Gun Advice - Please.

[Blooie]

I like the knockdown power of my model 99 .300 Savage. But that's just me. It does what I ask it to do. Since you are trained in gun handling I'm sure you know that in most cases familiarity with the gun and a well placed shot trump the numbers game. It's probably under-powered for something like a grizzly, but mine has taken a black bear quite nicely. I've never taken on a boar, so I can't speak to that.

 

[Toddrick]

Also consider ammo costs. A box of (20) 30-30 cartridges is almost $20, or about $1 per. Same goes for all high powered rifles pretty much. That's one reason the AR-15 (and even the AK's) are so popular, because they NORMALLY (-Obama) run <$.40 per. And obviously, the humble 22LR is the cheapest to shoot (no thanks to Obama, grrrr).

So consider carefully. I always tell people it is best to start off with a 12g pump, and a 22LR--because you will always need them around no matter what other guns you buy, and they are cheap to buy, and cheap to shoot.

Another good alternative that was touched upon earlier is a pistol caliber rifle, like a .44 or .357. The longer barrel of the rifle allows more powder to burn, propelling the bullet closer to 30-30 speed. Yet you can put the same cartridge in a handgun for personal protection (or putting down pigs I guess). The main benefit is that the ammo is cheaper than rifle cartridges, and can be shared so that you don't have to stock up on two different loads. Disadvantage is range, which isn't going to be much different than a 12g I think.

 

[duluthralphie]

Also consider ammo costs. A box of (20) 30-30 cartridges is almost $20, or about $1 per. Same goes for all high powered rifles pretty much. That's one reason the AR-15 (and even the AK's) are so popular, because they NORMALLY (-Obama) run <$.40 per. And obviously, the humble 22LR is the cheapest to shoot (no thanks to Obama, grrrr).

So consider carefully. I always tell people it is best to start off with a 12g pump, and a 22LR--because you will always need them around no matter what other guns you buy, and they are cheap to buy, and cheap to shoot.

Another good alternative that was touched upon earlier is a pistol caliber rifle, like a .44 or .357. The longer barrel of the rifle allows more powder to burn, propelling the bullet closer to 30-30 speed. Yet you can put the same cartridge in a handgun for personal protection (or putting down pigs I guess). The main benefit is that the ammo is cheaper than rifle cartridges, and can be shared so that you don't have to stock up on two different loads. Disadvantage is range, which isn't going to be much different than a 12g I think.

I have a .17hmr. It is a great "cheap" gun to shoot. The rounds are available, unlike .22 that are hard to come by here. I pay around $14 a box of 50 versus $25 for 50 22rl. ( and there is no good reason either cost so much, other than the government buying up way too much ammo)

I would not suggest a 17 for boars or bears, unless you are sitting in an armored vehicle. It is a handy gun for predators and would work well for butchering, but then it is relatively expensive for the original purchase...


A negative to the 30-30 not mentioned is the range. The range of a 30-30 is not much more than a 12ga with a slug.

 

[gawildlife]

At one time I would have said get an SKS but the day of inexpensive chinese imports is gone. You still might find them reasonable on the used market but even they seem to drying up. The reason is the ready availability of surplus 7.62x39 ammo BUT most that is not hunting or match ammo.

 

[gawildlife]

I still think the best option for original poster is an AR unless he lives in an area that bans black guns.

 

[jmmeye4]

Greetings,

I need a gun.. And I need advice.

I am former military, so I know how to operate a gun safely. But in the army they issue you a gun, and teach you how to use it.. They don't teach you how to select one!

I will be using the gun for the following.

1) Harvesting my pigs with a shot to the head
2) Home protection against animals (boar and bear potentially, but hopefully will never have to)
3) Perhaps at some point using it for hunting deer.

I am looking for a safe, affordable, and reliable gun. What should I get, and where should I get it? New or Used? What should I avoid?

Thanks,
Austin

Greetings Austin,

I am former Army and hunt (Elk and Deer). When you are culling animals you can use a much small round to kill them as you can get a better shot. Since you are familiar with the AR-15 style platform the 223 is plenty fine for culling you pigs, though you may get some back splash depending on distance, a 22lr works well also.

In order for me to fully cover any round there are several factors to think about to include animals in your area. Never shoot any Raptor bird as you will likely face jail time.

Deer- 223 - 308 is plenty but a 223 may not drop it as well but can work
Elk 308-338 is good (hard animal to kill) and distances are usually greater than 200 yards
Moose - I have heard 243 - 338 due to the the reaction of the animal (they don't like to run as much)

Black Bears - 243 - 338 is plenty with a good shot for a 243 or 338 will go through the skull, a 12 gage slug will also work possibly a 40/45 pistol but multiple shots needed (experience here) use more stopping power on any game that could kill you.
Grizzly a minimum of 300 ultra mag - 375 H&H some will say over kill but the S&W 500 (50 cal pistol) was designed to stop a charging grizzly, so the more power the better. Don't use a shotgun slug as a skull shot will just piss it off. There have been stories of charging grizzlies being shot with a round through the heart and they keep coming so put its butt on the ground the first time.

Depending on your state also gives you or restricts certain options. In Colorado you can use a AR platform to hunt with while other states you can only use a shotgun. Look-up your current gun laws to help with this.

The best home protection you can buy is one you feel comfortable with. Go to a rental range and fire off several types and realize the number one cause of at home injuries in home defense is over penetration and being unfamiliar with the weapon. So watch for over penetrating rounds like rifles, 12 gage slugs, and larger pistol calibers. Nothing can substitute for poor shot placement.

Personally, I'm a huge fan of the old 45acp, 22lr, and 30 caliber rifle rounds. A 308 can take almost any game in North America is accurate and cheap to buy. Some others will say other rounds and they are also good, it just comes down to preference. For the items you want there is no definitive go to round and would recommend three weapons. 22lr for culling, 308 for hunting and a 9mm - 45 for hunting backup and self defense. I have this and feel plenty comfortable anywhere at any time. But never forget the pucker factor of the 12 gage ratcheting for home defense.

The final thought is if you have another individual that is firing your weapons. They must be familiar with them also for not only their safety but for all others around. If this is the case I would recommend a 38/357 revolver. You can have the 38 rounds in it for those that cannot take the kick and put in the heavier rounds for hunting etc...

 

[123RedBeard]

First off we need to know where you live (or you need to know your game laws) some states prohibit rifles of any kind, some prohibit magazine capacity, some allow rifles, but only certain caliber and case length, some prohibit bottle necked cases ...

The following is all a guess based on possible "boar" ... So you probably live in the South East of the US (If you live in the USA!) Deer in the South tend to be smaller than deer up North ...

1. A .22 pistol such as a Ruger Mark III or Ruger 22/45 (or a used Ruger Mark II) will be great!

2. A 45/70 lever action such as a Marlin Guide Gun (or if you want more capacity get the "Cowboy 1895" model) plenty of power! Killed many a buffalo and bear! Although a 44 mag or 45 Colt (Marlin 1894 model) could also do the job ... A cranky or injured Boar needs lots of power to get it down!

3. Same as #2 but get light powered bullets ... Deer aren't hard to kill, just gotta hit them in the right spot! They make "Cowboy Loads" which the dress up and play cowboy games people use in their CASS competitions (low recoil makes it easier to shoot all day long, and still hit the targets!)

 

[123RedBeard]

OK, I just got done reading your "bear proofing" thread ... Sounds like your in Florida ... And that you have a legitimate concern of a bear breaking into your home, as it has been tearing through your coop walls! For deer hunting any centerfire will work (no 22 long rifle) and max magazine cap for semi-auto of five rounds ( no limit on mag cap for other action types)

I still say a 45/70 will do the job, lever action provide multiple shots quickly, a cheap way to get a 45/70 is get a single shot like a "Handy Rifle" http://www.hr1871.com/Firearms/Rifles/handiRifle.asp just make the first shot count!

More money ... But what is your families lives worth? Marlin Guide Gun http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firearms/bigbore/1895g.asp

And their "Cowboy" which is much longer, and harder to maneuver in your house, but holds more ammo! http://www.marlinfirearms.com/Firearms/Cowboy/1895Cowboy.asp

Ruger Mark III http://ruger.com/products/markIII/ take your pick ...

Here is my Mark II


Ruger 22/45 http://ruger.com/products/2245/index.html similar size and feel of the 1911 models

 

[lollipopguild]

A mosin nagant will cost you about $100. It shoots a 7.62x54R. Bolt action 5 shot. Big enough for the large game and cheap enough to leave you a budget for a .22lr pistol.

 

[yardbird88]

I agree with a 22 there affordable and can take down small pigs I have done it . I have 3 22s 1 pistol and two rifles, tarus pistol don't recommend, 22 single shot good if you have the animal penned up were you can get a close shot two the head and a SM AR 22 expensive but the best brand. As for big game I use a 30/30 lever action I've never shot a bear but I seen rounds made for it. I've shot deer with it from 50 yards and the round passes right threw it even if it hits bone. I think it holds 3 or 5 round mine is a marlin and I think it cost $300 dollars the rounds aren't cheap over a dollar a bullet. It is a short barrel gun Its shorter than a AR which I like. As for home defense you need a hand gun I went with a compact one a SM shield 40 semi auto holds 7. I went with the compact version cause you can't carry one in texas unless it's concealed. A 40 should take down anything at close range which is what handguns are for close range last resort weapon. I also have a 38 special revolver and a reminginton 270 pump 20 guage. I am also ex military infantry, grunts didn't use handguns so I'm still learning about them.