Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[NYREDS]

When I was a kid in 4H I quarantined birds coming back from a show, until as a senior I helped my leader and mentor unpack his birds from a show and noticed he just tossed them back in the pen. After that I did not bother, have never had a sick bird coming back from a show. If you have birds too valuable to a breeding program to be shown, either quarantine birds that would go back in that pen, or simply keep breeders and show birds separate.

That's what I've been doing for over 50 years. I've never quarantined & have no plans to start. When I return from a show any returning birds go right back where they were & on thise occasions when I've bought birds at a show the new birds also go right in with everybody else. Never had a problem because of this yet so I can't see why I should change.
I've bred for disease resistance for years which is why I'm comfortable with my current practice. Any sick bird gets culled & in a couple of generations no more sick birds. Why would anyone want to "cure" a sick bird & then use it to produce more birds with a tendency to get sick? Makes no sense to me. The only thing I medicate for is Coccidiosis.

 

[fowlman01]

That's what I've been doing for over 50 years. I've never quarantined & have no plans to start. When I return from a show any returning birds go right back where they were & on thise occasions when I've bought birds at a show the new birds also go right in with everybody else. Never had a problem because of this yet so I can't see why I should change.
I've bred for disease resistance for years which is why I'm comfortable with my current practice. Any sick bird gets culled & in a couple of generations no more sick birds. Why would anyone want to "cure" a sick bird & then use it to produce more birds with a tendency to get sick? Makes no sense to me. The only thing I medicate for is Coccidiosis.

The only item in my chicken first aid box is an ax. Like you, I feed medicated chick starter, but that is it. No vaccinations and no medications. The result of that is that I don't have problems. Unless they get hit by a car, the birds are not going to have a problem. If AI or Exotic Newcastle showed up here, that might be a different story, but that is pretty much a commercial chicken operation problem.

Very seldom any Mareks problems and the average life of a bird here is 10-12 years with waterfowl living a lot longer than that. I showed a white Call duck this last weekend that is 16 years old and still lays eggs. She had RV in a good class of white Calls. I don't usually show her, but I needed a female to show.

The more people medicate the more they will have to medicate. If you buy birds from people that medicate, the birds will always have problems.....that is my experience of many years too.

Walt

 

[Beekissed]

Same here except the medicated feeds. No vaccines, no medicated feeds, no medications....no illnesses, 37 years. Culling for poor performance, age related laying decrease, poor feathering or poor feed thrift seems to throw a net over the birds that maybe would ordinarily be the disease and parasite vectors in a flock and eliminate those weak genetics, because I've had none of that in my flocks when under my care.

I think it's often disregarded, the power of the cull for disease and parasite prevention, but it needs to be in everyone's medicine cabinet for livestock husbandry.

 

[MagicChicken]

Quote:
If I had the choice between breeding birds that showed no sign of infection versus birds that recovered from an infection, I would use only the birds that showed no infection whatsoever. They are the truly resistant ones.

If they all got the infection and recovered I would use the ones that had the mildest symptoms. Over time that should help improve resistance.

So now I need to walk the talk. I am still hearing Bob Blosl's words - cull for vigor the first year. My largest, broadest-backed cockerel was the first to get the Mycoplasma symptoms. I had planned to breed him to build up size in the flock, but I think I will eat him and breed the second-largest bird instead. The resulting tails will be a little narrower but the birds may be healthier overall. And the second-largest bird has the correct eye and undercolor. It's all good.

This has been a great set of posts. Very helpful. Thanks, everybody!
Sarah

 

[ocap]

Don't get me started on that. My life on the farm has given me a very different view about things than my suburbanite friends. And I may get smacked for this (please, don't anyone take this personally), but I do sometimes question the incredible lengths we go to with the medical system nowadays to prolong life that would never have happened even twenty years ago.

Premies who are born at 2 lbs, and who, when they grow up, will always need medical assistance just to continue to live. Elders who are dying yet who are given one after another heroic treatment because their relatives can't face that they're dying.

I dunno. I am pragmatic. No doubt if it were my grandchild born prematurely I would feel differently. But for me with humans as well as animals, quality of life has always been a big issue for me.

I watched my maternal grandmother spend ten years with dementia, not knowing who any of us were, lying in a nursing home, body whole, brain just gone. Not for me, nope. I want to go like my mother did, drop dead of an aneurysm. Boom. Gone. Sign me up for that. I've told my family, no heroic measures for me.

One does wonder if we're weakening the species sometimes...

if I ever get a tattoo it will be a huge "DNR" on my chest

 

[juststruttin]

I have been thinking of getting NPIP certified and would love to hear the pros and cons from those of you who are certified.
I would appreciate to hear from the people who are not certified to hear why you choose not to get certified.

I have been going back and fourth on the idea of getting certified for the past 3 years. My biggest drawback is that I need to get under 100 birds and that will be challenging for me. I currently have 160. My goal is to get down to 130 before winter, but that is about as slim as I can get before having to make some really difficult choices.

The other major drawback is the setup of my facility. From what I understand, the testers only test birds 4+ months which means any un-tested birds need to be kept separated from the tested flock until they testers come back (12 months later). The logistics of this are nearly impossible. How do you guys manage this?

 

[Arielle]

Quote: Forgive me for laughing at your last papagraph--- I suspect mother nature will have the upper hand again soon and she will be making the decisions again. THere has been a drastic change in the handling of some childhood diseases but I'm concerned it is after the fact. Meaning ther are a number of easy answers to reduce the exposure as well as up the immune system of a child. I feed my kids high quality foods, including vegetables, salads, fruits etc. My kids never get ear aches . . . . but I can't keep them from contracting strep several times a year . . . along with all their classmates. WHat are we doing . . . .

 

[Arielle]

Quote: ROFL-- love it.

It must be age that let's us see the value of life. As in "living". Much of what you listed Pathfinders, is driven by the medical field as well as people who do not want to face the "D" word.

I hope one aspect of living on a farm is that my kids value living. THey value life and understand a chick hatching and "where it came from" , goodness the roosters are fine with a public display of affection, lol, and the need to cull a sick bird or butcher one for dinner. THey will help with burial and they help with processing. I hope they are seening that life is a balance.

My grandfather died shortly after tripping and falling carrying in a new TV at 92!!! HIs sister lived many years longer, recognizing her own family if not others, geez at 100 and 30 years since our last visit, I sure did not expect her to remember; lived five more years to 105. Good genes there I think. HOpe I got some of them!

 

[BGMatt]

If I had the choice between breeding birds that showed no sign of infection versus birds that recovered from an infection, I would use only the birds that showed no infection whatsoever. They are the truly resistant ones.

If they all got the infection and recovered I would use the ones that had the mildest symptoms. Over time that should help improve resistance.

So now I need to walk the talk. I am still hearing Bob Blosl's words - cull for vigor the first year. My largest, broadest-backed cockerel was the first to get the Mycoplasma symptoms. I had planned to breed him to build up size in the flock, but I think I will eat him and breed the second-largest bird instead. The resulting tails will be a little narrower but the birds may be healthier overall. And the second-largest bird has the correct eye and undercolor. It's all good.

This has been a great set of posts. Very helpful. Thanks, everybody!
Sarah

Cull for vigor EVERY year. The healthiest, fastest growing, stand out chicks that catch your eye. Top 1/3rd or so, then look for other qualities. By selecting like that, you end up with less health problems, but also by selecting quicker maturing birds and not letting stragglers catch up you end up saving on feed bill too. Culls reach edible size faster, no downsize to selecting vigorous quick developing chicks.

As growing birds too, first one out of the coop in the morning, last one in at night. Active thriving birds will produce the same.

 

[Beekissed]

You know, my kids stopped having all those childhood maladies when we stopped eating commercially derived meats, dairy and highly processed anything. Not one ear ache for 3 boys, one case of strep before going off the aforementioned foods, multiple colds for the youngest before going off those sources of food. After going off dairy and processed or commercially derived animal proteins, no more colds, no more flu symptoms of any kind when the schools were full of them, no more any of the normal childhood illnesses. Didn't even get chicken pox real strong...one or two pox for each kid.

None of those things until they grew up, went off on their own and started eating commercially derived meats, dairy and eggs once again, plus many, many processed foods.

Truly, our food supply is tainted.