Japanese Bantam Thread!

[gardengoats11]

NovaAman, don't take the comments personnaly. It is an electronic forum and not meant to be long exhausting comments so the comments will sometimes not seem socially pleasing. Use the information as needed to meet your goals with your birds. That may mean the comment is immediately forgotten. So many of the comments are that the birds are "nice" or "look good." And are accurate for having pretty birds running around in the yard/barn. If you are interested in showing and take these birds to a show you may be very disappointed if there is any competition in a class. It would be better knowing going into a situation whether showing, selling, or enjoying to know the quality of your birds (incase your goals change).

It costs the same to poor quality birds as it does to raise high quality birds. Poultry is livestock and raising and breeding livestock has the goal of producing offspring with desirable traits. Those traits (for poultry breeds accepted by the APA) are defined in the SOP.

I haven't seen any comments that were directed towards anyone that were negative. I show other species of livestock and have heard the judges tell the exhibitor that the animal should have never left the barn alive. Those would be open show exhibitors. And the judges then go on to explain. But if one is going to get their feeling hurt by comments such as that then the exhibition show room may not be the place for them. In the case here the comments are in a forum title "Breeds, Genetics, & Showing." It would be unrealistic to not expect comments about the faults and positives of the breed being discussed/presented.

 

[NovaAman]

See, that was quite polite.

Now, I am thinking my cockerel is considered long legged? The girls would be short legged. Should I have him cover them then? I am trying to understand the fatal genes in that legged dept. Would there be a better chance of hatch, higher than the expected 50% by breeding that way, instead of just short leg to short leg and long to long?

 

[NYREDS]

What I have been told by a long-time, well known Japanese Bantam breeder is that you will never produce anything worth having by breeding from long legged birds. He also said if you have no other alternative you can use a medium length male [1" legs] but only as a last resort.
Will you produce more live chicks by using long-legged birds in your matings? Yes. The problem is they'll be long legged & of no value.
If your only interest is producing as many birds as possible by all means use long-legged birds in your matings.However, if you want to produce Japanese Bantams that conform to the Standard use only your short-legged birds in breeding pens. As someone pointrd out again a couple of posts back it costs the same to raise a poor bird as it does to raise a good bird. That being the case why set out to produce more poor birds?

 

[gardengoats11]

NYREDS

If a 1" leg is a medium length leg, what would be the length of a short leg? I thought that I read or heard some where that the leg length should be the width of a finger. Maybe I have fat fingers, but using my finger would be about0.75" I think I might need to revise what I am looking for in leg length.

 

[upthecreek]

Showed the Japs for the first time. had Reserve Champion Bantam on a white pullet at the Northern NY show. Mine came from Terry Wible last year. He literally wrote the book on japanese Bantams.

Congrats on your win !!!

I had a family of BTW from Terry many years ago ...... they were outstanding and could win . Terry is a good guy , he let me have these birds when he had some life problems .
Actually Terry did literally write a Book on Japanese Bantams (it's a good one)(that may have been what you were implying) i have a copy some where here at home (lol) .
Do you have any pics of birds from Terry ?

Shannon

 

[japman117201]

Bill, I hope you mean that I wrote a book about Japanese Bantams, not 'THE' book. There are a lot of great Japanese Bantam Breeders out there, much better than I am. After all, you are the person that culled and picked the bird that won. I simply supplied you with some breeders. This discussion about leg length and type and color really boils down to what you want to do with your chickens. If you never want to go to a show then keep everything, but if you want to show and don't want to be humiliated we really need to take a close look at what a Japanese Bantam is supposed to be. There are birds on here that look more like Leghorns than Japanese.
Just my opinion. I will drift back into the shadows.


Terry

 

[NYREDS]

NYREDS

If a 1" leg is a medium length leg, what would be the length of a short leg? I thought that I read or heard some where that the leg length should be the width of a finger. Maybe I have fat fingers, but using my finger would be about0.75" I think I might need to revise what I am looking for in leg length.

No, 3/4" is about right. That's the width of my finger as well. I lay my finger across the leg & I want to see feathers on one side & foot on the other.

 

[NYREDS]

Bill, I hope you mean that I wrote a book about Japanese Bantams, not 'THE' book. There are a lot of great Japanese Bantam Breeders out there, much better than I am. After all, you are the person that culled and picked the bird that won. I simply supplied you with some breeders. This discussion about leg length and type and color really boils down to what you want to do with your chickens. If you never want to go to a show then keep everything, but if you want to show and don't want to be humiliated we really need to take a close look at what a Japanese Bantam is supposed to be. There are birds on here that look more like Leghorns than Japanese.
Just my opinion. I will drift back into the shadows.


Terry

That's "THE" book I was talking about but that said had you not provided such a good start I wouldn't be producing birds as nice as the ones I'm producing.
The discussion here about Japanese Bantams is similar to discussions on other BYC threads. I like Japs but I don't like short legs; I like Cochins but I don't like feathered legs; I like Polish but I don't like crests; I like Muscovys but I don't like caruncles. People have actually said all these. To me it makes no sense. If you reject the defining breed characteristic of any breed How can you claim to be a proponent of that breed? If all you want is chickens sex link layers make more sense. They're feathered & much more productive.

 

[NovaAman]

Ok... So feathers on one side, foot on the other. Now, when isthe bird considered full grown to measure that. I think my 2 girls legs are much shorter than that...

Also, I picked up my white boy and looked at him from the rear with his tail flaired... What exactly makes it split tail? Should it be a perfect fan shape?

BTW, I got these birds from eggs that I got from Decoyman, and he has some very nice birds.

 

[NovaAman]

What I have been told by a long-time, well known Japanese Bantam breeder is that you will never produce anything worth having by breeding from long legged birds. He also said if you have no other alternative you can use a medium length male [1" legs] but only as a last resort.
Will you produce more live chicks by using long-legged birds in your matings? Yes. The problem is they'll be long legged & of no value.
If your only interest is producing as many birds as possible by all means use long-legged birds in your matings.However, if you want to produce Japanese Bantams that conform to the Standard use only your short-legged birds in breeding pens. As someone pointrd out again a couple of posts back it costs the same to raise a poor bird as it does to raise a good bird. That being the case why set out to produce more poor birds?

Gotcha. This I can understand. Just have to harden up to the 50% possible hatch rates. What I don't understand is why its desireable (sp?) to breed for a trait that kills 25-50% of off-spring?