Fish meal vs. raw meats in home made feed

[SavageDestiny]

Soo I'm curious. I want to make my own feed, and include animal protein in the girls' diet. Most people recommend fish meal, but I am not keen on using it. Fish meal in the U.S. by law has to be preserved with ethoxyquin, which is a pretty awful chemical that has been linked to various health issues, including cancer. Companies which produce fish meal may get licensing to use other preservatives, but it's rare to find a company that does and there haven't been any studies showing the alternatives to be any safer. And yes, for other pet owners, this does apply to any fish meal in your dog, cat, fish, chicken, and any other type of animal food. It is not labeled on the bag because the pet food company does not add it, it is already there. Unless the bag specifically says "ethoxyquin free", it is there.

Anyway, I have lots of access to fresh, raw meats. Mostly chicken, turkey, and beef. Including organs. I'm hoping raw meats will be just as good for the girls as fish meal. Has anyone used raw meat in their chickens' diets? How much should I feed per week?

 

[pdirt]

I would think fresh raw or cooked meats and especially with organs would be far superior than any dried meat. Curious to hear more about the ethoxyquin, because yes, our current feed does have fish meal preserved with this. My initial look up of the stuff showed it to be an antioxidant. Do you have any links you could share?

 

[SavageDestiny]

I would think fresh raw or cooked meats and especially with organs would be far superior than any dried meat. Curious to hear more about the ethoxyquin, because yes, our current feed does have fish meal preserved with this. My initial look up of the stuff showed it to be an antioxidant. Do you have any links you could share?

It is actually a pesticide, and was originally used in the rubber making process. Now it's used for food preservation. It is only allowed in human foods at .5 PPM due to toxicity, but allowed in animal feed at 150 PPM. Here's a couple links:

http://maxandruffys.com/unnecessary-harmful-preservatives/
http://www.pesticideinfo.org/Detail_Chemical.jsp?Rec_Id=PC35089 (note that it is toxic to fish)

This is one from 1997 where the FDA is requesting allowable ethoxyquin levels in pet food be lowered to 75 PPM due to toxicity concerns:
http://www.fda.gov/AnimalVeterinary/NewsEvents/CVMUpdates/ucm127828.htm

OSHA considers it a hazardous substance:
http://datasheets.scbt.com/sc-205686.pdf

That's just a few links. It's definitely not something I want to feed any of my animals.

 

[pdirt]

Wow, thanks for those. Bummer, otherwise I really like the feed we get. I'm going to write the miller and see if they have any insight on the toxicity of ethoxyquin.

 

[pdirt]

So I wrote our feed company, their responses have always been great when I have a question, Scratch n Peck feeds. Their fish meal is preserved with an herbal-based product called Naturox, which is approved for Certified Organic feeds.

http://www.scratchandpeck.com/product/fish-meal/ (feed company)

http://www.kemin.com/products/naturox (Naturox mfr website)

http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/n/naturoxliqmsds.pdf (Naturox MSDS)

https://freshstartgrowers.com/Organic-Fish-Meal (50lbs bag of organic fish meal preserved with Naturox)

Puts my mind at ease. But nonetheless, fresh meat would probably be ideal. If I ever can get a hold of quality meat at decent price, I'd consider it. Otherwise, I might start raising mealworms!

 

[petrel]

My birds are only 6 months old, but I've been giving them raw and cooked meat ever since we moved them out of the brooder. They get raw tuna, beef, duck, goose, and venison and all cooked meats (except chicken and turkey) that haven't been preserved or heavily seasoned (like ham or bacon). I put it in a suet cage and they pick at it as they please. Given all they want, 13 of them won't consume more that about a 1/2 lb before they just quit it. They will return to pick, but won't really go after it again until the next day. I think they know their quota on everything but fresh tuna. I can't just leave that for them, as they appear to gorge themselves on it until they are miserable. Fresh tuna must be rationed.

 

[SavageDestiny]

So I wrote our feed company, their responses have always been great when I have a question, Scratch n Peck feeds. Their fish meal is preserved with an herbal-based product called Naturox, which is approved for Certified Organic feeds.

http://www.scratchandpeck.com/product/fish-meal/ (feed company)

http://www.kemin.com/products/naturox (Naturox mfr website)

http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/n/naturoxliqmsds.pdf (Naturox MSDS)

https://freshstartgrowers.com/Organic-Fish-Meal (50lbs bag of organic fish meal preserved with Naturox)

Puts my mind at ease. But nonetheless, fresh meat would probably be ideal. If I ever can get a hold of quality meat at decent price, I'd consider it. Otherwise, I might start raising mealworms!

Oh that is awesome! I knew the Naturox existed, but had yet to run across a company that actually uses it due to cost. The company has to get special licensing to use anything but ethoxyquin! This is really good to know, so glad you contacted them! Thanks for the link to the bag of meal too... although at $76, I think I'll stick with portioning out meat I'm already feeding my dogs.

My birds are only 6 months old, but I've been giving them raw and cooked meat ever since we moved them out of the brooder. They get raw tuna, beef, duck, goose, and venison and all cooked meats (except chicken and turkey) that haven't been preserved or heavily seasoned (like ham or bacon). I put it in a suet cage and they pick at it as they please. Given all they want, 13 of them won't consume more that about a 1/2 lb before they just quit it. They will return to pick, but won't really go after it again until the next day. I think they know their quota on everything but fresh tuna. I can't just leave that for them, as they appear to gorge themselves on it until they are miserable. Fresh tuna must be rationed.

Thanks for this! So you don't portion it, you just throw them scraps and let them have at it?

 

[petrel]

Yes and No. It is only portioned to the extent that no more than what fills the double suet cake holder will be provided to them in a day. The rate at which they consume it varies by their preference.

 

[pdirt]

Oh that is awesome! I knew the Naturox existed, but had yet to run across a company that actually uses it due to cost. The company has to get special licensing to use anything but ethoxyquin! This is really good to know, so glad you contacted them! Thanks for the link to the bag of meal too... although at $76, I think I'll stick with portioning out meat I'm already feeding my dogs.

Yes, glad to know it, too. If I can find a bag of that fish meal locally, I might try it. I checked on shipping a bag from the link I posted and shipping to my location would cost as much as the bag of fish meal! Without shipping that bag would ring out to $1.52/lb...what are you paying per pound for the meat you use for your dogs and chickens?

 

[SavageDestiny]

Yes, glad to know it, too. If I can find a bag of that fish meal locally, I might try it. I checked on shipping a bag from the link I posted and shipping to my location would cost as much as the bag of fish meal! Without shipping that bag would ring out to $1.52/lb...what are you paying per pound for the meat you use for your dogs and chickens?

I generally don't pay over $1.19/lb, although occasionally for beef or pork I have to shell out $1.40/lb or so. I get a lot of duck absolutely free from a hunter friend too.