Heritage - Broad Breast crosses

Oregon Gray is what you were looking for. OSU discontinued the project, birds were scattered, Porter's picked some up, then he tinkered with them and made more colors, if I recall correctly.

All turkey breeds are "meat" birds since Europe got them in the 1500s, excepting the Palms. No one has ever undertaken making the Leghorn turkey that I've heard of (though it's a worthy project because turkey eggs are so tasty). All "smaller" varieties intended for smaller ovens fail and nearly go extinct (MW and the Beltsville before it) because it's commercially better to breed a huge, versatile turkey then slaughter it earlier for those "small oven" people.

I think it's interesting how America has chicken breeds for all kinds of purposes but hasn't gotten onboard with doing the same for turkeys, even though they were kept by the Aztecs mostly for feathers (they had a turkey god, too!). Turkeys haven't been domesticated as long as chickens, which certainly plays a role, but I hate that they're typecast as table birds when they have more potential.
Thanks for mentioning the Oregon Gray (can't always remember the exact names of these past breeds) another functional meat bird gone by the wayside. I personally see a resurgence of interest in responsibly sourced foods and posts here on Backyard Chicken reflect that. More and more people are desiring to eat fresh and know where their food is coming from, even if all they do about it is grow a few squash and tomatoes and have a few hens. It is the dawn of a new day, I think. Hopefully, the result will be a resurgence of interest in older breeds that are suitable for the small holder that wants to know where his food comes from and takes a hands on approach to eating fresh. I believe the Midget White is alive and doing well. Not certain about the Beltsville. I have trouble calling Heritage Turkeys meat birds because they don't have much meat. Probably of all the breeds the Midget White is best suited for small holders and I think demand is up for them. They really are a functional meat bird and pretty cute too! Really liked your pictures of your MW crossbreds, they are beautiful. Maybe next year I'll get some of those. People do raise them and they are available. I'm afraid that turkeys will never be able to compete with any of the chicken breeds when it comes to laying eggs though. Chickens are much easier to raise, cheaper to feed and care for, less susceptible to diseases and have a much longer laying period and much earlier maturity. I can't really see much difference in taste between turkey and chicken eggs, though there might be some. I have eaten some of mine, but will be glad when the chickens I have mature and start laying.
When I was young (a long time ago) few people kept chickens, everyone wanted to get everything from the grocery store. Admittedly, many of those people grew up on farms and were glad to escape the hard work. I had pet chickens at that time and was one of only a few in my small hometown that did. Now, there are so many everywhere! I think it is a good thing.
 
Most heritage breeds went nearly extinct by the 1990s, and they're still struggling to come back from that. Think in terms of percentage compared to commercial BBW. The overwhelming population of turkeys is commercial, which is bad for biodiversity and the species. Bringing them back from near extinction required a lot of intensive breeding and led to a lot of faults persisting when the afflicted birds really should've been culled. Traits like progressive blindness in slate turkeys (especially lavender hens--traced back to another university husbandry program, which was also scrapped). I've seen that same trait show up in other breeds now too, and it's a heartbreaking nasty.

Other traits, like aggression, breeders can't even agree on as detrimental. Some people seriously argue in favor of the closest creature to a living velociraptor becoming more aggressive... because it's a good thing for a thirty-pound bird with sharp implements that travels in groups to hate your guts. Commercial breeders kicked that trait to the curb because they're at least smart enough to know that breeding aggression into a bird that could grow to nearly ninety pounds hating you and turning on you as a mob with thousands of its peers is catastrophically stupid.

I really enjoy turkeys. They're like having pet dinosaurs.

It's not that heritage are underwhelming meat birds, but that the BBW has become that engineered as a meat bird over the last century. Turkeys used to be prized for taste more than mass and were "self-basting" and "fit for kings" once upon a time. What they've gained in mass and speed, they've lost in flavor (and fitness). There's nothing wrong with heritage birds, even if they aren't the Arnold Schwarzeneggers of the species in terms of chest dimensions. Age adds flavo, especially to dark meat.

Chickens used to take longer to reach weight and lay, too. High quality birds--especially of larger breeds like Orpingtons and Brahmas--can take just as long to lay and still won't generally be as large as a small turkey.
 
Well, I don't think any of us know what it would be like to have pet dinosaurs, though think I came closer with the emu birds than the turkeys (and probably it is a darn good thing we don't know what it would be like). Feel free to create an egg laying strain of turkeys if you want... We all are free to have our opinions and do our own thing. I'll cheer you on and wish you good luck with that! In the meantime, I will be working on a turkey that is somewhere in the middle between the extremes of so giant that it can't support it's own weight or live past 2 or 3 years, or breed naturally, and a bird that is basically skin and bones on the table and will fly the coop and return to the wild. And yes, IMO, Heritage birds have become underwhelming meat birds, thanks to human intervention and so have the BB's. Time to find a happy medium.
 
And then there is the Cassowary! I think this might be the closest to a Velociraptor... They are reputed to be quite dangerous and most videos are from afar, but this one is apparently tame and used to being handled, so posting it here because there is so much close up footage. It is a beautiful bird, but note the toenail on that inside toe... Coloring reminds me of my black Spanish tom.
 
Well, it has come to my attention over reading the threads and seeing all the pics, that most people succeeding with this have more turkeys to choose from... I think the heritage toms must be larger than the one I am using. It did not occur to me that a successful breeding might require not just a smaller Tom but one that is enough bigger than the BB hens to be successful. Anyway, that is my conclusion for the year. Though, by next year, Arpy, my Royal Palm, may have gained more weight, and be more able to pull this off. In the meantime, though, my BB's will be older and stiffer and less fertile and able, possibly...

Meanwhile, my BBB Bridget, has 2 little feedstore foster kids to raise. They must be at least 3 wks old but are quite small. They are independent little fellows and like to free range, but took to new mom right away. Don't think they were bonding with anyone at the feed store, and care there might not have been the best. They are supposed to be BBB's but they don't look or act like it. They are actually quite smart, figured out the feed and water within a day, but like to free range around the coop, picking at this and that. One is more adventurous and doesn't seem to care if the other one goes or not. I am thinking they might be heritage bronze put in with the BB's to show them what to do. They were down to the last 4 poults at the feed store, and I'm sure those buying BB's would tend to take the largest ones... Bridget talks to them and broods them, but seems still reluctant to leave the nest, but they don't seem to care, they know their way back and return to rest and snuggle. So it is all working out. They seem smart and healthy and don't eat like a BB either. Going to have to poult proof my pen since they are so small, afraid they might get out somewhere... Didn't plan on them being quite so adventurous so soon! I'm going to pick-up some Bourbon/Narragansett Heritage birds "from show quality lines" (what ever that means). In a few weeks. I don't like Bourbon reds all that much, but the red gene is in all my favorite turkey colors...
 
Yeah I think success for crosses requires a larger tom. As I've stated my royal palm Tom is way oversized for breed standard being 26lbs.... Bourbon reds are a great base for the red gene since that's all they are lol. I do love the red gene but hate bourbon reds lol. Everyone has narri's royal palms or bourbon reds. I tend to avoid those because of that lol. I'm sticking with black wing bronze based birds because I love the pencilling. I do need some more red tho for my breeding program. Got really lucky and got a true red palm hen this year, less than 3% chance.
 
Yeah I think success for crosses requires a larger tom. As I've stated my royal palm Tom is way oversized for breed standard being 26lbs.... Bourbon reds are a great base for the red gene since that's all they are lol. I do love the red gene but hate bourbon reds lol. Everyone has narri's royal palms or bourbon reds. I tend to avoid those because of that lol. I'm sticking with black wing bronze based birds because I love the pencilling. I do need some more red tho for my breeding program. Got really lucky and got a true red palm hen this year, less than 3% chance.
Wow, that is lucky! Post some pics if you get a chance! I love the penciling, too, really wanting a penciled sweetgrass. Are you saying you can't get penciling without a black-winged bronze base? I notice many of Porter's birds seem to be black winged bronze based... Regarding large Royal Palms, the people I got my Royal Palm from has the largest one I have ever seen, he must stand 3 feet tall at least... can't guess his weight exactly because he was always strutting, never stopped. He is not related to my Tom, though, they bought him with 2 others all supposed to be hens for their Tom, then he turned out to be a Tom. Mine is about 1/2 the size of that guy, more like a normal size Royal Palm might be. The 2 hens they had were about 1/2 the size of my Tom so about 1/4 the size of the huge Tom. They actually had some poults hatched by a hen, but predators got them all while they were on vacation. They do have another hen setting, due in a couple of weeks. When I first saw their Tom, I really thought he was a BB cross of some kind, he is so abnormally large. Hoping to pick up a few of those, too, if I can talk her out of them. She did say to call back...
 

New posts New threads Active threads

Back
Top Bottom