International Black Copper Marans Thread - Breeding to the SOP

[Chooks man]

great information. I think my pullet with copper hackles is marco's daughter.

are you not sure if he is or not her father ?
when we breed chooks ours selves we should know ,make the future mating easie.

chooks man

 

[baunlee]

There should be no copper or gold leakage in the Birchen Marans, if leakage exists then one or both parents are not true Birchen Marans (meaning they will not breed true).

I would think that Blue Birchens would breed the same as Blue Copper Marans meaning a Blue Birchen pairing should yield 50% Blue Birchen, 25% Black Birchen and 25% Splash. A Birchen Marans (black) bred to a Splash Birchen should yield 100% Blue Birchen.

thanks for explaining this!! choooksman can you confirm for us?

Right that was my thought. Even though I don't really know anywhere near as much on genetics as you all do. It did not seem sensical to me in plain logic to have copper present anywhere when a person is attempting to get a birchen. or blue birchen for that matter.

To clarify: when the seller stated "could be black, blue, or splash" that comment is not meant to include the variety of blue copper, ...right?

Sorry if I'm beating a dead horse I just have a sneaking suspicion they are going to respond to my email about how "the blue gene is a little different" and try to play it off like that is one of the possible combinations.

• going off Keith's comment (thanks again for that explanation) the "blue black or splash" comment is meant to cover Blue (birchen); Black (birchen), and Splash
• So there is no reason I should be expecting a blue copper from that?, right? even once the after the fact comment is considered. I thought I was upset before, getting 1 blue birchen out of 4 ordered. Now I'm even more upset getting 0 out of 4 with no reasonable explanation

I wonder what kind of odd combinations people who bought their "blue birchen marans EGGS are getting". I ordered chicks, but I find it hard to believe I'm the first person complaining. If you look at the website they are so expensive and still selling these. No ethics with this business. I'm sure they will write me back as they have previously about "how the blue gene in poultry is a little different" hahah yeah...not like THAT

I am writing a response email to them now, including that I want all of my money back (for the original order, plus the second order where I had paid for the chicks to meet shipping minimum of 5, so those 2 (paid) chicks with 3 chicks left unfulfilled from the original order)


I am so thankful to you all for your support and encouragement. <3

 

[chickengr]

are you not sure if he is or not her father ?
when we breed chooks ours selves we should know ,make the future mating easie.

chooks man

luna mated both mario and marco. as I had 1 pullet only I could not risk to get infertile eggs.

marco has better colour, more copper that's why I think he is the father of the chick with copper hackles. although mario could be as well. luna's mother had little mahogany in her hackles and luna has a bit more coloured hackles and it is copper. that means that mario fixed it. mario is luna's father and marco her full brother. I will separate them in the future breedings. I plan to keep 2 luna's sons and breed them with luna and marco will get luna's daughters only, maybe some of the 5 girls from my friend's eggs. I must see first if the young boys will be good cockerels. at the moment all 3 of them have nice copper in their hackles (5 weeks old). I like their eyes while at least 1 girl has a bit darker eyes. the chicks from my birds have lightly feathered legs while the other 5 girls have heavily feathered legs. I am sorry but I cannot take any pics at the moment.

 

[kcrandall]

thanks for explaining this!! choooksman can you confirm for us?

Right that was my thought. Even though I don't really know anywhere near as much on genetics as you all do. It did not seem sensical to me in plain logic to have copper present anywhere when a person is attempting to get a birchen. or blue birchen for that matter.

To clarify: when the seller stated "could be black, blue, or splash" that comment is not meant to include the variety of blue copper, ...right?

Sorry if I'm beating a dead horse I just have a sneaking suspicion they are going to respond to my email about how "the blue gene is a little different" and try to play it off like that is one of the possible combinations.

• going off Keith's comment (thanks again for that explanation) the "blue black or splash" comment is meant to cover Blue (birchen); Black (birchen), and Splash
• So there is no reason I should be expecting a blue copper from that?, right? even once the after the fact comment is considered. I thought I was upset before, getting 1 blue birchen out of 4 ordered. Now I'm even more upset getting 0 out of 4 with no reasonable explanation

I wonder what kind of odd combinations people who bought their "blue birchen marans EGGS are getting". I ordered chicks, but I find it hard to believe I'm the first person complaining. If you look at the website they are so expensive and still selling these. No ethics with this business. I'm sure they will write me back as they have previously about "how the blue gene in poultry is a little different" hahah yeah...not like THAT

I am writing a response email to them now, including that I want all of my money back (for the original order, plus the second order where I had paid for the chicks to meet shipping minimum of 5, so those 2 (paid) chicks with 3 chicks left unfulfilled from the original order)


I am so thankful to you all for your support and encouragement. <3

Baunlee,

A Blue Birchen Line (if it carries the pure silver / white gene) will never produce a Blue Copper just like a Blue Copper Line will never produce an occasional Blue Birchen. Copper leakage should only show up in a "project line" of Blue Birchen. While it is true that the blue variety (Blue Copper or Blue Birchen) will not breed true that only applies to the range of the blue color meaning you could have chicks that are light blue or dark blue and all shades of blue in between. I hatched 16 Blue Coppers this spring and I have the whole range of the blue spectrum.

If the Seller claims to have a "pure" Blue Birchen Line and is saying that "pure" Blue Birchens can sometimes produce a Blue Copper then the Seller either doesn't understand genetics or is a complete charlatan. I will leave that up to you to decide.

I hope this helps.

Take Care,
Keith

P.S. Blue Black Splash applies to the blue variety of many breeds of poultry. A Blue Mating Pair will give you Blue Black and Splash. If you google BBS Marans a breeding chart should pop up that will give you the different expected combinations.

 

[chickengr]

 

[chickengr]

I have a blue araucana from the flock that breeds true. I want to put him with black NNs that breed true. will I still get bbs? I guess his blue is different.

 

[baunlee]

A Blue Birchen Line (if it carries the pure silver / white gene) will never produce a Blue Copper just like a Blue Copper Line will never produce an occasional Blue Birchen. Copper leakage should only show up in a "project line" of Blue Birchen. While it is true that the blue variety (Blue Copper or Blue Birchen) will not breed true that only applies to the range of the blue color meaning you could have chicks that are light blue or dark blue and all shades of blue in between.

thanks for further explaining this! I did look over the inheritance charts before commenting on here before but I wanted to be sure. Thanks for your advice and information!!

 

[Bantambird]

My husband ordered 15 mixed blue, black (Birchen) and splash, received 17. Everyone lived. Ended up with 5 splash pullets, 3black pullets, 2 black Birchen cockerels with perhaps a bit of copper bleed through, 3 blue cockerels, one might have some copper hackles, and 4 blue pullets, one is definitely a blue copper through and through, but there are two nice blue Birchen pullets, and one that is solid blue. I'm seeing mossiness on the chest of two hens, and it is not white. Still, I think I should be able to work with these if I am careful in using Jack over some of these pullets. I feel ya on the color dilemma. I almost picked up some (silver) cuckoo to add for my genetic diversification (which my flock seems to need)

 

[eggbert420]

Just wanted to show y'all some of my birds. All different ages.

 

[orrpeople]

My first BCM hen is laying eggs... they are light brown. She hatched from a very dark shell... is there any chance her eggs will darken up?