International Black Copper Marans Thread - Breeding to the SOP

[Red Banks]

@RedBanks

from this shot we see =
Head = a little thin and long . sign of pullet
eyes .well colored light Blue
Comb = small sign of pullet
Beak = well formed and dark color ,sign of pullet
Leg = Straight well colored and feathered . free from any deformity . cockerels/pullets could have this color . hard to tell .What I can tell ,they are thinner sign of pullet .NOT thick and stocky sign of cockerel.

Chooks man

I hope so!

 

[Chooks man]

@RedBanks

From this shot we see =
well balanced body held well together .lifted from the front sign of a good legs joints and placement . this body type will never become goofy type .tilted to the front ( too much bird at the front )
the thigh and the shank are well formed .well bent not straight supporting the body well , without lifting it too much from the ground .
the back of the chick is nice straight a little tilted .

Take all this note .they will help you to see the marans chicks in a different way . not just cute and plum . a lot to look for at that age .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

HAPPY THANKSGIVING TO ALLView attachment 1193595 View attachment 1193596 View attachment 1193597 View attachment 1193598

Happy Thanksgiving to you.

you have a great BCM young stock coming along .love every things about them .
they log and thick body type .
they long flat back
great hackle marking
great tail . you have a correct tail to please both a French and US Judges . you have a square type tails and a thin pointed tails. both I can see they are short and wide at the bottom ,must have .
well colored shanks .

Bravo

The cockerel has a stunning body marking and great copper .his comb is not as great .
the back of it ( lobe) has many points not clean cut .plus has 6 points ( not good for US SOP 5 points are needed ) for the French you still good ( talking about the number of points ).
Both SOP looking for a lifted lobe ( back of the comb ) free from any split /point or side sprig .
I love every thing else on him specially his tail and quality of his copper .I ll breed him just for that . the Comb could be fixed by both parent . will be some culling if not mated to the right hen .
his hen should have a faultless comb that all the rest he ll take care of for sure .

chooks man

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

I am testing my comb knowledge here to see if I am thinking correctly. Upon looking at Gideon's comb again, I see 6 points.. right? The blade isn't split, the upper part of what I originally thought was the blade is actually another point (point 6). The blade does have a small notch in it, does that still make it a split blade? @Chooks man @RedBanks Is that right?

View attachment 1193637

you are mixing the blade of the comb to the posterior lobe of the comb
the Blade of the comb is what is between the points base and the base of the comb . other world . the middle long part of the comb .the part that give support .

Gideon s ( love the name .you are picking up very well ) comb has a good blabe not too thin neither too thick . no bent at the front S .
what are you thinking is a blade of the comb is actually the Lobe of the comb and what you think of as a 6 points is actually part of the lobe and is a split . here is a problem we are facing = for the French SOP Gideon has a show quality comb .the split lobe is not a disqualification ,the double point - see my Tobambezi comb - is a disqualification ,double point at the upper part of the Lobe . for the French the upper part of the Lobe of Gideon is long and clean supporting it self straight and high from the head .
the French don t want the double point at the part or the double point at the rear and side of the Lobe ( Coronation comb etc...............)
the points you missed ,the first one, where the end of the front of comb end there is a small point in there and there is a clear spacing between it at the point you think is 1 ( that is #2).Still for the French the number of the point is not important as long as they are well serrated and equally proportioned along the blade of the comb .

the US SOP call for a clean lobe free from any dent of point and need 5 points .
Gideon comb will causes a lot split decisions . some will say the is 6 points counting the first point you misted .and the Lobe is split . Others judges will see it the way you saw it .

For me as a marans breeders .Gideon comb is correct for breeding and will yield a show quality birds by any standard . just need to select to hen with a clean shaped ,lifted back of her comb ( lobe ),that all . one pairing close to greatness .

Agree with you Gideon is you best cockerel on comb and should be your main sire for that trait .mated to one of your pullet with a nice comb and start you show quality comb line . even if they have other fault .

Comb are autossome .inherited from both parents .never forget that .
work in each trait separately and breed it true .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

@Kfelton
here what I personally thinks of Gideon s comb .
based on my knowledge of a marans breed and my experience as breeder .

Gideon s comb is almost perfect .here way =
if you look at his comb you will see a parallel line between the upper part of the blade of comb ( where the point are jointed to the blade all the way back to the end of the lobe) ) and the lower part of the base of the comb ( where does meet the head and the lower part of the lobe).
this balanced and parallel 2 lines give s a comb elegance and uniformity all the way through from the front to the back .
when we breed this trait true in our flock .we ll never see again the arched large comb ,neither the thin narrow comb .
the second thing I see and I like .I think it is important to keep the comb well balanced for a long time will never tilted .is the straight line starting at the back of the comb ( the N6 point for you. very important future of the comb ) all the way to the front of the comb where does meet the beak . this line is well anchored and well suported from the back .
the point you think is number 6 it is some thing else . it is just a type of the upper part of the lobe and the tips . not actually the back part of it .
I personally found that the cockerels/roosters combs with around ( well arched ) Lobe
free from the point 6 ( the upper part of the tip of the lobe ) they get weaker with a time and they are sensitive to bending at the rear .

we are breeders not judges .
we need to keep what important to us in our breeding programs and breeding pens .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

I am with you on this. I am going to work with what I have. Kayla and I are okay right now because we both have the same birds in her FRF line but other than that I will just keep with the lines I have. It should take me the rest of my days to get them right.

you are underestimating you chooks .
you have a great base .
some work to do on the tail .
keep the golden out of the hackle
breed it out any parasitic white .
fix the comb

no much to do really few 4 or 5 years of selective breeding and you ll be there .50 chicks each year minimum for 4 years = 200 chicks ,4 generation .and ET VOILA .
RedBank BCM line .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

Yaay. At least 2 keepers for my dark egg breeders. With flash on.
View attachment 1194071

Really CLASS .
you have the darkest egg genes . keep it please .

they are very dark .BRAVO

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

If only I would’ve kept track of which of my 2 cockerels came from a darker egg!

if you are not sure .than work with them both .like that you make sure the genes will stays there .no lost of any genetic make up of your flock .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

Updated pic of my best cockerel. He is an LA (Apollo x #60). Love that long back.. I have high hopes for this boy. His comb is bad but otherwise I like him a lot.

View attachment 1194145 View attachment 1194146 View attachment 1194147

he is gorgeous .love his body type ,his long flat back and his great tail angle you where looking to improve .Forget about the comb .you can not fix every thing in one pairing .
you should be very ,very proud about fixing the tail angle just working with your chooks ( didn t go crazy and bought eggs from the net )
trust your self and do thing the way you are all ready doing them . great results are appearing .

Bravo .

chooks man

 

[LilJoe]

I have a gorgeous cockerel, but I brlieve he has one too many points if I counted correctly.