherds in particular, would circle the meat, turn their heads away from it and whine, never touching the meat. Other dogs, particularly hounds, went straight for the meat regardless of whether a researcher was present or not.

The bottom line is that some animals will be so motivated to do the undesirable behavior, that they don't care about the consequences and the (undesirable) behavior has more value for them than the consequence has deterrence. Killing chickens is one of those behaviors that are very rewarding to the dog. Even gun dogs that are bred for generations to not mark a bird positively quiver with excitement when they have a living bird in their mouths.

Just some thoughts.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

TW; There is NO stopping Nukka the Killer. There was a time when I was harvesting rabbits and gave her a whole rabbit skull, fresh and tasty. She dropped it for twenty minutes to go run after a chipmunk that escaped under the fence. Calling her, waving the rabbit head, did nothing. She just wanted the living thing.

Now, she does respect my paltry deer netting fence. As does Persy, the Big Dog... They even generally respect the door when it's open... I trained them to NEVER go into the chicken pen EVER. (With Tender, it was Tender that walked out of the pen, not the dogs going in. But the moment that barrier isn't there Nukka becomes a vicious destroyer of all things small and not canine. She has NO recall when there's an animal on the loose. So there's not many options. She can be leashed for life or we could get a shock collar. :| I think she'd prefer being allowed to run still. She just needs a lesson.

I feel like she's a very smart dog and I am confident she will pick it up. At least in regards to MY animals.

 

[waltandlori]

It's a little off this threads topic, but can anyone tell me at what age the girls should stay laying ? I have some RIR's, BR's and a couple black sex links. They're about 19 weeks now.

My little flock started laying around 16 or 17 weeks. I have 5 different breeds, and it was in November they started. They laid the same summer and winter, just recently slacked off for molt. I had 10 layers and lost one pretty quick to a hawk, so 9, only once got 9 eggs, mostly 7 or 8 from med large to jumbo.

Walt

 

[jajeanpierre]

TW; There is NO stopping Nukka the Killer. There was a time when I was harvesting rabbits and gave her a whole rabbit skull, fresh and tasty. She dropped it for twenty minutes to go run after a chipmunk that escaped under the fence. Calling her, waving the rabbit head, did nothing. She just wanted the living thing.

Now, she does respect my paltry deer netting fence. As does Persy, the Big Dog... They even generally respect the door when it's open... I trained them to NEVER go into the chicken pen EVER. (With Tender, it was Tender that walked out of the pen, not the dogs going in. But the moment that barrier isn't there Nukka becomes a vicious destroyer of all things small and not canine. She has NO recall when there's an animal on the loose. So there's not many options. She can be leashed for life or we could get a shock collar. :| I think she'd prefer being allowed to run still. She just needs a lesson.

I feel like she's a very smart dog and I am confident she will pick it up. At least in regards to MY animals.

This is a Husky of some sort, right? I doubt the shock collar will work if she is very motivated. Siberians and Alaskan Malamutes are really motivated to kill little animals. I've watched professional field trial trainers shocking Labs and not getting them off a bad line when the dog insists. Herding and retrieving are hunting behaviors, driven by prey drive.

If your dog does respect an electric shock, you can do things like set up an invisible fence around where the chickens are. It works by emitting a radio frequency that is picked up when the collar gets close and triggers the shock in the collar. You can also get a unit that is a single emitter and put it in the middle of the chicken run. They were designed for inside houses, so you could have dog-free areas.

Don't be too surprised if the shock collar fails. I have a little Dachshund who, like many hounds, loved to run away and follow her nose. I set up an invisible fence around my property. She would go right through it if she was very motivated to leave. I had it set up for the maximum width and she would just steal herself to the pain and take it. Running free was a bigger reward than a two second burn was a detriment.

My own solution has been to never let the dogs out unsupervised and to make sure the really irresistible chickens, the small fluffy fluttering Silkies are behind a fence. If I'm around, they leave the free ranging large fowl Ameraucanas alone.

 

[Windy Bay Farm]

Good morning WBF. My Black Australorps, Columbian Rocks and Speckled Sussex started laying at 19-20 weeks. The SS are still not too reliable but the rest are doing real well. I imagine yours should start soon. Do any of them have real red combs yet? Anybody squatting?

I am waiting on my young group too. Oh boy I just checked and mine are 17 weeks! Waiting on eggs is exciting! I hope most of mine have started by the end of this month. I am wondering if ones that start laying this late in the year like ours will lay longer into cooler weather?

Hi TW ! Definitely have a few with red combs ! When you say squatting do you mean they are just randomly squatting ? When I approach some of them they tend to squat if that's what you mean.