Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[LeslieDJoyce]

...

Based on my experience with the breed, other breeds in this class, and twenty years of evaluating how different birds perform, I have my clear and defined Standard. Birds of this type should weigh 5 1/2 pounds live weight in 12-14 wks. They should have a reasonable carcass at this age. Rocks would be later, Javas later still. They should also come into lay @ 20-22 wks, and lay 180-220 large to extra large light brown eggs. That is neither impractical or unrealistic. Those are realistic expectations.

...

I've probably asked you this before, because I ask this question a lot, but I don't recall anyone has ever answered it: Do you know of any birds achieving those weights in that time and also laying like that? Any breed/strain/line will do except any of the commercial hybrids (and by "commercial hybrids I do mean the "slow growing" pasturable but proprietary hybrids like Freedom Rangers, etc.). Obviously, sources for these birds would also be important info. People tend to ask me these questions; I'd love to be able to help people find what they're looking for.

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

Going to a different breed can be done, but requires even more caution. Ideally you'd want to use something that the breed was created with, or as close as you can get (if you're trying to do something like a new variety). With the Delawares for instance, it makes zero sense to outcross to Columbian anything, Delawares are NOT supposed to have color in male saddle. Now if there were decent Light Sussex out there that might make a little more sense due to them being on wheaten base pattern and therefore not having that color in the saddle. However that introduces the problem of white skin, which is dominant, so it would take two generation to get rid of, there's some type variance as well that would take a couple years to fix.

This right here is one of the reasons why I enjoy talking chicken with @BGMatt

People tend to offer unsolicited advice in the "Why don't you just ...!" argumentative tone. And after talking to Matt I have some handy answers.

Judging from the number of places people can buy Delawares with white legs, I'm assuming Light Sussex has been well-tested in various Delaware breeding programs. I do really like the overall shape and heft of a nice Sussex, but besides the skin color, they're also a bit, well, dumpier than what I'm going for with the Delawares.

 

[NanaKat]

Feel the need to plug the Wyandotte here...a nice dual purpose breed.
Slow to develop but laying by 7 months with 3 to 5 eggs per week.
Plump by 16 weeks with a nice carcass.
I like my Columbian, Black, Blue while others like the Silver laced and Partridge.
Docile and inquisitive. Free-range well and the hens are great mothers.

 

[3riverschick]

w

 

[3riverschick]

This right here is one of the reasons why I enjoy talking chicken with @BGMatt

People tend to offer unsolicited advice in the "Why don't you just ...!" argumentative tone. And after talking to Matt I have some handy answers.

Judging from the number of places people can buy Delawares with white legs, I'm assuming Light Sussex has been well-tested in various Delaware breeding programs. I do really like the overall shape and heft of a nice Sussex, but besides the skin color, they're also a bit, well, dumpier than what I'm going for with the Delawares.

dumpier! Dumpier!!

Humph! Well, I never!

Sussex are not dumpy. They are "well virtued" in depth and breath of body.

Dorkings were well used in their genetic background. Humph, I m going to take my toys and go sit in the corner and sulk.

Karen

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

dumpier! Dumpier!!

Humph! Well, I never!

Sussex are not dumpy. They are "well virtued" in depth and breath of body.

Dorkings was well used in their genetic background. Humph, I m going to take my toys and go sit in the corner and sulk.

Karen

 

[finnfur]

Absolutely don't want the Dumpies in the Delaware's - It would be tragic.

 

[3riverschick]

Ok this is new and interesting:
Avian Egg Odour Encodes Information on Embryo Sex, Fertility and Development
Ben Webster, William Hayes, Thomas W. Pike
Published: January 28, 2015
http://dx.doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0116345
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0116345
Excerpt: "This is the first study to characterise the volatile chemicals given off by developing bird eggs and show that these volatiles convey ecologically relevant information on the developmental status of the embryo. Whether or not these volatiles play a role in mediating parental incubation behaviour or embryo-embryo communication remains to be determined, however, and future work should address this, for example by employing artificial eggs emitting volatile blends based on those identified."
( Karen: This stuff is real technical so I read the abstract and the "discussion" at the end.)
Best,
Karen

 

[finnfur]

Ok this is new and interesting:
Avian Egg Odour Encodes Information on Embryo Sex, Fertility and Development
Ben Webster, William Hayes, Thomas W. Pike
Published: January 28, 2015
http://dx.doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0116345
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0116345
Excerpt: "This is the first study to characterise the volatile chemicals given off by developing bird eggs and show that these volatiles convey ecologically relevant information on the developmental status of the embryo. Whether or not these volatiles play a role in mediating parental incubation behaviour or embryo-embryo communication remains to be determined, however, and future work should address this, for example by employing artificial eggs emitting volatile blends based on those identified."
( Karen: This stuff is real technical so I read the abstract and the "discussion" at the end.)
Best,
Karen

Is the interpretation that we will be able to someday buy a little "odor meter" to determine;
1. Is it fertile ?
2. What sex it is ?
Wonder what that gadget will cost ? But it would be great so I don't need to candle anymore- but I like the surprise of the hatch gender.

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

Is the interpretation that we will be able to someday buy a little "odor meter" to determine;
1. Is it fertile ?
2. What sex it is ?
Wonder what that gadget will cost ? But it would be great so I don't need to candle anymore- but I like the surprise of the hatch gender.

This is geared towards the commercial poultry industry. Germany for example has decided that the hatch and subsequent murder of male egg layer chicks has to stop- I think either this year or next- so alternative technologies are being developed.