Java Thread

[Chicken Coach]

Thank you for posting this bnjrob.i agree with you 100% .I was going to stop going to this post because all opinions and very few facts.I don't argue with people on there opinions on the internet.What's the point,and no one wins.I love my javas and have had them for many years.The man i got them from has had them for 40 years.I have some real good javas and some sorry ones too. That's why we cull and improve. I have all colors of them and they are some of my best sellers.It's great to see other people happy to get them and help keep the breed alive.Lets all keep going and try to help each other.

 

[The Old Yolks]

I didn't mean to stir up a hornets nest and I apologize if I offended anyone. I was just frustrated to see that all my good intentions could prove to be worthless efforts if the birds I am raising and trying to improve aren't going to be seen as anything more then, for a lack of a better word, a mutt. Because I am so new to breeding chickens opinions are all I have to judge what I am doing right or wrong until I have established my own facts through experience. My goal was to help preserve a heritage breed and finding the auburn java was like the icing on the cake for me. I agree wholeheartedly with Chicken Coach that we all share the love of this particular breed, whatever color you fancy, and should all do our best to insure it stay alive and well kept for our furture generations. I'm going to continue on the path I started on and enjoy my beautiful birds. Hopefully through deligent and careful breeding the auburn color will be brought to standards that will finally be recognized. I'm going to keep my fingers crossed.

 

[bnjrob]

I didn't mean to stir up a hornets nest and I apologize if I offended anyone. I was just frustrated to see that all my good intentions could prove to be worthless efforts if the birds I am raising and trying to improve aren't going to be seen as anything more then, for a lack of a better word, a mutt. Because I am so new to breeding chickens opinions are all I have to judge what I am doing right or wrong until I have established my own facts through experience. My goal was to help preserve a heritage breed and finding the auburn java was like the icing on the cake for me. I agree wholeheartedly with Chicken Coach that we all share the love of this particular breed, whatever color you fancy, and should all do our best to insure it stay alive and well kept for our furture generations. I'm going to continue on the path I started on and enjoy my beautiful birds. Hopefully through deligent and careful breeding the auburn color will be brought to standards that will finally be recognized. I'm going to keep my fingers crossed.

I don't think you stirred up a hornets nest and you sure didn't offend me. I was worried that you were feeling horrible because you thought you were doing something wrong - and so far as I can tell, you aren't doing anything wrong. You're raising chickens and enjoying yourself and not hurting anybody. No one knows what the future will bring and if you decide not to go further with the auburn color - that's your choice. But don't do it because someone else doesn't like it. Work on your auburns and see where you get to with them. You could end up being the person that gets them admitted to the APA some day.

No one should let other people use their unsupported opinions to bully them into submitting to their ideas of something.

As for me - I'm getting frustrated with the party line that I have seen from some of the "old" breeders who then get snooty about other people's flocks. When asking for specific information on javas or even asking if anyone has anecdotal documentation from their own breeding, I'm referred to poultry books written at the turn of the 20th century, or told to "breed to the APA standard".

That's like telling me that I need to make a chocolate cake from scratch but refusing to give me the recipe.

Last night I looked at a book published in 1908 about the history of chickens. It had just the barest mention of javas. It discussed that there was a breeder that was quite opinionated about javas, and went on to take an excerpt of something this breeder had written about them. This breeder had stated that mottled javas were "counterparts" of black javas and were the result of mating a black java rooster and a "large white hen" in 1872.

OK, does that mean that mottled javas are NOT really javas? The APA who is apparently the "Chicken God", says that mottleds ARE javas - just a color variation. And white javas were on the list until the APA decided they looked too much like another white chicken. Can't have it both ways - can't tell people to breed to the APA standard but then say that only blacks are actually true javas when the APA recognizes another color as being a java. Either the APA is THE Chicken God or they are not.

Who knows. I just know that so far, no one has been able to give me straight answers to the questions I have posed regarding the specifics of java genetics. Shoot, I can't even get anyone to admit that they have ever seen a mottled java have a son that is mostly black with gold feathering. It was only after finding the notation about red and "straw" colors coming up in both black and mottled javas from a book published in 1923 that I realized that apparently this gene does exist even in mottleds. Thus far, with the lack of answers I am getting, I just have to assume that no one knows much of anything scientific about java genetics and that is why they haven't been able to answer my questions with hard data.

Questions, questions, questions.

 

[bnjrob]

Thank you for posting this bnjrob.i agree with you 100% .I was going to stop going to this post because all opinions and very few facts.I don't argue with people on there opinions on the internet.What's the point,and no one wins.I love my javas and have had them for many years.The man i got them from has had them for 40 years.I have some real good javas and some sorry ones too. That's why we cull and improve. I have all colors of them and they are some of my best sellers.It's great to see other people happy to get them and help keep the breed alive.Lets all keep going and try to help each other.

Don't stop coming to this thread - we need more input from everyone and since I'm a newbie to java breeding, you might have some ideas that we all could use. Right now, everything is fascinating as I learn and hear opinions and form my own conclusions - the worst thing would be a dearth of any input.

 

[haTHOR]

haTHOR, I send you a PM. Did you get it??

ugh, no. crazy times. i am moving to the northeast for a big new job and having to sell off my entire project, including BJs, olive eggers, FBCMs, and ameracaunas. i will check into the pm, sorry.

 

[flowerchild59]

I have noticed on the 9 chicks that I hatched out that some have a definate yelllowish color and and some are more creamy. Does that mean anything or is it purely coinincidance? My coro sussex hen sure is a nice mama. Very sweet bird. Here is a cute shot of one of the chicks peeking out from her wing. You can see the down color I was talking about on the creamy colored chicks in the back of the picture and the more yellow one in the front.

 

[java girl 2]

haTHOR, I send you a PM.  Did you get it??

ugh, no.  crazy times.  i am moving to the northeast for a big new job and having to sell off my entire project, including BJs, olive eggers, FBCMs,  and ameracaunas.  i will check into the pm, sorry.

I did a new PM to you!!!!!!. PLEASE read it!!!!

 

[haTHOR]

I READ IT! AND REPLIED!!!!! lol

 

[The Old Yolks]

So last night I just couldn't wait any longer to candle my eggs I got from Chickielady & Soaring Chicks, I made a promise to myself when I put the eggs in the bator to leave it alone. Just walk away until day 14 no looking, no touching. Well, I sure wish I wouldn't have listened to myself now. I started candling the eggs and they all looked very odd. First off none of them were moving, and the embryo's were sorta pressed up against the shell. For those of you who have years of experience I'm sure you know exactly what happened. My egg turner stopped working! I was sick and what made it even worse out of 33 eggs only 5 weren't at some point of development. AWFUL

I know things happen to people all the time while hatching but this was my first truly bad experience. I am done with hatching for the year, perhaps forever. This was heartbreaking for me. I know there has been some controversy about the auburn javas but the 7 babies I have from my first hatch are absolutely priceless to me. Now to get my courage up enough to call my neighbor and tell her the eggs I had in bator of hers are dead. Sad sad day at my house. Hope you all have a Blessed Day.

 

[bnjrob]

So last night I just couldn't wait any longer to candle my eggs I got from Chickielady & Soaring Chicks, I made a promise to myself when I put the eggs in the bator to leave it alone. Just walk away until day 14 no looking, no touching. Well, I sure wish I would have now. I started candling the eggs and they all looked very odd. First off none of them were moving, and the embryo's were sorta pressed up against the shell. For those of you who have years of experience I'm sure you know exactly what happened. My egg turner stopped working! I was sick and what made it even worse out of 33 eggs only 5 weren't at some point of development. AWFUL

I know things happen to people all the time while hatching but this was my first truly bad experience. I am done with hatching for the year, perhaps forever. This was heartbreaking for me. I know there has been some controversy about the auburn javas but the 7 babies I have from my first hatch are absolutely priceless to me. Now to get my courage up enough to call my neighbor and tell her the eggs I had in bator of hers are dead. Sad sad day at my house. Hope you all have a Blessed Day.

So sorry!