Integrating 6 week and 8 week chicks with major size differences.

[MadamContrary]

I have three 8 week old large fowl and ten 6 week olds (3 EEs, 3 dark Brahmas, 3 silkies, 1 red sex link). The size ranges between all the birds is crazy, one silkie is tiny and the largest EE is still about a 1/3 of the size of the 8 week olds. I have had them in separate coops and runs about a foot apart for the past 2 weeks and want to move them all into the big coop and run but I'm concerned. I also don't want to wait too much longer as the younger ones are outgrowing the current coop. Any tips?

 

[rosemarythyme]

When you have time to supervise, put them all together - the oldest are just at the age where they still might accept newcomers without need for an extended integration. Having multiple feeders/waterers and new clutter around to distract may make things easier.

 

[Lin B]

I have found in the past, that waiting until it gets dark and they have gone to bed is best time to put them together. When they wake up in the morning they seem to think it has always been that way.. If you are worried you can set an alarm and be there in the morning when the wake up to observe them

 

[aart]

I have had them in separate coops and runs about a foot apart for the past 2 weeks and want to move them all into the big coop and run but I'm concerned.

Are either group already in the 'big coop'...any other birds in there?
If that big coop(how big actually in feet by feet?) is now empty
so it's new territory for both groups it could work.

When they wake up in the morning they seem to think it has always been that way

That might work..but like @bobbi-j sez:
"chickens aren't the brightest animals on this planet, but they're not that stupid."


Here's some tips about....
Integration Basics:
It's all about territory and resources(space/food/water).
Existing birds will almost always attack new ones to defend their resources.
Understanding chicken behaviors is essential to integrating new birds into your flock.

Confine new birds within sight but physically segregated from older/existing birds for several weeks, so they can see and get used to each other but not physically interact.

In adjacent runs, spread scratch grains along the dividing mesh, best if mesh is just big enough for birds to stick their head thru, so they get used to eating together.

The more space, the better. Birds will peck to establish dominance, the pecked bird needs space to get away. As long as there's no copious blood drawn and/or new bird is not trapped/pinned down and beaten unmercilessly, let them work it out. Every time you interfere or remove new birds, they'll have to start the pecking order thing all over again.

Multiple feed/water stations. Dominance issues are most often carried out over sustenance, more stations lessens the frequency of that issue.

Places for the new birds to hide 'out of line of sight'(but not a dead end trap) and/or up and away from any bully birds. Roosts, pallets or boards leaned up against walls or up on concrete blocks, old chairs tables, branches, logs, stumps out in the run can really help. Lots of diversion and places to 'hide' instead of bare wide open run.
Good ideas for hiding places:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/a-cluttered-run.1323792/

 

[Lin B]

I have had chickens on and off for 40 years and never had a problem with my method. Hope things work out for you

 

[Ridgerunner]

I have had them in separate coops and runs about a foot apart for the past 2 weeks and want to move them all into the big coop and run but I'm concerned.

Sometimes integration goes so smoothly you wonder what all the worry was and sometimes there are disasters. The more room you have in the coop, the more room you have in the run, and the more time all that space is available the better your chances but you don't get guarantees. It's just that way with living animals, you can never be sure what will happen.

I also don't want to wait too much longer as the younger ones are outgrowing the current coop.

Totally understandable. It sounds like you have at least three coops, at least three runs, and no chickens in the big coop and run. And that they are all outside now without supplemental heat. Knowing how big each coop and each run is and how they are all connected might give us some help in coming up with specific suggestions for your unique situation. Photos could be a big help.

Without that all we can do is be generic. Aart's list is good for any integration. The differences in their ages might make a difference or it might not. You just don't know.

Without knowing your specifics I'd put them all together on a morning when I can be around to observe. Give them as much room as you can for that first time together. If there is going to be violence give them a chance to run away. It's possible they will all mix and mingle into one happy flock. It may take a little while but they could get there. It's possible one or more of the older chicks could start viciously attacking a younger chick, seeking them out to destroy them. You'd need to intervene. What I think is most likely to happen is that the two groups each kind of stay to itself. If the younger approach the older they may get a peck to tell them to leave us alone so the younger quickly learn to keep a distance. In this case that peck is not a seek out to destroy but just a warning. It may take some judgement on your part. If one or more is going out of their way to injure a chick they need to be separated longer.

Do you consider that run predator proof? If it is you may be OK with some of them sleeping in the run for a while. Predator proof is a big issue with this.

If you are not extremely comfortable with them sleeping in the run I'd lock them all in the coop after dark. The coop needs to be dark enough that they can't see to attack each other. When I do this I just toss them in on the coop floor and let them sort out where they sleep in the dark. Some people like to set them on the roost but I don't see any real benefit in that.

Then I'd be down there at daybreak when they first wake up to see how it is going. If they are trapped in a small space together and it turns violent there is no room to run away. It can get serious pretty quickly. What I typically find when I do this with chicks and adults is that the adults are on the coop floor while the immature chicks are up on the roost or hiding under something. They are avoiding the adults. This is where clutter is important. It allows the ones that need to hide from the others to hide or avoid. Your Silkies can't fly so they can't go to the safety of the roosts if your roosts are high enough to be a safe place.

One reason I don't see a big benefit of putting them on the roost is that at that age your chicks may not be roosting anyway. With my chicks being integrated with adults they are not going to be sharing the roosts with the adults. Yours are close enough together they might if they can get to the roosts. Or they might decide to sleep in one huddle on the coop floor. I don't try to force them together but let them work that out at their pace.

My goal in integration is that no one gets hurt. All that other stuff of them becoming one happy flock hanging together and sleeping together can come later. It will as they mature. That's why I don't care where mine sleep as long as it is predator safe and not in my nests.

I've never locked strangers in the coop at night and expect them to wake up in the morning as best friends. My brooder is in the coop so the chicks grow up with the flock. My method of integrating them is to open the brooder door and walk away, usually when the chicks are 5 weeks old. I let them sort things out. If the main coop is crowded I raise chicks in my grow-out coop when I remove them from that brooder in the coop. In that case I let my chicks roam with the adults and the rest of the flock for a few weeks before I lock them in the coop at night to train them to sleep in the main coop, usually when around 12 weeks old. Yours are not total strangers. As long as your coop is a reasonable size with a few places to hide I would not expect that many problems even if your age difference was greater. But you never know what will happen.

Good luck!

 

[MadamContrary]

Thank you all! Very helpful information. These are my transitional "brooder" set ups. As you can see they're running out of space. The new coop is 21 square feet and the run is 10x10, ultimately we will only keep 7-8 chickens at adult size, I know I have a few roos in the mix and this coop will just be for layers. No one is using it, I was hopeful that the sudden change in territory would help with integration. I was originally thinking to move the 6 week olds in first to get them acclimated and then bring in the 8 week olds, but keep them all without sight of each other still.

I don't know how easy it is to see the size difference in the photos it seems like less of a size difference than it does in person. Maybe my concern it exaggerating it? I could combine both small runs together inside the larger run but, it's really sleeping arrangements that is going to be the issue before anything else. I wouldn't consider the new run predator proof, I still need to run hardware cloth along the bottom and haven't decided of we should use brick or a cement trench around the bottom. I have one more of these little runs I could use as well.
E.t.a.- Do you all think maybe I should keep the Silkies in the small set up until they're larger, and then try to integrate them or do you think it will make it harder in the long run? The tiny silkie is my biggest concern, it's on the bottom of the pecking order already and it seems like the 8 week Roo would be a real danger, they do have slightly vaulted skulls so I worry a good peck on the head might do a lot of damage.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I could combine both small runs together inside the larger run but, it's really sleeping arrangements that is going to be the issue before anything else.

All kinds of new information which leads to more options. If you are separating the boys out, I'd give a lot of thought to doing that now. Any time you add or subtract chickens you can mess with the pecking order. Go ahead and get all that out of the way now. Create a bachelor pad. Shaking things up like that may work in your favor. I think I see two boys in your 8-week-olds.

Another thought is to move one of those smaller coops into the new run and house one group in that for a while. Or link two in there to give more room. Keep one group in there until they learn to sleep in it, then let them roam during the day and return there to sleep at night. After they have proven they can roam together safely for a couple of weeks move them all to the big coop.

I think what I'd actually do is like I said before. Put them all in there in the morning and see what they do. If things go badly use one of these small coops in the big run to house them next to each other for a while.

I wouldn't consider the new run predator proof, I still need to run hardware cloth along the bottom and haven't decided of we should use brick or a cement trench around the bottom.

Instead of brick or a cement trench around it I'd suggest using an apron. Lay a piece of wire mesh about 18" wide flat around the run and attach it to the bottom of your fence. Overlap the corners. I like burying it about 2", which means moving the turf (if you have turf) and putting that back on top. That keeps it flat and out of the way of lawn mowers and weed eaters. The idea is that a digging predator goes up to the fence, starts digging, hits the wire, and does not know to back up. It's effective and may be easier than other methods.

Do you all think maybe I should keep the Silkies in the small set up until they're larger, and then try to integrate them or do you think it will make it harder in the long run?

I would not separate out the Silkies. I think that would make it harder in the long run. But go by what you see.

 

[MadamContrary]

All kinds of new information which leads to more options. If you are separating the boys out, I'd give a lot of thought to doing that now. Any time you add or subtract chickens you can mess with the pecking order. Go ahead and get all that out of the way now. Create a bachelor pad. Shaking things up like that may work in your favor. I think I see two boys in your 8-week-olds.

Another thought is to move one of those smaller coops into the new run and house one group in that for a while. Or link two in there to give more room. Keep one group in there until they learn to sleep in it, then let them roam during the day and return there to sleep at night. After they have proven they can roam together safely for a couple of weeks move them all to the big coop.

I think what I'd actually do is like I said before. Put them all in there in the morning and see what they do. If things go badly use one of these small coops in the big run to house them next to each other for a while.


Instead of brick or a cement trench around it I'd suggest using an apron. Lay a piece of wire mesh about 18" wide flat around the run and attach it to the bottom of your fence. Overlap the corners. I like burying it about 2", which means moving the turf (if you have turf) and putting that back on top. That keeps it flat and out of the way of lawn mowers and weed eaters. The idea is that a digging predator goes up to the fence, starts digging, hits the wire, and does not know to back up. It's effective and may be easier than other methods.


I would not separate out the Silkies. I think that would make it harder in the long run. But go by what you see.

You make some very good points, do you think the buff colored 8 weeker is a male? I did at first but I am leaning towards female now. The black one is a Marans cross and definitely a boy, I think I have an EE and very likely at least one silke male. That's kind of the tricky part because I'm not positive on the sex of several of them. I am seeing that deeper colored patch on the buff now, but I thought wing color indicators were mainly in the shoulder area, which I'm seeing development on one EE.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Black one for sure. The buff is questionable. At 8 weeks he has wattles, not good, but the comb and wattles aren't that red which is good. The legs look a little heavy but not that much. I think it is the posture that makes me think the buff might be a boy more than anything else. He stands awfully upright.