Ideas for improving a problem coop?

[livinadream]

So, I bought this coop out of the local classifieds over the weekend. I've had it for 2 days. I bought it because it came with 5 laying hens, all their gear and 2 runs for $200. For that price, I decided I could modify the coop as needed. Now I'm looking for any helpful ideas from all you great coop builders out there. I have minimal carpentry skills, (but my husband has a slightly better handy streak) and I'm trying to keep costs down. I'll start with pictures, followed by my opinion of problem spots and ideas I have for fixing them. I'd love to hear your honest feedback! Thanks!

Ok-here are some basic measurements: (the coop is super insulated on all sides and in the roof, hence the thick walls.)

Interior room: 3.5 feet wide, 2 feet, 8 inches long, 19.5 inches deep. (The floor is raised 11.5 inches off the ground) This makes for 8.75 square feet of floor space.

A frame roof space: at 19.5 inches high, there is a sort of shelf all around the room from the insulated walls. The roof (which would be detachable if I had Herculean strength) sits on a shelf all around the walls, making the interior shelf 8 inches wide on the side where the A part of the roof is, and 7.5 inches and 5.5 inches wide on the sides where the sloping part of the roof is.)

So, the height of the triangle made by the roof is 26 inches and the width is about 4.5'. One of the hens roosts on the 8 inch shelf opposite the roof 'door' (where you see all the poo in the picture.) Otherwise, I don't notice anyone using the shelves.

There is a heat lamp rigged into the roof area.

The attached run is about 4' by 5'. It is 3/4 of the way covered with shingled roofing. I have buried paving stones under the bark chips around the run to try to discourage digging predators.

Here are the problems:

1) NO VENTILATION in the coop. None. nada. nix. (unless you count the doorless pop door, which brings me to #2)

2) NO DOOR for the pop door.

3) Roost dowel is on the thin side, and I don't like it's positioning.

4) the wire in the run is raccoon friendly.

5) The chickens (with the exception of the one hen who roosts on the 8 inch shelf) don't use the coop. They stay in the run, except to have a bite to eat. (I keep the food and a small waterer in the coop) Two hens are laying in the nest boxes, but the other three are laying in a self made 'nest' in the run. I'm thinking the no ventilation thing has a big part to play with the hens not using the coop. The one hen who does use the coop is recovering from frostbitten toes she got when she was trapped suspended in the air (wedged between the house and the feed box) at her old place overnight, so she probably prefers stuffy to frigid. (P.S. I'm taking good care of her frostbite-done lots of research, chatted with experienced BYC'ers, etc. I'm looking for COOP advice on this thread. Thanks.)

OK. Here are my ideas for solutions:

1)My husband picked up a couple 6 by 16 inch vent covers today, and we're thinking we'll cut ventilation holes in the upper part of the A parts of the roof and slap those vent covers on for a quick 'emergency' fix. Only concern is that these vents will only be about 14 inches above where my little invalid roosts. Is that gonna be too chilly for her? (We're still getting below freezing temps here in Utah)

We are tossing around the idea of building an extension of the coop over the run-probably just half way over the run. We'd take the A part of the roof off, and add a box shaped addition approximately 2.5' by 4' big and 26" tall. We could get away without sloping that part of the roof because we have our coop positioned under a super thick, tall pine tree that doesn't let snow and the rare rain we get out here through it's branches. We're thinking we could move the nest boxes up there, plus build in lots of ventilation (like have the whole far wall be hardware cloth with a wooden wall with a smaller vent slot build in that we could attach for the winter months , and having one of the other 2 sides be half hardware cloth with flaps to close in the winter, and the last side we'll install an old glass window that can slide open (we'll cover the opening with hardware cloth). That way there's some natural light let into the coop in the winter when the windows are shut) Maybe put the food and water up there too.

That would leave the original coop area for roosting space (I'd like to try a sort of roost latter with 2 by 4's. I'd have at least one of the 2x4's with the 4 side up for my frost bite victim, who will likely lose 5 of her 8 toes.)

Finally, we'll add another large widow with a flap on the remaining A side of the roof.

I hope all that makes sense to someone out there!

2) Once the emergency vents are in place, add a flap door to the pop door and begin shutting the chickens into the coop for the night. (Or is it really ok to let them have 24/7 access to their little run out there? It just feels like I ought to lock 'em tight at night.

3) I plan on making the before mentioned roosting ladder when I have added more space to the coop.

4) Replace the wire in the run with 1/2 inch hardware cloth. Use the old wire to make a 'skirt' for the run to more effectively protect against digging predators.

5) hope the adjustments we've made entice the chickens to enjoy our hard work.

Just so you have an idea of the chicken's freedom level: I let them free range in yard when we're outside to supervise them. (We're usually out at least a couple times a day-I'm a stay at home mom with young children-we all need a breath of fresh air periodically)

Otherwise, they're in the coop and run.

Thanks for persevering through this long and technical post! I hope it's clear enough to understand. Let me know what you think of our plans or if you have any other ideas. Thanks!

 

[rgmcgi]

No matter what... you got a great deal for 200 bucks! A couple thoughts... first, if you have digging predators, I would suggest using 1" wire mesh under the run only because it will make sure the hens are safe. Rocks will help, but the mesh will be better. As far as the vent goes, I think that is a good fix provided it seals well in the cold utah months. You want to avoid drafts as much as possible. Also, consider the higher in the coop you put the vent, the more it will evacuate the heated air. Good in the summer... bad in the winter! Same reason it is good you are putting a door on the coop. It will cut down on the drafts. Technically, you don't need to be able to "lock them in" at night, but if you have any security breaches in the run, the door can also help keep critters out of the hen house at night. If the run is secure, the flap seems like the easiest approach for sure! Rich

 

[livinadream]

Thanks for the input Rich!

 

[Judy]

I suspect they don't use the coop because it is too small. Time to drag out the old standby here, of 4 sq ft per hen in the coop and 10 sq ft in the run. You can see yours is a bit small. Right now with no ventilation, the ammonia in there probably bothers them; it can do this even before you smell it.

To tell the truth, I'd probably turn the whole thing into coop and add a run, or at least make part of the run into a coop. But you will probably be able to get away with modifying it as you are thinking, if they are used to this space and aren't pecking to the point of harm, or feather pulling.

On the frostbitten toes (poor girl,) it helps for them to have a wider roost in cold climates, usually the wide side of a 2x4 or even wider. Lets them cover their toes better which keeps them warmer. Chickens don't really curl their feet around a pole and hang on, to the extent that so many birds do. Another option is simply a branch, but a good deal wider than the pole in there. Of course the present lack of ventilation most likely contributed to the frostbite as well. Even with an open pop door, the humidity doesn't go out very well through a low opening. And you will probably want to have a pop door by next winter just for a little warmth.

I agree, a very good deal. Eggs from day one! Congrats!

 

[teach1rusl]

So do your birds freerange the majority of the time? Because to be honest, I was kind of freaking, thinking of 5 birds being confined to a coop/run that size. Depending on your area's weather, and how much you free range, expanding the run would have been my first thought, but maybe they're outside most of the time...
The only potential problem I see with your plan to expand is that birds generally like to roost at the highest point, so if your nest boxes go up above on the expansion, there's a good chance they will get roosted in. Also, I would move your food/water outside, since the run is covered. They just eat up too much space in there, and since it's so tight, no matter where you place a roost, they're likely to get droppings in them.
I would definitely use hardware cloth on your run. Personally, I'd just put it up over the welded wire that's on it now - unless it looks simple to remove. If you add a skirt, and everything is secure, then I'd probably opt out of a pop door myself, simply because the space is so tight inside there. Come winter, you can always add tarps, clear vinyl, etc. over the majority of the run sides to help keep out cold.
Oh - and just make sure you leave yourself an easy way to access the expansion interior.
May your modifications go smoothly!

 

[livinadream]

Thanks teach1rus and ddawn- I appreciate your wisdom.

The hens show no signs of aggression towards each other whatsoever, but I don't know how long that will last with this set up, now that I have some perspective on size ideals. (I'd read anywhere from 1.5 square feet to 4 square feet per chicken for the coop, and I guess I was hoping the lower number was fine.) At their old place, they free ranged in the yard from morning 'till night, so that's maybe why they've handled their set up so well so far. Here, I'd say they get about 3 hours of free range time a day, and I know there will be days when they get less (if we're sick and what not). My yard is entirely fenced in, but only with 4 foot chain link, so they're not as protected as they were in their old place with 6 foot privacy fencing. Also, I'd like to be around to be sure they don't destroy my garden (which is scattered through out the yard in various beds making it hard to fence in). I could fence in the area under the pine tree and let them have free range to that area when I can't be out with them. That would give them a yard about 12' by 24' to rummage in through out the day when I can't be out with them. I'm just worried they'll hop the 4 foot fence (or hop onto their enclosed run and then hop over the fence.) I've clipped their wings and haven't had any problems yet, but I could see them being motivated to get to the grassy lawn if they are restricted to under the pine tree.
If I convert the run or part of it into a coop, would you suggest I put flooring down? I'm thinking I'll do the deep litter method, if I can figure out how to do it well. In that case, would a dirt floor be ok (maybe even better as far as encouraging composting, right?) I hadn't thought of converting part of the run or even all of it--I like the idea. Seems like it would give me some great options for easier clean up. I have another run frame (8' by 4') covered in chicken wire that I could cover with hardware cloth and turn into their attached run. What say ye?

 

[rancher hicks]

1. you don't say where you live, but the heat lamp is probably not needed. Not with all that insulation.

2. I've modiify the run cover with an A frame of corrugated metal or plastic so snow runs off and does not sit on it. If you are an area that gets snow.

3. replace the roost with a 2x3. Round is not always good and I suspect they don't like it. Also they may be too warm when they are up there together.

4. I also suspect more birds get sick from being to warm than to cold. Smaller vent triangles on both from and back.

5. I would use a nipple waterering system inside the coop to keep things dry.

6. I would raise it up higher off the ground.

7. cover the run with either hardware cloth or poultry wire in addition to the wire you have and make sure all birds are inside the coop at night with a locked pop hole door.

 

[livinadream]

I'm making progress! Thanks for everyone's suggestions.

We've got vents put into the coop which ought to work while the weather is still cold, and we have plans drawn up to add another 12 square feet to the coop which will really help things out. We drew in lots of ventilation, exterior nest boxes (to maximize space) and good access doors for cleaning. We plan on keeping the run as is, and having it be the attached run where the chickens can have outside time during the day even if I leave for errands or what not. For when I'm home, I'm planning a fenced chicken run that will be about 200 square feet, and when we're out in the backyard, the chickens will be out with us. I'm excited to get started on our plans!

0h-and I haven't been using the heat lamp-I felt the same about not needing it in such cramped, insulated space.