Help trouble with Bantam Cochin colors..

[kychickmom]

I have been wondering the same thing. Looking at our chicks, if you stay true to what the current genetic markers for colors are then they should not be possible. If you only get splash chicks from 2 splash parents, then we should not have gotten a look alike mottled, a silver penciled, and a pale blue. The parens are splash I have no doubt, but I wonder if one of them or both are resesive for another color. This has been making us crazy since they hatched and started to feather out.

 

[amazondoc]

Well, if we think about it for a moment we can probably figure some of this out for ourselves.

You can have blue or splash wheatens, so we can probably say that splash will not "hide" wheaten.

You can have blue or splash coppers (as in Marans), so ditto.

OTOH, I have a splash roo who has what looks like "bleed through" of slightly reddish feathers in his hackle and saddle areas. He looks like he might be carrying something. Maybe, just maybe, whatever he's hiding is codominant with splash -- so if I breed him to a hen that also has a copy of what he's carrying, maybe I'll get a color surprise.

It's an interesting puzzle!

 

[pokey]

ok, i know you explained that in layman's terms, but all that recessive homozygous bledding through carrying hidden colors stuff blows my mind after 8 hrs at work. thank goodness i can print this stuff out to study it!

 

[kychickmom]

Ok,now correct me if I am wrong but I thought the whole reason splash to splash only producing splash was because it's a homozygous gene. I thought that meant it couldn't be a co-carrier for another color. I understand the punnet squares and in theory they should only produce splash right? Does the roo or hen being mis marked or having bleed through mean that they are carring 2 homozygous genes for 2 different colors ? I didn't think it was possible in a splash bird...My head hurts now...lol

 

[amazondoc]

Quote:
My head hurts too! Chicken color genetics is a lot more complicated than dog colors.

The black/blue/splash traits occur on one genetic locus (area). And each bird can have at most two copies of the genes at this specific locus. So the bird could be bl+/bl+ (black), Bl/bl+ (blue), or Bl/Bl (splash). (The capital letter B indicate that Bl is dominant or incompletely dominant, while the + sign indicates that bl+ is the version of the gene found in wild birds).

Okay, so that covers black/blue/splash. BUT -- there are many different genetic loci (areas) which affect chicken color. For instance the Columbian trait occurs at one locus, the buff trait occurs at another locus, the wheaten trait occurs at another locus, the recessive white trait occurs at another locus, and so on. Some of these traits will sort of cooperate, so that you can see both traits -- for instance, regular Columbian birds are white and black, but you can add buff to get buff Columbian. But some traits will mask other traits -- for instance, I know of a specific hen who is recessive white, but she is carrying the buff trait and will produce buff chicks.

IOW, there are lots and lots of ways the color traits in chickens can interact -- and I am just BARELY beginning to figure them out!

 

[tadkerson]

Quote:
Two blue genes cause the splash color. The blue genes only work on black pigment so where ever a bird would be black the two blue genes dilute the black pigment to a white or very light gray color. The other color (red or buff) should not be effected by the two blue genes. The buff color is caused by 5 or 6 different genes so buff color is actually a polygenetic trait. No one gene causes the buff color.

Tim

 

[cochin44]

What about the "white" gene? can you mix whites with blacks or blues? How does this work?

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Does splash (or blue, or black, for that matter) always cover anything else?

No​

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

codominant with splash

No! Dominant/Recessive is among the alleles of a single specific gene locus only! Bl is dominant to bl; C is dominant to c, E is dominant to e+; Pg is dominant to pg+; etc. Bl is NOT dominant or recessive or anything else to c or e+ or pg+ or to any other gene locus.

Every chicken has two copies of every gene locus (except for the sex linked genes--the females have only one copy). Whichever allele of the two copies of one gene locus is dominant takes precedence in creating the phenotype (appearance). In cases like blue, which is incompletely dominant, there is a difference in the expression of a homozygot (2 copies of the same allele) versus a heterozygot (1 copy). However all the genes present in the bird (the genotype) work together to create the phenotype. Some genes enhance (darken, brighten) the pigment caused by other colours, and other genes dilute that pigment. Some genes extend the pigment into additional areas on the bird (such as colouring the hackles or breast) and others restrict (remove) the pigment from certain areas. Some genes and combinations of genes cause patterns on individual feathers.

Genes don't work like mixing paint. White is essentially an OFF switch that prevents pigment from being placed in the feathers. An otherwise genetically blue (or buff or wheaten or BBR) bird who also has white will not display the blue (or buff or wheaten or BBR) phenotype. If the bird is recessive white, it will be completely white; if dominant white, without additional modifiers it will be largely, but not completely white.

A bird who has both blue and red is not purple; it has both blue and red feathers in different areas, Depending on the specific genes, it could be different feathers on different parts of the body (blue red), or it could be different parts of the pattern on individual feathers (blue laced red).​

 

[nzpouter]

I think what you call splash could possibly be a blue mottle.

Post a pic of the parent, we'll see.....