GMO Feeds

[Madviolin]

Okay so wrong use of words. A lot of organic crops may have gmos eventually not on purpose but because of cross pollination ( which the farmer can fix but if he cant would lose his non gmo/organic title). So what i meant is that if you dont use pesticides (from a non natural source kind) there is no pesticides on your crop. But if you plant non gmo seeds they may not stay that way forever. However if it is certified organic it dosnt contain gmos. Also If something is JUST non gmo it dosnt mean it has not been exposed to non natrual pesticides. ( hence "not organic") BUT if something is organic it is non gmo just hard to keep that way do too cross polination as it would be hard to keep any crop non gmo. But if it is certified organic it is non gmo. Sorry if i confused people!


so basically what i meant is something could be non gmo but not 100% organic but organic is non gmo just the crop is not guaranteed to be so forever. Understood? if not sorry if this is to confusing...

sorry i really did not make myself clear enough before..... my bad.....

Please don't think im an idiot......

 

[chickengeorgeto]

Your incorrect, Organic growers can not use GMO seeds but they can use pesticides as long as the pesticides are derived from natural sources.

What your saying is that Organic farmers can use some the most toxic and dangerous pesticides manufactured by companies like Monsanto and BayerAG. Some of these pesticides are Neem oil, Landscape oil, Compound 1080, (so toxic that 1/500 of an ounce will kill a coyote in minutes) and my personal favorite Rounote, an Organic insecticide made from a tropical plant and first used by South American Indians to kill fish for human consumption. Rounote is of special concern because of its extreme toxicity to aquatic animals.

On the other hand many GMOs no longer need any chemical insecticides. Do as you see fit but I think that I'll take my chances on GMOs and leave the side order of pesticides and poisons for others to eat.

 

[matt44644]

So which is worse GMO seeds from Monsanto or the organic pesticides from Monsanto ?

 

[pdirt]

Quote:
You often inspire me to go research stuff!

Neem oil doesn't appear to be all that toxic, but it is a poison and should be handled/used carefully:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neem_oil#Toxicity

Compound 1080 is listed as being used in the USA as method for killing coyotes. Is there another use you know of, meaning one that is direct application to crops?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_fluoroacetate#United_States


I can't find anything online about Rounote. Can you point me in a direction?


The USDA Organic deal that went down (around about 1990?) was a mixed bag. Organics are more available now, but the Organic standard was greatly diluted, such as some very toxic substances being allowed. The old-school organic farmers would never have used such substances. I agree that some of the Organic products are a joke...you have to know the practices of each company/farm. Some are not worth buying, IMO, they may be Organic in name, but they took all the shortcuts allowed them by the new USDA Organic standard they can. I admit that I don't know what percentage of organic produce nationwide has been sprayed with said highly toxic substances. I would love to know. But overall, I still think much of the organic products are healthier, on average. Even the diluted Organic standard still requires some amount of soil building and crop rotation and prohibit chemical fertilizers. Compost, manures, fish sludge, etc are allowed. Makes for a generally more nutritious end result.

This is not to say that all Conventional produce is garbage. Far from it. There are farmers doing things without using the most toxic substances and don't mono-crop in the same soil year after year. Perhaps some of what those farmers are doing is possibly even better than some of the worst of the Organics crops. But you'll never know unless you know the farmer/farm and their practices.

In fact, we stopped buying organic chicken feed last year. We found a new feed company that is verified non-GMO. The "word of mouth" message is that their grains/legumes are also not sprayed with pesticides. I'd love to have it tested to confirm this, though. There are a number of farmers who are starting to do this...grow organic or partially organic but not go through the expense of becoming certified. Easier for them and they can sell at a lower price than organic but higher than conventional. You just have to know who to trust and which ones are just pulling a fast one.

 

[Madviolin]

So which is worse GMO seeds from Monsanto or the organic pesticides from Monsanto ?

Lets just agree that Monsanto is bad....

 

[matt44644]

Quote: But it is easier to get rid of 2 acres of weeds with round up than a shovel!

 

[Chris09]

What your saying is that Organic farmers can use some the most toxic and dangerous pesticides manufactured by companies like Monsanto and BayerAG. Some of these pesticides are Neem oil, Landscape oil, Compound 1080, (so toxic that 1/500 of an ounce will kill a coyote in minutes) and my personal favorite Rounote, an Organic insecticide made from a tropical plant and first used by South American Indians to kill fish for human consumption. Rounote is of special concern because of its extreme toxicity to aquatic animals.

On the other hand many GMOs no longer need any chemical insecticides. Do as you see fit but I think that I'll take my chances on GMOs and leave the side order of pesticides and poisons for others to eat.

100% true...
Some of the Organic pesticides are far more dangerous than a common non-organic pesticide.

 

[Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay]

Lets just agree that Monsanto is bad....

Nope, can't agree.

 

[Cindy in PA]

Organic means grown with out pesticides not without GMO.

read most recent post by me for what i meant for those of you who did not understand what i meant.

Wrong

 

[Cindy in PA]

100% true...
Some of the Organic pesticides are far more dangerous than a common non-organic pesticide.

This may be so, however real organic farmers that I know do not routinely use pesticides at all. That is the point of real organic, you do nothing unless absolutely necessary. Best to find a local company or farmer & not depend on USDA which corrupted the organic label.