Horse Talk

[Peaches Lee]

This is my QH. She also barrel races. We are going barrel racing on Sat. So excited.
Hopefully we're gonna win some money!
She's the great granddaughter of Hollywood Dunit and Wright A Chex

Aww, she's being bashful! Glad you enjoy dressage with your mare. It really is a wonderful discipline that is good for ALL breeds!

P.S. Good luck on Sat.!

 

[PeepersMama]

s

I love Charlotte and Valegro.
Their last ride didn't get as high of a score as her London Olympics one. Bummer.

I do some dressage with my quarter horse. She's registered and does crazy good dressage. She is very responsive.

Niiiiiice.

 

[abigalerose]

My stallion (the white one) and his best friend, and then a better picture of his mane, it's actually longer now. And yes, he actually is white, he's not a grey. He's actually a bey and white sabino... He has a spot on his right flank about the size of a fingernail that is brown, and another one about the same size on the inside of his right hock that is black... Other than that, he's pure white with mostly pink skin under the hair.

He's beautiful! But I hope you don't mind me asking, why have you kept him a stallion?

 

[tastyacres]

You'll have very pretty horses!

I am still thinking about what I want mule/donkey/horse? I am leaning towards a mule but may go with a donkey. I use to have a horse but had to rehome her.

 

[abigalerose]

You'll have very pretty horses! 

I am still thinking about what I want mule/donkey/horse? I am leaning towards a mule but may go with a donkey. I use to have a horse but had to rehome her. 

I would like to suggest a gaited mammoth mule!

 

[tastyacres]

Its funny you suggest that because that is what i am going to get if i go with a donkey.

 

[Kusanar]

Quote:
Because I feel like most of the rest of the world, that if you train a horse right, that they will be what you want them to be. This stallion lives with a gelding with no issues and has lived with an entire herd of geldings without issues before. We only have him seperated now because our fences suck and we have him in a smaller area that is easier to keep good fencing up (we don't own the place, and 20+ year old wood fence falls over when the wind blows sometimes...)

Kids can handle him without an issue, one of his first riders when he was 2-3 was an 11 year old girl I was giving riding lessons to.

Basically, I don't see any benifit to gelding him, and there are risks with any surgery, so why take a risk with his life and certainly put him in pain if there aren't any benifits to it (he also has his wolf teeth)?
I do not own mares, and if I did, there is birth control you can put them on, or simply put them in a seperate field. When we used to board horses, we had mares on the property with him and it was fine, I could lead him in one hand and a mare in heat in the other and he wouldn't even look at her for the most part.

He has never had a chain over his nose in his life, he is worked in a rope halter with knots, but that is only because I haven't had the time to work with him consistantly enough to get and keep him light. When I was working with him daily, I could longe him at a walk and trot without a halter or anything on him, he would just circle me 10-15 feet away and change directions on request, even with his buddy getting in the way.

In most of the rest of the world, they do not geld stallions, they simply do not allow the ones that they do not want to breed to breed a mare. My friend recently went to Jamacca and did the riding on the beach and swim with the horses thing, the horses they had were all mares and stallions, and the riders were just anyone that paid for the experience, so they could have never been on a horse before. Also, in europe they don't tend to geld, and they run stallions together in a herd.

At some point, when we get the horses moved to my farm, I would like to find a small racking mare that is well trained and well built and breed her to him, put her on the birth control shot before she foals (safe) and then let her, Stud, and Papi (the gelding friend) raise the foal together, then keep the mare on birth control and use her as a spare horse for my husband or visitors to ride when I ride Stud. I want a small mare because he's really too big to trail ride comfortably, you hit every branch, a smaller mare has a chance of producing a smaller foal, and a racking mare as even though he's part walker, he still trots a lot and he also racks instead of running walks, so a racking mare should shore up the gaits a bit and make the foal more racky. The foal would be guaranteed a home for life, as are all of the rest of my horses, so purebred doesn't matter to me. I know that the build, brain, and athletic ability of that stallion paired with something to shore up the gaits and put it all in a slightly smaller package would be an amazing trail horse. I have always wanted to train one from a foal, when I got Stud he was a year and a half old, still living with his psycho mother, and had learned to bite, kick and chase people... It took me about 6 months to get him over that, now he's golden.

I know this "rant" may seem like I am offended, I'm really, not, I have just been asked the question so many times I have thought of the answer so much that I just have a lot to say about it now.

 

[abigalerose]

I wasn't asking because I thought he was dangerous, plenty of studs can be nice, calm, good horses. But what if you got a neighbor with mares and he decided to hop the fence someday? Or the fence was down somewhere? Or what if something happened to you (death, accident, etc.) and your horses had to be sold? Unfortunately even if he is a good horse, no one will want an older mix breed stallion, which puts him in a bad place. I assumed that there was thought of breeding somewhere, and I finally got to it. Honestly, he is pretty but his conformation is not special enough to warrant breeding. And you want a short gaited horse? Why not buy a weanling out of 2 gaited, 14-15 hand horses and raise it? Why go out and buy a mare just for her uterus, and create a mixed breed baby who could end up with any crazy conformation (from being mixed breed) and could EASILY end up very tall like it's Dad and NOT gaited? It seems like too much of a gamble too me.
And you won't risk gelding him but you'll risk a mare with pregnancy?
And you really should get his wolf teeth removed, they can get pretty painful for him, should you ever use a bit, which I assume you do when riding.
I hope none of that upsets you, please understand that I know where you're coming from, I originally wanted to breed June, but just because she's super sweet, a mare, and I think she's beautiful doesn't mean she needs to be bred. And she's registered and I would have kept the baby for myself for a trail horse. But it's not worth it. It's a lot easier, and honestly better, to just go out and buy a foal with the conformation, papers, color, gender and height (and gait) that you want.

 

[Kusanar]

I wasn't asking because I thought he was dangerous, plenty of studs can be nice, calm, good horses. But what if you got a neighbor with mares and he decided to hop the fence someday? Or the fence was down somewhere? Or what if something happened to you (death, accident, etc.) and your horses had to be sold? Unfortunately even if he is a good horse, no one will want an older mix breed stallion, which puts him in a bad place. I assumed that there was thought of breeding somewhere, and I finally got to it. Honestly, he is pretty but his conformation is not special enough to warrant breeding. And you want a short gaited horse? Why not buy a weanling out of 2 gaited, 14-15 hand horses and raise it? Why go out and buy a mare just for her uterus, and create a mixed breed baby who could end up with any crazy conformation (from being mixed breed) and could EASILY end up very tall like it's Dad and NOT gaited? It seems like too much of a gamble too me.
And you won't risk gelding him but you'll risk a mare with pregnancy?
And you really should get his wolf teeth removed, they can get pretty painful for him, should you ever use a bit, which I assume you do when riding.
I hope none of that upsets you, please understand that I know where you're coming from, I originally wanted to breed June, but just because she's super sweet, a mare, and I think she's beautiful doesn't mean she needs to be bred. And she's registered and I would have kept the baby for myself for a trail horse. But it's not worth it. It's a lot easier, and honestly better, to just go out and buy a foal with the conformation, papers, color, gender and height (and gait) that you want.

We actually do have a neighbor with mares, and they breed and make them all cycle at once. He is fine, he spends a little time in the corner looking at them when they scream at him, but the geldings look at them too when they start yelling like idiots. He rarely if ever calls back.

Honestly, the mares are more of an issue than he is, and you don't spay mares to keep them from bothering geldings and stallions. I took him to a show when he was 2, just to ride along and see how he would behave. He was loud, but I wasn't able to be with him 100% of the time to enforce that he be quiet and calm. He never tried to drag me over to a mare, or tried to get loose when tied to the trailer, BUT, a mare apparently took a shine to him and pulled back, broke her halter, and came over to flirt with him, even then, he was fine, I just walked him in a circle so that she couldn't get right up against him, and eventually her owner came and caught him.

Honestly, the mare that I would purchase for her uterus would mean less to me than he does, so, yes, I would be more willing to risk her life during pregnancy and birth which is at least a natural risk rather than surgery which is totally man made. Plus, if I don't breed him in the next year, I just won't. Reason being, I will be 29 in August, if I breed him while I am 29, the foal will be born when I am 30, that gives me 30 years before I am 60 to keep the foal until it is a very old horse.

It would also be difficult for the foal to come out not gating since Stud walks, trots, racks, paces, fox trots, and canters.

Wolf teeth are only painful with a bit if you break them or bang the bit into them, he rides soft enough that you can ride with 2 fingers, so that is not an issue, most of the time I ride him bitless right now anyway just because we're just working on basics not anything advanced enough to need the bit.

And yes, I know I could buy a weanling, but then it would already be months old when I got it, I want one from birth with no bad habbits to have to unlearn. From day 1, I want the foal calm around me and yielding when asked, which is possible, but most people don't really care if the foal bounces all over the place when they try to catch it... I've worked with too many foals like that to want to deal with that again.

Also, if something happened to me, probably 2 of the horses would be put down rather than try to find them homes, one would go to a friend of mine, and really, I think that Stud would be at least as desireable as a mixed breed stallion as a 14 hand, 20 year old Arabian gelding with proud flesh on his ankle and I'm the only one that can really ride him, or the pretty pinto gelding in the picture with Stud that is a registered TWH but has no papers, has cut his ankle so you could never show him due to the soring regulations (scars), and turns into a pretty decent rodeo bronk with no warning when you ride him. So, honestly, Stud would be the one that would be the EASIEST to place. The 2 that would be put down are my 27 year old Arabian with a sideways tooth that makes floating him difficult, unrideable, hard to keep weight on, and colic and choke prone... Also, the Mini of unknown age that appears to have founderd in the past and has to be body clipped 2 times a year just to keep him comfortable. I would never try to find those 2 a home, it would be kinder to put them down than gamble with their welfare somewhere else.

If you had to pick a horse from my herd, which one would you take? Not one of my horses has been purchased, they were all given to me. The mini was the closest to a purchase but I traded Stud's psycho mother for the mini... Figured he would at least take more than 30 seconds to plow over a fence... The first hour we had her she freight train ran straight through a metal gate anchored to 2 light poles... Bent it nearly in 2, never even TRIED to jump...

 

[abigalerose]

He would be the easiest to place of you herd, but say you got in a car accident and a friend or family member (maybe someone not as horse friendly as you) handled everything and your horses got sent to auction, or maybe you just decided to sell one day, who knows, if, and unfortunately that if is always there, they had to be sold, he'd sell the easiest of yours, but there's a lot of horses in the world, and most likely your whole herd would end up on a meat truck.
I know with my herd, my mare and filly would PROBABLY find homes if something happened to me, my mare having nice conformation, pretty, good papers, sweet personality and broke to ride and my filly having great confo. flashy color, good papers, a good start on handling, and an awesome personality. But it's not guaranteed with them even. As for my geldings, if something happened to me tomorrow and they had to be sold, I honestly think they'd end up going to slaughter at some point, because they're not broke and they're GRADE (ones a mutt too). They've got kinda nice colors but that's about it. Lots of registered horses end up going to slaughter but they have a slightly better chance than grade and mix breed horses. And geldings ALWAYS sell the easiest. No one seems to want mares or stallions.
And I know the mare would mean less to you, that's why I said that. But that's kind of cruel. And if the foal takes after the mare? Most foals end up with personalities like their moms, not the their dads. What if you buy a mare and she ends up being hateful? Are you going to keep buying mares until you get one that acts like your stud? And still, what if the foal is just as tall as your stud? The foal could potentially get taller than him, given that he was never gelded he probably never reached his full height.
And what if the foal is a stud colt? Will you "risk" gelding it or are you going to keep two studs together? Because that's not the best idea. And I thought you said he wasn't gaited but I must have read something wrong somewhere.
Also, you only want a foal if it's born when you're 30? Horses don't just live to 30 and fall over dead. What if this foal winds up living to be 40 years old? Thats 10 years over your 60 year rule.
And it's not that risky to geld a horse. Think about all the geldings out there. There's MILLIONS of gelding. I have two geldings. I had 5 geldings before them. I would not think of gelding as a "risky" surgery. Spaying a mare would be. Gelding would not.
I firmly believe that a stallion should only be a stallion, if he's earned it.
He needs to have darn near perfect conformation, good papers (not just decent papers), a PHENOMENAL personality, maybe a flashy color, and he needs to be proven, a show record, money earner, SOMETHING. And even then still just maybe, because if you took everything I just said, and gelded it, he'd be worth twice as much lol. If they've proven that they produce money/point earning foals, plus everything else, then he probably deserves to be a stallion.
The only thing your horse has out of that is the personality.
I'm going to say something honest, and dont get offended, because I harshly judge my own horses too, just ask them lol.
But if I was horse shopping, I wouldn't give any of your horses a second look.
That's an honest view from a person who doesn't have any emotional attachment to the horses.
I think you'd be doing the horses a disservice to breed them.
I don't mean to be harsh, but I've been in the same place as you and it took me a long time to see the whole picture. I wanted to breed June to a friesian, to make a big, beautiful, versatile trail horse. And I had all kinds of reasoning and arguments but thankfully I finally seen the bigger picture, now there's no way I'd do that because I know I most likely wouldn't get what I was hoping for, and I'd just be creating another mix breed sub par horse.
But I do judge my horses harshly, just as I would with anyone else's.
I love them don't get me wrong, but I think from an outside perspective my geldings are ugly, awkward, grade, mutts and they're not broke. They're not worth much. And June is my heart horse, but her pasterns are too long, her neck is too skinny, and she's too short for a lot of people. She's also stubborn.
If you want a baby baby, then find someone who's got a mare and stallion that's perfect for what you want, and buy the baby in utero, and ask that you be the only one who handles it and go out to whoevers farm it is and work with your foal several days a week. If you don't have time for that, you don't have time for a foal out of your horses either. If you do have lots of time, but still don't like that option, maybe you could adopt from last chance corral or somewhere similar. That would give you a baby baby and it would definitely imprint on you