How bad are the de-beaked hens?

[jcatblum]

My darling daughter LOVES collecting eggs. Due to predators she doens't currently have any laying hens, only guineas, which are laying 5 eggs a day.

Saw this post on Craigslist

Red Sexlink Laying Hens $5 each cash. These hens are 12 months old and laying a large brown egg. You won't find a better egg producer. If you buy 25 will sell for $4.50 each, 50 hens $4 each and 100 for $3.50 each Cash only. Call
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It was too hot to do anything yesterday so we drove up there to pick up a few. I knew it would be a major chicken operation and that these had already been replaced with younger layers. When I got there I was SHOCKED. The hens had been debeaked! The guy said they have all there chicks debeaked when they order them, since debeaked birds only need 1.5 sq ft. If I would have known they were debeaked, I don't think I would have went to get the hens. I expressed my concerns to the owner, that we have 20 acres & they need their beaks to catch bugs & defend theirselves. However after being next to the hens for a moment, I could tell they were very friendly gals. The hens peck you non-stop, but not in a painful way, almost like the way a dog sniffs you. My daughter had her heart set on
getting some hens. Over all the hens all look very healthy & after driving almost an hour to get there I said ok why not.

We brought home 10 hens, they have all laid today & are happy & doing well. I did just take them some cold treats & they didn't go near them. However, when I threw corn out to them last night they gobbled it up. I am sure in time they will be just like all of our other chickens (except the excessive pecking part). My daughter thinks they are the best chickens ever & that is all that matters at this point! I did explain to her that I wouldn't have taken her to get them if I knew they were debeaked. She understood, but says it isn't the chickens fault, they didn't ask anyone to cut their beaks off!!!!!

The part that kills me is he says he gets 100 dozen eggs a day. Sales them all at the fleamarket or at his house. $3 each or 2/$5. I know his customers would be shocked to know these are not happy free ranging chickens. Yes, techinically they are cage free, since they are living under a large covered area with fencing around it, instead of tiny cages. However, when people want farm fresh eggs, they are after eggs from chickens that get to live the farm life!

 

[7L Farm]

I'd be curious about how well they lay as well. Personally, I wouldn't buy them. Why would they sell them so cheap if they were good layers? I'm not for de-beaking chickens so why would I support it? I have some that peck their feathers & have tried every gimmick to get them to stop but I'm not gonna de-beak them.

 

[ThePolishPrincess]

I would never do it. Chickens are meant to have their beaks and use them. Many have claimed that some of their debeaked birds can have trouble picking things up. It's said to hurt the animal. However, I don't think 'boycotting' would stop the debeaking-unless people straight-up stop purchasing them. I wouldn't not-buy them just because of their beaks. There's nothing wrong with the birds themselves. I'd probably be even more tempted to buy them just to give them a good home...

1. Depends on the type of feed/severe amount chopped off or not/individual

2. THEY would probably not bother other birds, because that's the goal of debeaking-to stop picking. However, other birds may be more inclined to pick them if they don't fight back. Just my thought...

3. Opinions differ on this one.

 

[Mac in Wisco]

Quote:
They'll eat just fine, otherwise they wouldn't have survived this long.

Debeaking is for their own welfare. One peck with a sharp beak can draw blood and lead to a frenzied killing.

How badly were they debeaked? There are preferred ways of doing it. Our organic layer hens are all beak "tipped" before they are ten days old which is in accordance with national organic standards. Most of our birds look like this with just the sharp tip removed, the results vary slightly, some of them have their upper beak just slightly shorter than the bottom.

 

[Pele]

That right there proves why I don't buy into the 'organic and free-range' eggs nonsense at the supermarket. It only means that you don't bother to medicate your birds against disease, and that you don't put them into cages when you overcrowd their growing pens. Most state laws allow you to crowd 25 birds per ten square feet and still call your birds "Free-range".

This is why I'm raising my own birds who enjoy a really nice spacey coop and a nice open back yard. I refuse to pay more money for only slightly less tortured birds from a commercial facility.

Debeaking is specifically done because birds develop destructive mental disorders when they are overstressed and overcrowded. Essentially their entire world becomes fighting for space and food.

Here's a really good article on "Organic" and "Free-range" commercial facilities :

http://www.all-creatures.org/articles/egg-freerange.html


Edited to be less strongly worded. Very upsetting topic to me.

 

[Mac in Wisco]

Pele, I disagree. I keep a relatively small commercial flock of 2500 hens. Our indoor stocking rate is one of the lowest in the industry, they have ample pasture, I don't abuse my birds and try to provide the best possible living conditions for them. I still believe that trimming their beaks is better welfare than crossing my fingers and hoping that any cannibalistic tendencies don't arise.

There is a reason we call their social hierarchy a "pecking order". Birds do get pecked at by other birds. I've had outbreaks of pecking in small backyard flocks and you can find numerous threads here where it seems the posters are keeping the company the makes "Blu-Kote" in business because they can't break a pecking habit.

 

[boykin2010]

WOW I never would have guessed this question was get so many varied responses. mac in abilene their beaks look just like the one you posted a pic of. I am still trying to decide whether i want to buy a few or not. I would give them a good home and at the livestock sale every hen is going to sell whether they give it away for free or many people bid on them. I might as well buy a couple and give them a good home. I really just want chickens for the eggs. If they are laying fine and are healthy i might consider it.
Thank yall for all the posts!

 

[bucky52]

i ordered three pullets,and was shocked when i picked them up.they were debeaked.i also think that its inhuman.wished i had known before hand.but they are great egg layers and very sociable chickens.one of the pullets beak is so short,she does have difficulty in trying to eat larger pieces of foogd.that is the one i worry about.

 

[7L Farm]

Quote:
Your right about not breaking the pecking habit. I'm not for de-becking a bird but your birds aren't debeaked as mentioned there trimmed that seems fair. I'm talking about chopping half of the top beak off. I hate seeing that.

 

[Pele]

Quote:
If your farm is as humane and your stock rate is as low as you say, then I apologize and my post is not directed at you. However, it is unfortunately true that you'd be in the minority of most commercial facilities. Your picture is of a trimmed beak (which is understandable and fine), not a debeaked chicken.

This is the sort of thing that deeply upsets me:

http://urveg.org/campaigns/wegmans/responses/debeaked.jpg

That wasn't even the most graphic picture that google turned up. I didn't want to link a worse one without a warning on my post.