Great Pyrenees - to buy or not to buy?

[Gracellyn23]

How do you control things coming INTO your property with the electric fence?

I don't. I have a lot of wildlife around including quite a few mountain lions but my dog chases them off for the most part. I actually saw her jump on a mountain lion once. It ran away and she came back without a single scratch.
I'm also in the process of building an actual fence because I'm getting goats but it won't surround the whole property.

 

[Florida Backyard Chickens]

We have a blue heeler that is a killer to all other critters that come in the yard. The only time he killed chickens was when a stray came in the yard and taught him how. It did take a little work to break him once he got a taste, but that’s been several years ago, no problem. We also have an Australian shepherd who loves to herd them. She’s still young (15 months) but I’m not sure how aggressive she would be towards a predator.

 

[equustears]

Hi all, new to the forum. I have 27 lovely chickens, 5 goats, and one dog (friendly dingo-shepherd mix). We do have foxes, bears, and large coyowolves here. I lost one hen last summer, not sure what happened to her. The different animals mostly get along mingling in the barn. The pyrenees seems to be the most popular breed in my area (northeast ohio) for protecting herds from predators. However, the breeders I have spoken to (one a backyard breeder, and one an AKC breeder) both said their puppies' parents have killed chickens. How much of the dog's behavior is nature and how much is nurture? Also unrelated to chickens, Pyrenees are known for running off, and I don't think I can handle a dog with no recall, it would be too stressful for me if it got out and I had to chase it across town (if it survived the cars). Also, I know myself and I would not have the time or patience to devot to extensive training. (The way I trained my current dog, I told him loudly, if he peed in the house again, I was taking him back to the pound. He got the message.) My current dog is pretty good about alerting me to predators, and I imagine I could just go outside and shoot them if there was a problem. I work from home and currently sleep in the barn. While wildlife predators are a threat, I'm actually more concerned with human predators. What do you think?

Hello!
I’m in western upstate New York. I live in country also with coyotes , fox, Fischer, bear, and the usual air predators - hawks, osprey , eagles. I’m only a few miles from lake.
I have Giats, sheep, horses, geese, ducks, and chickens. I also have 2 dogs , older lab and a shep/border collie. The first year here I lose 2 hens to fox but my lab was 6 mos old and it was a very long summer. I also trained them as you did, but also when I was screaming at fox that was coming at me , determined to get my geese, he learned . Everytime I had nervous breakdown at a fox or coyote he was the warrior. My shep / border just learned as well . He covers the ground under any air predator til it leaves the property air space. Ghd geese sound the alarm anc the dogs are off. They know the boundaries by my warnings and return on command.
I’ve heard too much bad about lgd dogs. I much prefer my dog breeds especially my shep/border. The birds run towards my dogs if they bark , they know the dogs are safety . I can send you videos if you’d like. They are great dogs. I’m also older and fell last winter in the snow, my dogs got me up and in.

 

[ChicksnMore]

I was told that Pyrenees can physically stand up to coyotes due to their size and thick fur and skin. Also, goat breeders in my area swear by them. Yes my current dog is an inside dog. He does like to be outside as much as possible, and has 'asked' to sleep in the goat pen at night, but he is not cold tolerant and gets shivers quickly. But you raise a good question, maybe a second dog is not necessary.

Where I'm at we have to worry mostly about coyotes, bobcats and polecats. When we first moved here we had a large German Shepard who spent the nights outside and never had a problem. He was easy to train to leave chickens alone...he just went with me everywhere from puppyhood and liked to help me with my chicken duties by eating their poop.

I think with proper training and starting with a puppy...most dogs can be trained easily if you pick your puppy carefully. Pick your breed and don't buy a puppy until you find one thats calm, makes good eye contact and responds to voices. The dogs temperament is more important then the breed.

When my Shepard died, I went without a guard dog for a year and lost an entire coop of over 20 chickens. The coyote killed everyone of them, bit the heads off and ate just the heads....it left their bodies just lying there. I don't think I could have had a big enough flock to "handle some loss". It killed every single bird.

So I went to the pound and got a new puppy. An Australian shepherd mix with nice thick fur. Shes good sized but smaller then a German Shepard, so I also got a puppy from a neighbor...an Akita...again, nice thick coats. I raised them together and always took them with me to do my chores and they also grew up to be trust worthy with chickens etc. I can lock them in with my birds and never worry. With 2 dogs they're safe from coyotes. Most coyotes are running around solo and won't mess with two mid sized dogs.

I lost more animals during the dogs training year because they slept inside that first year. Because their first year was spent always at my side...they never got to make a mistake that was to fun to give up later and pleasing me means a lot to them. They'll run down and kill wildlife when they can. But they never hurt anything that's domesticated.

Since they started spending the nights outside, I haven't lost a single animal. That's been 10 years with these two.

 

[baah]

Hi all, new to the forum. I have 27 lovely chickens, 5 goats, and one dog (friendly dingo-shepherd mix). We do have foxes, bears, and large coyowolves here. I lost one hen last summer, not sure what happened to her. The different animals mostly get along mingling in the barn. The pyrenees seems to be the most popular breed in my area (northeast ohio) for protecting herds from predators. However, the breeders I have spoken to (one a backyard breeder, and one an AKC breeder) both said their puppies' parents have killed chickens. How much of the dog's behavior is nature and how much is nurture? Also unrelated to chickens, Pyrenees are known for running off, and I don't think I can handle a dog with no recall, it would be too stressful for me if it got out and I had to chase it across town (if it survived the cars). Also, I know myself and I would not have the time or patience to devot to extensive training. (The way I trained my current dog, I told him loudly, if he peed in the house again, I was taking him back to the pound. He got the message.) My current dog is pretty good about alerting me to predators, and I imagine I could just go outside and shoot them if there was a problem. I work from home and currently sleep in the barn. While wildlife predators are a threat, I'm actually more concerned with human predators. What do you think?

I have owned LGDs for 15 years and altho’ I first got purebred Pyrs bc of their rep as “calm & good with young children as well as livestock” (I had 3 yo twins at the time), what I personally discovered ab the Pyrs is that both of your main concerns are valid at some point or another (which is why I no longer use Prys…read on)
1). My purebred Pyrs did indeed have a wanderlust that regularly took them outside our fencing on ‘adventures’, so instilling a healthy respect for fencing at a very young age is PARAMOUNT. Once your dog is big enough to really start doing his/her job, it’s too late. At 100 lbs, a dog can pretty much do what he wants & fencing becomes a ‘suggestion’ not a hard & fast boundary; so puppyhood is the time to institute that respect. As puppies they will test fencing by digging underneath or pushing through holes or loose gates, so the best & most reliable “correction” I have found is with electricity. You can’t always physically be there every time bad behavior strikes, but electrical fencing can. That said, my mature 140lb LGD will still take a hit of electricity in pursuit of a predator…if he is after a fox or coyote, we will hear the “yip!” as he clears the fence & hits the hot wire. He always comes back after he has run off the offender, but not until he has made his way around the entire outside perimeter & peed on every living tree & bush as a reminder to any other predators not to get close. He always gives us a tired, withering look when he returns as if to say, “you 2-legged idiots…of course there’s no danger INSIDE the fencing, it’s OUTSIDE the fencing where I’m needed!” To fence train, start with puppy inside a small area that you can electrify so every time he ‘tries’ a fence, it ‘reminds’ him to stay back. It may sound a little harsh, especially with a cute puppy, but these early lessons will pay off big later. Enlarge the area over time & if you see him starting to disrespect fencing, backtrack & put him where he will get a ‘correction’ if he messes with fencing. Raising a good LGD is not a hands-off endeavour…it takes some effort in the first year +, but once you have laid down the ground rules, as the dog matures & his centuries-long breeding becomes evident, you will have a truly masterful guardian who will give both human & animap predators pause about approaching.
2). Harrassing young animals during puppyhood is part of the growing-up that all LGDs do in their first year & it’s up to you to make sure it doesn’t end tragically. That LGD puppy should never be left alone with younger weaker animals that he could harm. I made a tragic mistake one summer with a 1yo Pyr puppy & a young llama about the same age. First off, never put a dog & llama together in same pasture…llamas do not like canines & are used as guardian animals themselves so what was I thinking, right? I thought raising the 2 babies together…blahblahblah, stupid human thinking she could reverse centuries of innate breeding…I thought for sure that even if the dog chased, the llama was swift enough to get away; but I hadn’t counted on the dog’s endless energy to chase. He never caught the llama but he literally gave it heat stroke bc he constantly wanted to “play chase”. It was all a game to him & he literally wore the young inexperienced llama out. I will carry the guilt of the death of that animal to my own grave, so believe me when I tell you that a young unsupervised dog’s appetite for stalk-chase-capture, even in a supposed guardian dog, is hard wired, boundless & must be shut down early & often. Many times this can be done by having an older & experienced LGD (never worked for me…my older female just sat & watched as the younger one tried to stir up sheep) OR by only penning the young dog with older livestock who won’t put up with any misbehavior & will dominate the dog by charging it. I have a very cranky old doe who will “straighten out” almost any young canine who gets rowdy with her. She has “taught” several of my young LGDs about how not to act around livestock & while it is sometimes difficult to watch the education (she dominates by butting & sometimes rolling the dog who yipes & retreats), she has been very effective. The dog learns to walk slowly & with deference through the herd & not to make trouble. I had concerns that such treatment would produce a cowering dog, but never fear. Reliably, once mature & faced with a real predator threat, the dog & the goat traded places in the hierarchy & the dog protected the very animal that had been “schooling it” so harshly for months.
Truly amazing to witness. When my dogs were young, no mstter the breed, they ALL tried to harrass young livestock (both lambs & kids & also chickens, altho the latter could generally run faster & fly up out of reach or over fences). That said, once the dogs matures, they have been magnificently effective at keeping any sort of predator, both 4 legged & 2 legged away. An LGD is not fully mature until age 2, so there is always going to be a period of behavioral exhuberance. That’s why God made parents & consider yourself a canine parent. You don’t have to “train” an LGD to do his job, but while he’s young & maturing, you DO have to make sure he has fewer opportunities to do the wrong thing, ie: curtail him & keep him out of trouble until his brain has time to catch up to his body. Same as with human youngsters. I promise that if you do this, you will have YEARS of worry-free guardianship of your herds & flocks. There is no more perfect predator repellent on earth than a good LGD. I prefer the Akbash…a Turkish breed, same all-white coloring, curlier tail, overall bigger body, less overtly friendly than Pyr…just a little more standoffish & less of a wanderer.
Best of luck to you.

 

[ChicksnMore]

I should add that when I lost that entire coop of birds...that was in one night. If they can, they don't just grab one bird and run...they have fun. That coop was about half an acre from our house and we slept right through it. I get up early so I got to see it leaving our fenced area. It cleared a five foot fence in one clean bound. So no, just fencing won't protect your birds. The birds were also in a nice coop, locked in for the night. A determined coyote will dig and chew until it gets in if it has the time to do so.

Outside at night dogs are the best solution I've found.

 

[PhoenixinNevada]

I was born in New Philadelphia/Dover area but now live in Nevada, I raise our border collie Jindu mixes with our chickens if I see them start chasing a chicken they get scolded right away, most don't chase to kill though just to play. Might I suggest you get a really young pup to start with 6 to 8 weeks old get the vaccines yourself done, maybe a collie or even a jindu, mine are so good with my flock of chickens I have a 5 month old pup around week old chicks with mama hen if she goes near the baby chicks the hen chases her off. I have 6 dogs not one is a chicken killer knock on wood, either is the breed or starting them around chickens from birth or maybe both. But they do protect the flock from other birds,dogs and coyotes, cats, we do have big cats, no bears though.
Some dogs are just chicken killers though, can't help the prey drive I guess.? I really think starting them early as possible helps stop them from being chicken killers, keep them very well fed food available to them all the time so no need to kill a bird.

 

[baah]

One more addition to my response…a TRUE LGD always resides with the animals he is guarding, whether it be goats or sheep or chickens/other fowl. The folks who say they have LGDs who come in the house & stay with them have PETS, not LGDs. No shame there. Pets are great! I have pet dogs too, but they are not LGDs. You start off an LGD puppy living 24/7 with the animals you want it to ultimately protect so a bond is created. Bodies first, then hearts & minds.
Of course YOU want to bond with it too, but the FIRST bond has to be with the animals & not you. Therefore that dog has to live & eat & sleep with those animals, not ride in the car on errands or sleep at the foot of the bed (which is when predators are scouting your pastures, barn & coop for a meal!). You take food out to the dog when you feed your other animals. You don’t bring the dog into the yard or house to you. You pet & play with the dog in the pasture, pen or field & create a friendly companionship. But then you LEAVE the pasture, pen or field & the dog STAYS to do his job. As a puppy, it can be hard for the human to do, but the dog starts to look towards the animals in its care for companionship. I hav dogs who are closely bonded to cows (of course the cows dont need their protection, but the sheep who graze alongside the cows do!).
I don’t think Pyrs are any more or less “chicken killers” than any other young dog. Dogs just do what they do at different stages of their development & errors happen when humans mismanage the animals in their care. Please don’t villify a certain breed of anything for doing what it was bred to do. Villify the human beings who have the frontal lobes & opposable thumbs who should be making better decisions for those animals. LGDs are an investment, not a quick fix; but I promise you, they are hands down the most effective long term. It takes an animal to outwit another animal in the long run.

 

[cedar hill farm]

Hi all, new to the forum. I have 27 lovely chickens, 5 goats, and one dog (friendly dingo-shepherd mix). We do have foxes, bears, and large coyowolves here. I lost one hen last summer, not sure what happened to her. The different animals mostly get along mingling in the barn. The pyrenees seems to be the most popular breed in my area (northeast ohio) for protecting herds from predators. However, the breeders I have spoken to (one a backyard breeder, and one an AKC breeder) both said their puppies' parents have killed chickens. How much of the dog's behavior is nature and how much is nurture? Also unrelated to chickens, Pyrenees are known for running off, and I don't think I can handle a dog with no recall, it would be too stressful for me if it got out and I had to chase it across town (if it survived the cars). Also, I know myself and I would not have the time or patience to devot to extensive training. (The way I trained my current dog, I told him loudly, if he peed in the house again, I was taking him back to the pound. He got the message.) My current dog is pretty good about alerting me to predators, and I imagine I could just go outside and shoot them if there was a problem. I work from home and currently sleep in the barn. While wildlife predators are a threat, I'm actually more concerned with human predators. What do you think?

I have a Great Pyrenees with all manner of fowl! She lays in the yard and watches everyone of them! Nothing gets by her! Yes it will take a little time and training but they are great for livestock protection of any kind! They just need to be taught what is exceptable…I wouldn’t expect immediate response to commands tho…they are independent thinkers! A maybe I will,maybe I won’t attitude.

 

[Onyxflock]

Hi all, new to the forum. I have 27 lovely chickens, 5 goats, and one dog (friendly dingo-shepherd mix). We do have foxes, bears, and large coyowolves here. I lost one hen last summer, not sure what happened to her. The different animals mostly get along mingling in the barn. The pyrenees seems to be the most popular breed in my area (northeast ohio) for protecting herds from predators. However, the breeders I have spoken to (one a backyard breeder, and one an AKC breeder) both said their puppies' parents have killed chickens. How much of the dog's behavior is nature and how much is nurture? Also unrelated to chickens, Pyrenees are known for running off, and I don't think I can handle a dog with no recall, it would be too stressful for me if it got out and I had to chase it across town (if it survived the cars). Also, I know myself and I would not have the time or patience to devot to extensive training. (The way I trained my current dog, I told him loudly, if he peed in the house again, I was taking him back to the pound. He got the message.) My current dog is pretty good about alerting me to predators, and I imagine I could just go outside and shoot them if there was a problem. I work from home and currently sleep in the barn. While wildlife predators are a threat, I'm actually more concerned with human predators. What do you think?

From our Backyard chicken friends - This is the best Predator idea I've seen! Attach to a motion sensor - but this is a fun post!
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/crazy-idea-for-predator-deterrent.1443477/#post-23959719