Livestock guardian dogs

[mkeawsh]

I have a Great Pyrenees and he is great. He watches and protects my goats and chickens and he is very serious about it. I did not have to train him. He grew up and lives with the goats and the chickens. The chicken house and tractors are right next to the goat pen. He NEVER enters our home and doesn't want to either. He is here to protect my livestock. He has chased away dogs, coyotes, hawks, that were diving for my free-ranging chickens and great horned owls that were doing the same. Buddy gets a lot of love from me daily and is a wonderful loving dog to adults, loooooves my grand children and is so gentle with them. If you bring him into your home, his focus and main concern is not going to be your livestock but the humans. The dog will have to be trained to do his job, if he is brought into the house and then the dog will still not be as diligent or aggressive as one that has been focused on his responsibilities or charges.

 

[INFIDEL]

I agree with most of what is being said here...
FIrst and most important is my OPINION that birds are the most difficult livestock for LGD's to work with... too tempting for puppies to play rough with... its not really a breed thing, pyr vs ana vs marama... but the luck of the draw with the pup you get from the litter... you want the pup no later than 9 weeks old... between 2-4months of age the dog will build 90% of his socialization skills..... this is the most important time to have him around livestock... and when it comes to birds its best if the breeder has the pups with birds from day one...
Having said all of this I would NEVER leave my pups alone with livestock until they have chilled out/aged... even if they are perfect with the birds... you have to be there to correct them the its time something goes wrong or starts too... DON'T TRUST A PUPPY... different breeds chill at different rates... from my experience Anatolians/kangals take about 1-2 years... I have been trying Boz Shepherds recently and they chill much faster, maybe 10-14 months...
Any other livestock guardian dogs like Great Pyr get slaughtered by the wolves we have here and even coyotes as I know of one woman who watched her huge male Pyr get its neck broke in one bite by a large coyote...(no Spike collar)
The only other LGD's that can go up against a wolf and have a chance, like ovcharkas, are usually time bombs and too dangerous in this day and age...
The Boz Shepherd's are the best of both world... They don't bluff bark like (animals1981) talks about... the wolves see my dogs barking with intent to kill not just deter them, and then they keep walking... this has happened many times... (when my neighbors dogs bark at wolves, they get eaten).... But also the Boz Shepherds are basically Bombproof with kids... Truly the best of both worlds... a rarity in the dog world... Most LGD's either are too friendly and weak OR super strong/viscous and a liability...
Check NaturalBornGuardians.com
I have bought a few Boz Shepherds from him over the years... great bloodlines, good business man with good ethics, I have been robbed blind by some LGD breeders.... NBG is great
I guess the best way to put it is, IMHO they are the best LGD's... super athletes, super tough, super weather hardy, super good w livestock, super good with people, super HUGE
They may be overkill for you if you don't have Grizzly, Mt.Lions or Wolves... But who wants a small LGD??? And these guys can run faster and farther than you can fathom...
Here is my male with a Kid he met 2 minutes before the photo... he is NEVER around kids... but he does love them dearly... All my Boz Shepherds LOVE Children...
Call NBG and ask him(Brian) for some input... he has a lot of experience to offer...

 

[jasmer]

Interesting thread. We're considering a livestock guardian dog. We currently have 17 chickens we free range (but lock up at night). We want to increase that number to 20 or 25 permanent chickens as well as whatever we hatch for meat. We also want to add a couple sheep and goats. I live in Idaho, where our primary livestock threats are coyotes, raccoons, and dogs, but if the state continues to fail to properly manage the wolf population they may become a nuisance as well in the future.

We live on 5 acres, surrounded by other 5 acre lots, and several of our neighbors have children or grandchildren who visit often. We caught the neighbor's kids trespassing on our property, which doesn't really bother us since they were just passing through, but the likelihood of them doing this on a regular basis is probably pretty good.

We were considering the maremma or anatolian. Would such a dog work for us? Do these dogs tend to wander off? Are they aggressive toward strange people? Obviously we have a lot of research to do, but before I start do you think one or two of these dogs would be suitable for our situation?

 

[centrarchid]

Interesting thread. We're considering a livestock guardian dog. We currently have 17 chickens we free range (but lock up at night). We want to increase that number to 20 or 25 permanent chickens as well as whatever we hatch for meat. We also want to add a couple sheep and goats. I live in Idaho, where our primary livestock threats are coyotes, raccoons, and dogs, but if the state continues to fail to properly manage the wolf population they may become a nuisance as well in the future.

We live on 5 acres, surrounded by other 5 acre lots, and several of our neighbors have children or grandchildren who visit often. We caught the neighbor's kids trespassing on our property, which doesn't really bother us since they were just passing through, but the likelihood of them doing this on a regular basis is probably pretty good.

We were considering the maremma or anatolian. Would such a dog work for us? Do these dogs tend to wander off? Are they aggressive toward strange people? Obviously we have a lot of research to do, but before I start do you think one or two of these dogs would be suitable for our situation?

All the LGD's are prone to roam relative to what a 5 acre plot will provide. At work our dogs are moved about with herds of 50 to 100 sheep / goats from paddock to paddock but fence is required to keep them from roaming. The anatolians tend to be people aggressive with me as an infrequent trespasser but get along with parties managing livestock. Not all anatolians are people aggressive and I can not speak for maremmas. Great Pyrenees are plenty loud but those we have are bit slow. If only 25 chickens involved, then upkeep of dogs will exceed that of poultry.

 

[jasmer]

That's okay. Our concern is we live in coyote country, and with my state's obscene mismanagement of the wolf population they are fast becoming vermin as well. We plan on getting a few pigs, goats, and sheep too, in the future, so a dog is looking more and more like something we might want, even for our small homestead.

 

[centrarchid]

That's okay. Our concern is we live in coyote country, and with my state's obscene mismanagement of the wolf population they are fast becoming vermin as well. We plan on getting a few pigs, goats, and sheep too, in the future, so a dog is looking more and more like something we might want, even for our small homestead.

Multiple LGD's best if one or two wolves or domestic dogs expected. If wolf pack bigger, then LGD's need to at least match. Wolves expected to be an issue in urban setting? They are generally pretty demanding about having healthy prey base which people living in 5 acre plots will not tolerate.

 

[jasmer]

No, if we see wolves on our property we'll probably shoot them as there is no reason for them to be in our area other than than looking to eat some livestock. Wolves were reintroduced where I live, they had been eradicated and in an attempt to repair the ecosystem they reintroduced them and then failed to properly manage them. They're quickly chewing through their native food supply and are reproducing much more quickly than expected, so at this rate of massive mismanagement it's only a matter of time before they start sniffing about the outskirts of town--where we live--for something to eat. I do not fear the wolves, there are only a handful of wild wolf attacks that were not clearly provoked in North American history, but I am fully convinced that they might start coming after easier prey--like sheep or chickens--if Fish and Game doesn't stop screwing around and manage them better.

We aren't particularly worried about the wolves, they're still a very remote thing. Our concern is coyotes and stray dogs, both of which are all over the place. Mountain lions don't cause problems where we live, you have to live further out to encounter them in any capacity, and bears are only a problem during a bad huckleberry season when they come raid the trash. It's the coyotes and loose dogs that concern us.

 

[centrarchid]

Coyotes I have can be handled by a single LGD pretty easily. Occasionally some folks say coyotes damaged or killed an LGD here or there but all instances I am aware of, dogs where actually culprit. Just sounds sexier for wildlife to have done it. If dogs as in plural, then multiple LGDs may be required. Coyotes can be smart and tag team LGD with one distracting dog while other sneaks around and snatches a bird. Even some domestic dogs with pasture smarts can pull that off.

 

[INFIDEL]

Centrarchid
How are GP slower??? Mentally or physically???
Jasmer
You will have a better chance of shooting big foot than a wolf FYI...
Though every now and then you hear of people shooting them on their porch as they are eating their dog
I would run two Kangal or Boz on your 5 acres... maybe a CO if you can find a breeder who has a breeding pair that doesn't scare you when you visit...

 

[mkeawsh]

Multiple LGD's best if one or two wolves or domestic dogs expected. If wolf pack bigger, then LGD's need to at least match. Wolves expected to be an issue in urban setting? They are generally pretty demanding about having healthy prey base which people living in 5 acre plots will not tolerate.

I agree. If we had an issue with wolves, I would be getting more than one GP. We have had coyotes visit a couple times and Buddy has taken care of them. At night we have Niteguards flashing and nothing gets near the goat enclosure or the chicken tractors and house. We've heard the coyotes many times at night but they never come close. Numerous times, I have even left eggs sitting on a chair and on the lid of tractors and they are still there the next day thanks to the Niteguards. They are Buddy's helpers for protecting at night.