help with deep litter method (pics too)

[biteme2134]

Hey I'm converting to the deep litter method - the rain beat me...

Background: I had 2-4 inches of sand put in the run last year and it has slowly been washed around and now it's a mud pit.... feel free to use these pictures in later arguments against sand...

So below is my coop after some Georgia rain:




So my plan is to start this deep litter method everyone likes...

I think I can get some pine shavings from tractor supply and fill about 6 inches deep with around 10 bags - which will cost me $60 - $70.
I went to my woods to load up on forest stuff to put on top. So my question is this, will this work? Can I skip the TSC pine shavings and just use my forest floor and fill up my run?

Here's what I dug out today: (it's a little of everything)




What do you guys think? Anything will help

 

[Bradfordj]

Should be lots of bugs and goodies in there. Outdoor runs don't have to be shavings or sand or anything specific. Raised and dry is best. Moist conditions is very good for coccidiosis.

 

[biteme2134]

Should be lots of bugs and goodies in there. Outdoor runs don't have to be shavings or sand or anything specific. Raised and dry is best. Moist conditions is very good for coccidiosis.

So you think I can just fill up the run with tons of this kind of forestry? Saves me money and it seems too easy

 

[Bradfordj]

I'm sure someone somewhere will find some reason why this might not be good, but let's be realistic. If a chicken was wild would it only find sand or or deforested areas that happen to have a lot of shavings? What do chickens enjoy most? Pecking around finding bugs weeds plant life ect. Personally I think it's a great idea. My recommendation though would be to build it up high and keep it dry. Moist or wet conditions are prime for parasites and bacteria to grow. I bet there is tons of protein in there (bugs) chickens love that and the more natural protein and the more balances their diet, the less feed you have to supply. I say giver and enjoy the free things nature has to offer.

 

[Bradfordj]

All that stuff will decompose too, add the chicken manure they will add for you, you can take a few inches off the top to clean it and throw it the garden. That'll be the best fertilizer/organic matter with micro nutrients a garden could ask for. Chicken manure is one the best fertilizers possible. Of course that only helps if you or.someone you know gardens lol

 

[eviemethugh]

Anything you put in there looks like it will just wash away because of the location of the coop. One of our runs is red clay, but it doesn't hold water like your photos show. So your forest find *could* work, I think the chickens will have a great time in it. But I wouldn't put it in while everything is so wet, and it will probably still wash away so you will have some upkeep. I don't know that you will ever truly have deep litter just because of the wash out.
If your forest find is mostly leaves you should have a pretty great base for composting the chicken droppings, if it is mostly pine needles it may not be absorb-y enough on its own.

 

[biteme2134]

I'm sure someone somewhere will find some reason why this might not be good, but let's be realistic. If a chicken was wild would it only find sand or or deforested areas that happen to have a lot of shavings? What do chickens enjoy most? Pecking around finding bugs weeds plant life ect. Personally I think it's a great idea. My recommendation though would be to build it up high and keep it dry. Moist or wet conditions are prime for parasites and bacteria to grow. I bet there is tons of protein in there (bugs) chickens love that and the more natural protein and the more balances their diet, the less feed you have to supply. I say giver and enjoy the free things nature has to offer.

That'd a good point. I definitely have enough of it to fill up the run!

 

[biteme2134]

Anything you put in there looks like it will just wash away because of the location of the coop. One of our runs is red clay, but it doesn't hold water like your photos show. So your forest find *could* work, I think the chickens will have a great time in it. But I wouldn't put it in while everything is so wet, and it will probably still wash away so you will have some upkeep. I don't know that you will ever truly have deep litter just because of the wash out.
If your forest find is mostly leaves you should have a pretty great base for composting the chicken droppings, if it is mostly pine needles it may not be absorb-y enough on its own.

I don't see much outside of standing water normally. The water doesn't make a stream or anything so it shouldn't move any of the material around.
If it isn't absorbent enough I can always add shavings later right? How would I know if it's not absorbent enough?

 

[yellowchicks]

I don't see much outside of standing water normally. The water doesn't make a stream or anything so it shouldn't move any of the material around.
If it isn't absorbent enough I can always add shavings later right? How would I know if it's not absorbent enough?

It is strange the only the run is full of water, all the surrounding grass is clear. It doesn't look like the run is in a particular low-lying area either. So my guess is that the substrate does not have the most permeable soil, and the surface where the coop and run are sitting do not have a natural slope to drain the surface runoff. Therefore, most of the rain water is being trapped inside the wooded frames of the run, like a pool.

The quick solution would be put a roof over the top of the run so that the ground surface will not be as saturated. Otherwise, the deep litter will not work well either, it will smell when wet.

Next is to slope the bottom of the run by adding more top soil around the coop, re-grade the soil so that the surface would slope away from the coop toward the perimeter of the run. Drill some drain holes on the "low" outer sides of the wooden frame so the water can drain out, not drain in from the yard, so you will have to look at the surrounding topography. Seal the holes with 1/2 hardware cloth.

Before you throw more bedding material in the run, put a 8" to 12" high strip of 1/2" or 1/4" hardware cloth along the outer bottom perimeter of the run, tie it right onto the current fence, but offset the holes. This will act a permeable and invisible "shield" to keep most of the deep litter inside the run and not make a mess of your lawn when chickens scratching inside. Then you put down whatever bedding material you want to do deep litter on top.

My coop and run are in a low-lying area of my yard, but that's the only feasible spot to put them. Every time there is a big rain, all the surrounding area will be ponding with an inch or more water, and yet the deep litter (pine shaving) in the run is only just slightly moist. The reason is that we put down a 1/2" hardware cloth on the bottom of the run, secured it to the frame. It was intended as a predator deterrence, and yet the hardware cloth also serves as a strainer to hold the pine shaving above dry, so the pine shaving won't "melt away" into the mud.

So if after you put up a roof and re-graded the dirt floor but the run is still very wet, then install a mesh bottom beneath to hold up the deep litter layer. The chickens will be fine scratching around not bother by the wires as you build up the deep litter.

 

[biteme2134]

It is strange the only the run is full of water, all the surrounding grass is clear. It doesn't look like the run is in a particular low-lying area either.  So my guess is that the substrate does not have the most permeable soil, and the surface where the coop and run are sitting do not have a natural slope to drain the surface runoff. Therefore, most of the rain water is being trapped inside the wooded frames of the run, like a pool.

The quick solution would be put a roof over the top of the run so that the ground surface will not be as saturated. Otherwise, the deep litter will not work well either, it will smell when wet.

Next is to slope the bottom of the run by adding more top soil around the coop, re-grade the soil so that the surface would slope away from the coop toward the perimeter of the run. Drill some drain holes on the "low" outer sides of the wooden frame so the water can drain out, not drain in from the yard, so you will have to look at the surrounding topography. Seal the holes with 1/2 hardware cloth.

Before you throw more bedding material in the run, put a 8" to 12" high strip of 1/2" or 1/4" hardware cloth along the outer bottom perimeter of the run, tie it right onto the current fence, but offset the holes. This will act a permeable and invisible "shield" to keep most of the deep litter inside the run and not make a mess of your lawn when chickens scratching inside. Then you put down whatever bedding material you want to do deep litter on top.

My coop and run are in a low-lying area of my yard, but that's the only feasible spot to put them. Every time there is a big rain, all the surrounding area will be ponding with an inch or more water, and yet the deep litter (pine shaving) in the run is only just slightly moist. The reason is that we put down a 1/2" hardware cloth on the bottom of the run, secured it to the frame. It was intended as a predator deterrence, and yet the hardware cloth also serves as a strainer to hold the pine shaving above dry, so the pine shaving won't "melt away" into the mud.

So if after you put up a roof and re-graded the dirt floor but the run is still very wet, then install a mesh bottom beneath to hold up the deep litter layer. The chickens will be fine scratching around not bother by the wires as you build up the deep litter.

Thanks! I did think of drilling some holes in the wood base to let some water drain out so that's on my to do list. The current fence is 1/2 hardware cloth so it should hold all the material from escaping. I would love a roof but cost wise I don't think I can do it any time soon. Which leaves me with an open run. I'm wondering if it will work to put the material over the mud. I can walk on the mud mess without sinking more than an inch or so. So I would think the flooring would do about the same right?
Could I load it down with forest materials thenmmaybe put 2 or 3 inches of pine shavings on top? The birds will stir it anyway right?