how big should a chicken house be for 300 chickens?

[Pokster]

Quote:
I didn't but even if I had, it would not be appropriate for me to publish on the internet pictures of people's private property without their permission.
JJ

\\Not a good idea without permission, I would not be pleased if you did that to me. I have not been doing this long but do know one thing for sure, more is better! I am already expanding my chicken coop as I can see how much happier they are with the room. They can always "Huddle" if they want but they can not run if they don't have the room. I would rather be safe than sorry & have a happy coop.

 

[TDM]

Quote:
I didn't but even if I had, it would not be appropriate for me to publish on the internet pictures of people's private property without their permission.
JJ

So, next time you go to these farms, could you please get their permission and share some pictures with us? Thanks.

 

[TDM]

Quote:
Most people I know in the UP go at two square feet per bird. I'm near Chatham, and the bitter cold winters force the birds together. The larger the area, the harder it will be for them to keep warm without adding outside heat. I also tend to look at the ecological footprint that a coop makes, especially if you need to add heat. Smaller coops are more "green". There is a reason why the older homes in the UP, mine included, were 800 square feet or less.

 

[perchie.girl]

In my personal opinion.... the square footage is directly influenced by the climate of the area. Plus the types of chickens you have and the amount of free area to move around outside. And the type of housing.... So in fact there is quite a few good answers to the question.

My place is in the desert. Even though its hot my chickens do scoot together at night. I am planning on 4 sq foot per bird because the ambient temperature in the shade will be close to 100 degrees on those few hot days per year. During the winter we get wind so my coop has to be buttoned up with tarps to keep from blowing the chickens off their roosts. (gusts upwards to 56-60 mph) All my above ground structures have to be anchored. The breeds of chickens I will be raising will be well suited to this hot of climate.

 

[Mac in Wisco]

Here are photos of my barn. They are cooped up here in the depths of winter at 1.75 sq ft per bird. These photos were taken in February when there was two feet of snow on the ground and it was around 0 F outside. Does it look like a sea of birds? Yes. Even at half the stocking rate a few thousand birds looks like a sea of birds. They have plenty of room to move around. They have no trouble at all moving between the scratch areas, nest boxes, feeders and waterers. They do well in here.

This barn for 2500 hens would also cost you about $80,000 to build. At four square feet per bird, you could spend the rest of your life trying to market very expensive eggs to pay for it. The folks that are opening their wallets to buy your product don't necessarily care about the difference between 2, 3, or 4 sq feet per bird, to them, either way it's still a lot of birds in a given space... Yet they'll definitely notice that your eggs cost 50% more than your competitors.

As far as TDM's argument about heat conservation, yes and no... Bigger buildings do have a larger heat loss, but the structure loss is little when compared to what is lost through the required ventilation. Our barn is heavily insulated; spray foam in the walls, cellulose in the ceiling, every crack where air can come in is sealed so that intake air only comes in at the installed intakes. The ventilation required can be quantified by the outside air temperature vs the number of birds. Since the goal is to remove moisture from the barn and the birds drink a specific quantity every day and the amount of of water removed can be roughly quantified by the outside air temperature and humidity, it comes down to a certain number of CFM per minute per bird at a given outside air temperature. When you are bringing in 1000's of cubic feet per minute of frigid air, the structural losses look trivial.

 

[Pokster]

Quote:
Most people I know in the UP go at two square feet per bird. I'm near Chatham, and the bitter cold winters force the birds together. The larger the area, the harder it will be for them to keep warm without adding outside heat. I also tend to look at the ecological footprint that a coop makes, especially if you need to add heat. Smaller coops are more "green". There is a reason why the older homes in the UP, mine included, were 800 square feet or less.

I have inside heat and it's a well insulated and ventilated building. It's very cold here in the winter and cool in the summer as I'm right off the lake. I also have constant wind in my area. My birds like to hang close together however sometimes they need space from each other and without it you could have fights and feather plucking. I'm not going to argue back and forth with you. My first post I was talking about "MY" birds and what I found to be working better for 'MY" coop. We all have different set ups we are happy with, we all have different coop styles we are happy with. I am entitled to my opinion as you are yours.

 

[Mac in Wisco]

Quote:
Not quite that many... The best hybrid brown layers reach a peak of about 95% production at around 28 weeks of age and slowly decline from there.

From the onset of lay through one year of laying you can expect an average production of about 80%.

At peak you can expect about 166 dozen per week.

After one year, with good management, you could probably expect to have lost about 3% of your hens (10 hens) and they will be laying at around 85%. At that point, at the very best you are looking at around 144 dozen per week.

 

[TDM]

Quote:
So Mac, you are saying that the difference in energy costs to heat and ventilate a 4,375 square foot barn in a Wisconsin winter would be negligible as compared to a 8,750 square foot barn with the same number of chickens (2,500)? I find that difficult to believe. It has been 30 plus years when I had my thermodynamics and ventilation courses while pursuing my engineering degree, so I can't quantify my beliefs.

I don't heat my insulated coops. I rely on the 40 btu per hen to maintain the warmth needed for good egg production and unfrozen eggs.

Another side observation about larger coops is that your lighting costs would increase in direct proportion to the size.

 

[perchie.girl]

Quote:
Wow Mac. I forget we have people who are truly in the egg business on this forum. And I know for a fact that you don't become successful with this if you don't take good care of your birds.

I am impressed.... I also know yours is not the only way. With regard to doing eggs in a production barn this looks to be a decent quality of life. There are some egg producers here in San Diego that still use the Battery cages. Recent regulation has required more space per bird but it hasn't outlawed it entirety. And I am not a proponent for legislation.... I am a proponent for good management and modern methods.

Thanks for sharing your pictures.

 

[Mac in Wisco]

Quote:
I had to refer back to some calculations I did a few years ago. The structural loss is not as trivial compared to the ventilation losses as I remembered, and you are correct, energy used per bird is proportionate to the stocking rate. This is rough, some is empirical measurement, some is estimated.

At -15 F OAT and 60 F in the barn there is a rise of 75 degs. I found at that temperature that a ventilation rate of around 900 CFM (estimated) kept the humidity at a constant level in the barn and used this as a baseline to calculate a ventilation curve for higher and lower temperatures. The air demand for that is about 74000 btus/hr, a roughly calculated structural loss was 30000 and bird heat of around 75000, for a loss of 29000. The propane for the loss is calculated to be .32 GPH. Actual operation proved the propane usage to be in the ballpark. Operating the ventilation system along the calculated curve also gave close to the desired results.

An empty barn with no ventilation requirement has only the cost of heating for the structural loss. Each bird added incurs a heat demand for ventilation, but also adds heat to the system, which in this example seems to balance at -15F.

It's a given that higher stocking rates are more efficient in almost every aspect, including the ecological footprint.

I could run this barn without supplemental heat. Propane to heat the barn to 60 F through a 4-5 month heating season cost me $900 last year, but organic feed is expensive. If I can get the birds to eat 1 lb / 100 birds less each day (let's say .26 lbs per bird vs .27 lbs per bird), at the current feed prices, the savings over 4.5 months is close to $900. It's a wash. They either generate the extra heat they need from the feed or I provide it for them for the same price. Yet, if that supplemental heat also increases my production just 1%, I'm making an additional $500 on eggs over that period.

Some of the other producers in the area scoff at me. "You're doing what? You're heating the chicken barn?!". I think it provides a better winter environment in there by keeping the litter in much better condition, it generally pays for itself, and hopefully even adds a little profit.