Hen with swollen legs after death of another in flock

[Lyranonamous]

Hi

My older hen Lizzie died Tues night from impacted crop and probably other complications. I will post more later about this, after info from the necropsy. She had swollen toes on one foot. The vet looked at it. It did not seem like an abscess.
Now one of my younger chickens has very, very swollen ankles and legs on both sides. I'm not noticing this on any other chickens, but will do an more thorough inspection after this.

She is a Speckled Sussex, 2.5 yrs old. She is walking, went into the run with the others, and was interested in sesame seeds. Other than the legs her behavior seems normal.
If I need the vet I would have to do that today, so any help is appreciated.
Thanks again

 

[Lyranonamous]

I am a bit skeptical about the vets thinking it was avian leukosis—osteopetrosis or marble bone disease. It is a pretty rare disease. Did they do any testing yet, or are they just going by the picture of the swollen ankles? I think they can only get the leukosis diagnosis with a necropsy on a dead bird, where they look for tumors and test them. Back in my posts, I think 11 and 12, I posted pictures of what osteopetrosis looked like in comparison to MS or gout. Osteopetrosis causes thick legs that are hard and marble-like. MS causes swelling in just the joints. The vet can draw blood from the chickens (or just one of them)and send it off to a poultry testing lab for PCR testing for mycoplasma synoviae or MS. It looks like they would do that first.

MS is a fairly common disease, and it is contagious to other flock members. I don’t think that all birds will have symptoms, though they might be carriers.

Here in post 4 are some pictures of osteopetrosis where you can see the whole leg is involved, while the feet and ankles are normal or small:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/large-deformed-legs.1018149/

Thanks everyone for your support. It's been a tough week. I have learned more about chickens than I imagined.
I think I got the chicks from Agway. They were raised by my broody Jersey Giant. I don't know what I will do without her.
We live in Ithaca and we have an exotic animal vet at Briar Patch Vet who treats chickens, and thankfully she loves them. There is another vet quite close to our house (Adana Vet) who also treats chickens, and we live near Cornell which also treats chickens. We are lucky in this regard.
I too am skeptical about the diagnosis-mostly because if it's so rare, how likely can it be that two hens show symptoms within one day of each other. I'm not sure how hatcheries or Agway gets their chicks, but it doesn't seem likely they are from the same mother. They are very different colors and patterns if that means anything in SS.
For my girls the whole leg is involved -including under the leg feathers, and the feet look pretty normal. But I'm going to ask for a blood test anyway. That is an excellent suggestion. We will all learn something from this. Does anyone know the exact blood test (or panel) I should ask for?
I remember the photos that you posted, and I ruled out gout. I am going to post photos of the girls' legs today. Some of the swelling has gone down just a little.
I decided on a necropsy for Lizzie who I though had sour crop. It turns out she had chronic egg yolk coelomitis. I think this is one of the only ways we all can learn.

 

[Eggcessive]

The swollen ankles look like possible bacterial synovitis, and mycoplasma synovitis (or MS)is the most common type. There is no cure, but Tylan and tetracycline drugs sometimes are used to treat it. I believe that @TwoCrows has some experience with it. It causes breast blisters on the keel bone sometimes and swelling of the hocks as well. Here is some reading about the disease:
https://www.merckvetmanual.com/poultry/mycoplasmosis/mycoplasma-synoviae-infection-in-poultry

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/diseaseinfo/99/mycoplasma-synoviae-infection-ms-infectious-synovitis/

 

[TwoCrows]

Sorry your bird is suffering here!

It does appear to me to be MS, synovial fluid drains down the tendon sheaths and pools in the hocks, foot joints and foot pads. I have MS in my flock. (I say "have" because even though you beat the bacteria down and heal the birds, they carry this bacteria the rest of their days.)

The only medications that will treat MS is Denagard, Baytril or Doxycycline. I had no luck with Denagard, although some people have. It depends on the severity and in your case, this is quite severe. I had to use both Baytril and Doxycycline combined to heal my birds, along with a daily bumblefoot surgery to drain the fluid out. Not all birds with MS will drain into the foot pad. If you see what looks like a scab on the bottom of the pad, then yes it is draining. If you can do a surgery, it will help them greatly. If I didn't do a surgery daily, the birds that were most effected could not walk and were lame.

Some people will suggest you cull the flock with MS because it is VERY difficult to treat. If possible, a vet can take a blood sample for MS to find out if they do in fact have MS.

Baytril is not listed for use in poultry anymore so I won't insist you use it, but it was the only drug along with Doxycycline that healed my flock. For a 5 to 7 pound bird, the doses were 1/2 of a 22.7 mg Baytril 2 times daily, along with 50mg of Doxycycline capsule 2 times daily until all swelling is gone. A daily bumblefoot surgery on birds with drainage in the pads. You don't HAVE to do a surgery on them, they can heal over, but if the bird is lame, this will get them moving again.

If you have never done a bumblefoot surgery, this article describes how to perform one. Scroll down to Bumblefoot. There is also a section on MS too.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/leg-foot-and-toe-issues-in-poultry-of-all-ages.68093/

Good luck and keep us posted!

 

[Eggcessive]

Where did the speckled sussex come from? Is it possible they could have picked up the infection from a previous home or breeder, and it is just now showing up? Most of mycoplasma infections (as well as other infectious diseases) come from a carrier bird, and the chicken can have the disease in a latent form. When stress occurs, say during a molt or cold winter weather, some may start showing symptoms.

 

[Lyranonamous]

Hi everyone. Here's an update on my hens with swollen/deformed legs. After leg x-rays showed no signs of bone deformation (which the vet fully expected) I quarantined them for about a week, then I put them back with the others. That was at least a month ago (maybe 6 weeks) and so far no other hens have any signs of leg problems. The vets are at a loss, and they think it's still possible it's the viral cancer and my girls will go downhill at some point. However, they still show no signs of being uncomfortable, they jump off the roosting pole and saw horses like all the others.
The vet at Briar Patch said there were more tests we could do, but I felt they had been through enough and the added stress wasn't helping them.
I still don't have an answer to this. I'm going to wait and keep watching them.
Thanks to everyone for your support and suggestions through a really tough time.

 

[Eggcessive]

Hens with mycoplasma synovitis can get around fairly well and get up and down from roosts. I was really hoping that one of the vets would draw some blood to do the PCR test for MS. Have you spoken with or emailed anyone from Cornell about the possibility? Someday when one of them gets old and passes away, hopefully a long time from now, I would get a necropsy by the state vet where they can test for it. Thank you for the update, and glad they are doing well.

 

[TwoCrows]

Thank you . No fire ants here. Would bumble foot affect both legs?

Bumblefoot will not cause this sort of swelling. Bumblefoot generally remains in the foot pad, if it gets bad enough the bacteria can go systemic and travel all throughout the bird, eventually killing it.

 

[Lyranonamous]

Update; We now have another Speckled Sussex with swollen legs....so far all vets are at a loss.We just got back from the vet for the second one.
What I know so far- legs are hot, and my vet tried to draw the fluid out of the first sick one, and there is no fluid. The swelling goes up the bone, beyond the feathers-so it's not scaly leg mites. The second chicken is swollen mainly in the joints. My vet has been collaborating with another Cornell vet and he suspected heart problems..... But now that another Speckled Sussex affected so that rules out heart. It does not look like Marek's at all.

I did ask about MS-(thanks TwoCrows) it does not appear to be that but still waiting for answer from Dr. Jarra Jagne, who isn't in the country now.
SO FAR it has only affected Speckled Sussex chickens and has not affected my Jersey Giant, Welsummer or Silver Laced Wyandotte. That could be just chance-I have 6 SS, so more than other breeds. (I ordered the SS chicks at the same time-so maybe they were not vaccinated against something)
Of course the the chances of a SS getting infected are greatest bc that's mostly what I have, but any other SS people on here have anything similar?
I'm posting the photos of the newly affected chicken. Any ideas?
We have considered: the "new " feed has too much protein and we are switching back to old feed.
or the sunflower seeds or the new bag of worms is somehow contaminated. (mold or?) We are stopping these.
Anyone have something like this?

 

[Eggcessive]

It’s good that you have the professionals working on an answer. The needle aspiration could have gotten a few cells to look at under a microscope for a gram stain or to get a PCR test. I have never had to deal with it before.

Most things that cause swelling in the legs are bacterial infection (including MS,) articular gout, and marble leg syndrome, a type of avian leukosis. All 3 look different. Gout causes swelling of both the feet and legs. Marble leg causes a thick hardened leg with normal looking feet. Synovitis including MS causes the ankles to appear swoolen and firm. Below and on the next post are pictures of each one.

Marble leg disease (leukosis)