Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[Canieldonrad]

Their body is also longer than it appears due to the stance of the bird. Fast growing and Langshans have an...interesting relationship. You tend to either get lines that sprout like weeds but take forever to put on meat, or you get lines that take forever to grow. Either way, they aren't a "fast" breed like the New Hampshire or the Delaware, but should be quicker to mature than their asiatic compatriots the Brahma and Cochin. I know rodriguezpoultry and I disagree on this aspect, but I know with my past with the breed you can get a good carcass at 6 months and pullets laying before they turn 7 months. So about on par with a Rock or Red, maybe a couple weeks behind. You start pushing them faster you lose size. You are very correct about the wide and deep body, which is one of the challenges of the breed, an inattentive breeder can often find them becoming either broad and deep but short legged, or narrow and shallow with too long of legs. As far as laying longevity, hopefully others can chime in as well, but I found about a 5% drop in production a year, so comparable to other breeds.

From what I remember of the Langshans I had(I can't for the life of me figure out the man's name I got them from), they grew rather fast. But took a long time to really fill out. They feathered painfully slow.

Once they did fill out though they were grossly overweight.

 

[Lacy Blues]

Who knows? I am frustrated too.

People keep counseling to weigh birds and measure them at such and such an age.
But I can't find anywhere what those weights or measurements should be? What good is counsel without content?
I am not mad, just frustrated.

Best,
Karen

I haven't seen anything that gives me measurements for my breed at all. But the weights for my Andalusian cockerels is 6 lbs. I am just wondering what age they should achieve this by. Pullets: 4.5 pounds.

If you weigh your birds on a regular schedule you have a baseline for measuring the effectiveness of different management techniques. Then you can answer questions like, "Did that new, expensive feed really make them grow faster/larger/whatever? Enough to be worth the extra money?" Other peoples' numbers and "should be" weights aren't necessarily relevant to your own birds and poultry-raising goals. Just saying.

Sarah

I wasn't wondering about other people's birds. I was looking for input, perhaps from Walt as he is an APA judge or NYREDS as he is also a judge but also raises the same breed as I do? Just looking for clarification on something I have been pondering for a while.

 

[Vamvakas]

It depends on the breed and line where your birds come from to find out when they're fully mature weight... You can't go by age cause someone's line may mature faster then another person line or the other way around.

 

[BGMatt]

It depends on the breed and line where your birds come from to find out when they're fully mature weight...  You can't go by age cause  someone's line may mature faster then another person line or the other way around.

Pretty much this. The Standard weights are only "under a year" and "over a year" probably why the DQ range is 20% up or down from standard weight (don't have to be a judge to know that. It's in your standard). Many breeds will reach cockerel or pullet weight before they look fully mature, especially males with a big tail like a Leghorn or Langshan which can take a full year to completely finish their tail.

 

[Lacy Blues]

Thank you. I figured that would probably be the case but wanted to be sure, if it was possible to be sure.

 

[Vamvakas]

Books may say one thing, but in reality, it is what it is..

 

[3riverschick]

Do the experts on the list agree with this?
Thanks,
Karen

Eggs and the intensive world; the official organ ...
v.3 1913. Nov. 5th, 1913 , Page 250
"We desire to repeat the truth which every beginner must understand and act upon, namely :—" The
'hatchable' egg is the result of special hen feeding in order that its white matter can form the chicken,
and its yolk efficiently nourish the youngster during the first week of its life outside the shell; together
with special care, and feeding, and seclusion for the male bird so that he may properly contribute to
the germ of his mate's by-product."

 

[Pozees]

That is part of the plan. It will probably take several generations of complementary pairings to get them where I want them to be.

The pairings aren't quite as simple as it sounds because I also have to maintain the genes for yellow soles in the flock while I'm working on the body type. Absence of yellow in the sole is a DQ in this breed. Only a couple of my birds have visible yellow - one relatively small cockerel with generally good proportions, and one narrow-tailed pullet. From what I understand the yellow is recessive. I hope the white-soled birds in my flock are carrying a copy of the yellow gene even if I can't see the evidence. I have to be careful when I am pairing birds that don't have obvious yellow soles, because it would be easy to accidentally breed that recessive trait out of my small flock while I'm focused on other stuff. It's always something.

Ah, right, okay, now that you have said this I remember you discussing over the summer while you were growing them out and beginning to make selections. Well isn't that a sticky wicket? Can a female without yellow feet still carry the recessive trait, or is it only the males?

 

[brahmabreeder]

That is part of the plan. It will probably take several generations of complementary pairings to get them where I want them to be.

The pairings aren't quite as simple as it sounds because I also have to maintain the genes for yellow soles in the flock while I'm working on the body type. Absence of yellow in the sole is a DQ in this breed. Only a couple of my birds have visible yellow - one relatively small cockerel with generally good proportions, and one narrow-tailed pullet. From what I understand the yellow is recessive. I hope the white-soled birds in my flock are carrying a copy of the yellow gene even if I can't see the evidence. I have to be careful when I am pairing birds that don't have obvious yellow soles, because it would be easy to accidentally breed that recessive trait out of my small flock while I'm focused on other stuff. It's always something.

At least it's recessive so you know yellow + yellow = yellow. Once you get enough yellow soled birds with good type scrap the rest and then you're in the clear with yellow soles. Yeah you're right, chickens can never be as simple as one would think

.

 

[maryhysong]

I haven't seen anything that gives me measurements for my breed at all. But the weights for my Andalusian cockerels is 6 lbs. I am just wondering what age they should achieve this by. Pullets: 4.5 pounds.
I wasn't wondering about other people's birds. I was looking for input, perhaps from Walt as he is an APA judge or NYREDS as he is also a judge but also raises the same breed as I do? Just looking for clarification on something I have been pondering for a while.

I don't know the answer either but maybe part of it depends on your goals for your birds? It seems to me that at 9-12 months they should be about the listed weight for cockerels and pullets. Then by 12-18 months they should weigh the listed weight for hens & cocks? Or am I mistaken? should they be hitting cockerel & pullet weights more like 6-9 months and adult weight more like 9-12? Would love to have some feedback on this.