Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[aoxa]

You can trim the spurs and still show can't you?  The reason for this (no removal) may be that someone might try to claim that their cock bird is a cockerel. It takes all types!

On my Buckeye, I only took the points off his spurs and on one of his legs he has two spurs!  That was fun.  On my Andalusian who had spurs almost 3 inches long, I took off about a half inch and just squared the things off so they couldn't cut any hens.  You can still tell by the size of what is left that he is not a cockerel.

Generally, on a cockerel, the spurs are blunt.  But when they've reached one year or almost one year, a little needle point will start to grow on them.  You could take a file to that point if they are developing.  I used a workshop file for mine...  big enough to handle the job.    However, a nail file would probably work for cockerel's developing spurs!

I was mostly replying about the removal via hot potatoes as mentioned after you said to trim. I can file them... That makes sense. I do have a 7 month old cockerel that has very pointy spurs, not long - but pointy. He's not the one mating the hen in question - at least I'm pretty sure it's not him, as he is kind of an outcast and doesn't get much in terms of girls

I have a cock that has a spur on the outside of his leg! Not the inside! How weird.. lol Never saw that before.

 

[galanie]

I was mostly replying about the removal via hot potatoes as mentioned after you said to trim. I can file them... That makes sense. I do have a 7 month old cockerel that has very pointy spurs, not long - but pointy. He's not the one mating the hen in question - at least I'm pretty sure it's not him, as he is kind of an outcast and doesn't get much in terms of girls
I have a cock that has a spur on the outside of his leg! Not the inside! How weird.. lol Never saw that before.

Weird! I had one with two spurs on one leg and one spur on the other, but they were all at least on the inside of the leg.

 

[maryhysong]

Whew! I have just finished scanning this thread from page 1! Yes I am a crazy chicken lady! I have a mixed flock of different ages, 3 barred banties that are probably about 1 1/2 yrs old, a full size Buff Orpington Rooster that is a little younger; maybe 9-12 months, 4 BO pullets just starting to lay, Welsummers, 3 hens and a roo that are 4-5 yrs old, 10 Muscovy ducks that are 4 months, a Welsh Harlequin drake and 3 mixed WHxrunner drakes and 4 Welsummer chicks, 2 weeks.

I am trying to avoid GMO products; organic anything is impossible here; yes the feed store will order it, but at nearly double the price, which I can't afford. So I have been doing this, starting small chicks on non-medicated chick starter and then moving them slowly to sprouted grains. I buy a wild bird seed mix containing no corn or soy and recently began adding wheat to it. I soak for 24 hours then begin draining and rinsing. So sprouts are about 3 days old when fed. The size of the sprout depends on how warm it is. I also get spoiled produce from the grocery store on my days off from work. If there are a lot of spoils to feed then I sometimes skip the sprouts.

When I got the ducks I bought game bird/turkey food for them, knowing they need a higher protein level. Several of the Muscovys developed angelwing; when I checked the feed tag the stuff had 28% protein! So I fed less of it until it was gone, they have been just on sprouted grains and spoils for a couple months now. I do raise earthworms and when I only had 5 birds fed some every day for the protein, but with so many the worm box can't keep up with the appetites so I mostly feed as treats and to the younger birds.

Now I know the protein level in plain grain is only around 12% and this has had several effects. The old hens are molty and are very slow about it. I know it could just be the birds but also think it is the lower protein level since feathers are all protein. The Muscovys at 4 months are only weighing 4-6 pounds live weight and I think they should be heavier.

So here's my experiment that I am beginning. I will ferment the chick starter, with a mix of yogurt and homemade ACV, adding grains and alfalfa cubes to the mix as they grow, gradually weaning them off the starter (since I know it has corn and soy in it, which are of course GMO since it's not organic)

For the rest of the flock I will continue the sprouts and spoils but in addition I will do an FF feeding each day, a mix of the bird seed, which is millet, milo, BOSS, along with whatever other whole grains i can get, such as rolled barley and wheat. I'm also going to try adding alfalfa cubes, to up the protein a bit and provide more greens when there's no spoils.

I started a bucketful day before yesterday, as above, with ACV and yogurt; it's bubbling nicely this morning. I fed a little last night and the everybody scarfed it up, but the ducks especially went wild for it; the Muscovys are hogs, they were even knocking the rooster out of the way to get to it!

I want to see if I can get the molty girls back to lay quicker; right now only 1 banty is laying and 2 of the BO pullets just started this week. I also want to get some meat on those drakes as I need to thin out the pens next month when the weather cools off a bit more. I'm going to set up a separate smaller ferment for the chick starter.

This has been a great thread and I've loved all the info and stories, especially interested in the ones where you give statistics on raising meat birds. Most of you seem to be doing cornishX or freedom rangers. Have any of you done a batch of dual purpose birds with the idea of eating the roos and keeping the girls for laying?

 

[bobbieschicks]

Don't know if it is a coincidence or not. I've been getting 3-4 eggs from my 6 layers lately. I have two others who aren't laying right now due to molt and broody.

They've been on FF since Friday. Today I got 6 out of 6 and they were fighting for the boxes. L

I'll keep watch to see if the pattern continues. .

 

[maryhysong]

Don't know if it is a coincidence or not. I've been getting 3-4 eggs from my 6 layers lately. I have two others who aren't laying right now due to molt and broody.
They've been on FF since Friday. Today I got 6 out of 6 and they were fighting for the boxes. L
I'll keep watch to see if the pattern continues. .

hoping my girls pick up too! not getting enough to eat or sell right now!

 

[Island Roo]

Whew! I have just finished scanning this thread from page 1! Yes I am a crazy chicken lady! I have a mixed flock of different ages, 3 barred banties that are probably about 1 1/2 yrs old, a full size Buff Orpington Rooster that is a little younger; maybe 9-12 months, 4 BO pullets just starting to lay, Welsummers, 3 hens and a roo that are 4-5 yrs old, 10 Muscovy ducks that are 4 months, a Welsh Harlequin drake and 3 mixed WHxrunner drakes and 4 Welsummer chicks, 2 weeks.

I am trying to avoid GMO products; organic anything is impossible here; yes the feed store will order it, but at nearly double the price, which I can't afford. So I have been doing this, starting small chicks on non-medicated chick starter and then moving them slowly to sprouted grains. I buy a wild bird seed mix containing no corn or soy and recently began adding wheat to it. I soak for 24 hours then begin draining and rinsing. So sprouts are about 3 days old when fed. The size of the sprout depends on how warm it is. I also get spoiled produce from the grocery store on my days off from work. If there are a lot of spoils to feed then I sometimes skip the sprouts.

When I got the ducks I bought game bird/turkey food for them, knowing they need a higher protein level. Several of the Muscovys developed angelwing; when I checked the feed tag the stuff had 28% protein! So I fed less of it until it was gone, they have been just on sprouted grains and spoils for a couple months now. I do raise earthworms and when I only had 5 birds fed some every day for the protein, but with so many the worm box can't keep up with the appetites so I mostly feed as treats and to the younger birds.

Now I know the protein level in plain grain is only around 12% and this has had several effects. The old hens are molty and are very slow about it. I know it could just be the birds but also think it is the lower protein level since feathers are all protein. The Muscovys at 4 months are only weighing 4-6 pounds live weight and I think they should be heavier.

So here's my experiment that I am beginning. I will ferment the chick starter, with a mix of yogurt and homemade ACV, adding grains and alfalfa cubes to the mix as they grow, gradually weaning them off the starter (since I know it has corn and soy in it, which are of course GMO since it's not organic)

For the rest of the flock I will continue the sprouts and spoils but in addition I will do an FF feeding each day, a mix of the bird seed, which is millet, milo, BOSS, along with whatever other whole grains i can get, such as rolled barley and wheat. I'm also going to try adding alfalfa cubes, to up the protein a bit and provide more greens when there's no spoils.

I started a bucketful day before yesterday, as above, with ACV and yogurt; it's bubbling nicely this morning. I fed a little last night and the everybody scarfed it up, but the ducks especially went wild for it; the Muscovys are hogs, they were even knocking the rooster out of the way to get to it!

I want to see if I can get the molty girls back to lay quicker; right now only 1 banty is laying and 2 of the BO pullets just started this week. I also want to get some meat on those drakes as I need to thin out the pens next month when the weather cools off a bit more. I'm going to set up a separate smaller ferment for the chick starter.

This has been a great thread and I've loved all the info and stories, especially interested in the ones where you give statistics on raising meat birds. Most of you seem to be doing cornishX or freedom rangers. Have any of you done a batch of dual purpose birds with the idea of eating the roos and keeping the girls for laying?

You may want to add some of that[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] game bird / turkey feed to the FF to boost the protein.[/FONT]
Maintaining 18 percent (or whatever) is not critical but I think they need more than what wheat, barley and scraps will provide. Unless your happy with how they are doing for you.

I've raised brahmas and orpingtons on FF and processed extra roos for meat. Excellent results.

 

[bruceh]

here is a great thread on an experiment someone did on
Meatie Experiment: FF 'vs' Crumbles

 

[Beekissed]

Gotta post that into a link, Brutus, for us to be able to follow it.....

Is this the thread you were wanting to show? https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/705424/our-experiment-with-fermented-food-for-meaties

 

[binders]

I noticed that my layers seem a lot less interested in my FF since I started adding rabbit pellets to the mix (bought them thinking they were alfalfa pellets). They will eventually eat the FF but not nearly as happily has they had been before.

I had added the rabbit pellets once before and also noticed the lack of interest so I stopped adding the pellets and the layers were much more interested in the FF. Day before yesterday I added some more of the rabbit pellets back into the mix and their interest and desire for the FF went way down. I guess it really does matter what you put into the FF mix. I think I will stick to the layer pellets/scratch/3-way feed.

Interestingly I put some of the rabbit pellets into a bowl (I want to use them up!) and added just plain old water and the chickens greedily drank the water and this morning the bowl was clean! Don't know if they cleaned it or if they had some help during the night. Filled the bowl up again this morning with the pellets and water and they all crowded around the bowl drinking. The pellets were still solid on the bottom so they were not eating them yet. Will see what happens during the day.

I wonder why they don't like the rabbit pellets in the FF though.

 

[maryhysong]

You may want to add some of that[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] game bird / turkey feed to the FF to boost the protein.[/FONT]
Maintaining 18 percent (or whatever) is not critical but I think they need more than what wheat, barley and scraps will provide. Unless your happy with how they are doing for you.

I've raised brahmas and orpingtons on FF and processed extra roos for meat. Excellent results.

What I'm trying to do is get away from the GMO corn & soy, which is a high % of the grower feeds. so I'm looking for something to boost the protein a bit; guess I may have to bite the bullet and have the feed store order some organic for me.... Glad to hear that on your brahmas and orps. I'll be hatching some orps out as soon as these pullets are further along.