Looking for advice on how to respond to cockerel's "dance?"

[Shadrach]

I was thinking about this again this morning while watching the rooster move the hens around. Perhaps part of the disconnect between our ways of thinking is because you are a man and view it more like this



and I, as a woman, see it as more of an aggressive and dominating behavior when it's directed at me, such as described here



What happens next if the hen doesn't react to his hackle flash?

ETA- The interactions I've seen between the dogs and roosters is at first a shuffling, then hackles flashes, then if they dogs still haven't moved on, it proceeds to chasing pecking, flogging and spurring.

I do hope this is the result of a bad thinking day. Consider the implications of what you've written above. It has nothing to do with what sex one is. It may have a lot to do with ones culture, ones confidence, ones self esteem and ones knowledge. I don't mind if a rooster thinks I need herding. He is probably right. Ask my daughter. Given the mainly female nature of this site, I suggest you reconsider the stereo type you've just painted.

 

[Folly's place]

As a woman, i hear what @Geena is saying loud and clear!
Mary

 

[Geena]

I do hope this is the result of a bad thinking day. Consider the implications of what you've written above. It has nothing to do with what sex one is. It may have a lot to do with ones culture, ones confidence, ones self esteem and ones knowledge. I don't mind if a rooster thinks I need herding. He is probably right. Ask my daughter. Given the mainly female nature of this site, I suggest you reconsider the stereo type you've just painted.

I don't like to anthropomorphize animals, so I really try to look at their behaviors objectively. But as a woman (yes) when I see any male bully a female through physical dominance it makes me cringe. I just can't see it as loving or caring as you seem to.

But I don't interfere with anything the animals do as long as nobody is getting hurt and they aren't destroying anything. In turn I expect the same respect from them, so when a rooster is shuffling, or flaring or coming at me, that's not okay in my book. He needs to mind his own business too.

I have plenty of confidence and self esteem, knowledge? I'm always in learning mode. Culture probably comes into play, I was raised to believe that I shouldn't let anyone push me around, and I don't, not even a cocky little rooster

 

[Shadrach]

I don't like to anthropomorphize animals, so I really try to look at their behaviors objectively. But as a woman (yes) when I see any male bully a female through physical dominance it makes me cringe. I just can't see it as loving or caring as you seem to.

But I don't interfere with anything the animals do as long as nobody is getting hurt and they aren't destroying anything. In turn I expect the same respect from them, so when a rooster is shuffling, or flaring or coming at me, that's not okay in my book. He needs to mind his own business too.

I have plenty of confidence and self esteem, knowledge? I'm always in learning mode. Culture probably comes into play, I was raised to believe that I shouldn't let anyone push me around, and I don't, not even a cocky little rooster

A cultural chasm as wide as the grand canyon is evident. The is no greater evidence of fear than the need to destroy that which one cannot control. I'll call it a day on this thread with that thought.

 

[Folly's place]

So we went way off topic, sorry. I do apologize...
Mary

 

[MrsNorthie]

I was thinking about this again this morning while watching the rooster move the hens around. Perhaps part of the disconnect between our ways of thinking is because you are a man and view it more like this



and I, as a woman, see it as more of an aggressive and dominating behavior when it's directed at me, such as described here



What happens next if the hen doesn't react to his hackle flash?

ETA- The interactions I've seen between the dogs and roosters is at first a shuffling, then hackles flashes, then if they dogs still haven't moved on, it proceeds to chasing pecking, flogging and spurring.

I made one simple change and I am already seeing a change in our dominant, I take the treats in, but basically throw them at his feet and walk away. He calls all the girls over and they snack happily. I go about my other tasks, filling feeders, tidying up, etc and he is not being aggressive.

Another funny behaviour that has started with the other 2 roosters, when I go near the run but not in, they run to the wire and start picking bits of grass or clover, they drop it at the edge of the fence and start making the "I found a snack..." noise and they follow me around the perimeter repeating the behaviour...lol

I think the hackle flash that @Shadrach is referring to, is the rooster knows that they are in a potentially dangerous situation, exposed, daylight fading, and is trying to hurry the hen along to get to safety. Not aggression, just security and the rooster likely returns to the hen, gets her attention and herds her to safety. The interaction with the dogs is like because the rooster feels the dogs are a predator, a threat to the flock and not a behaviour that would be directed towards his hens. The article that @Shadrach recommended: https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/understanding-your-rooster.75056/ is brilliant and eye-opening.

 

[MrsNorthie]

and I, as a woman, see it as more of an aggressive and dominating behavior when it's directed at me, such as described here

I would like to suggest that Hens rely on the Rooster for security so they can focus on getting enough food to produce eggs and rooster behaviour may seem domineering, but the lives of his flock depend on him taking charge. Remember, hens haven't burned their bras, they are dependent on the male for safety.

Chickens have different ways of communicating and it isn't male dominance in the way that some humans can or are perceived to behave. If my husband sees a danger that I don't, I expect and appreciate his warnings and protection and in an emergency he isn't going to worry about hurting my feelings, just making me safe.

 

[Sussex19]

To me, the thing is I (and I know there are many people like me) only need two, or at most three roosters. Some only need one.
I 'could' keep a permanent bachelor flock, but with no natural predators it would soon get far, far to over crowded. Besides, I couldn't feed that many, and I don't have enough land for them to find there own food to any extent.
So of the 50 or so cockerels I've had, only 2 have been kept. So out of that many, why not keep only the very best, those that I have a partnership with, that look after their hens, but also trust me.
And this applies to everyone to some extent, even if you buy your rooster, because there is always going to be 10 more needing a home.

 

[Geena]

I made one simple change and I am already seeing a change in our dominant, I take the treats in, but basically throw them at his feet and walk away. He calls all the girls over and they snack happily. I go about my other tasks, filling feeders, tidying up, etc and he is not being aggressive.

Another funny behaviour that has started with the other 2 roosters, when I go near the run but not in, they run to the wire and start picking bits of grass or clover, they drop it at the edge of the fence and start making the "I found a snack..." noise and they follow me around the perimeter repeating the behaviour...lol

I think the hackle flash that @Shadrach is referring to, is the rooster knows that they are in a potentially dangerous situation, exposed, daylight fading, and is trying to hurry the hen along to get to safety. Not aggression, just security and the rooster likely returns to the hen, gets her attention and herds her to safety. The interaction with the dogs is like because the rooster feels the dogs are a predator, a threat to the flock and not a behaviour that would be directed towards his hens. The article that @Shadrach recommended: https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/understanding-your-rooster.75056/ is brilliant and eye-opening.

I have seen Shadrach's article and yes, it's very good!

At the risk of "getting it with both barrels" again , I'd caution you to keep an eye on the two that are following you around and tidbitting, that's sometimes a prelude to aggression. IME the best boys are the ones that focus their attention on the hens and not on me.

 

[LaFleche]

I hope it's okay I revive this thread.

I am trying to learn about cockerels and cockerel behavior, now that I have my first one, or possibly two, inadvertent young cocks.

Their temperament is night and day. No sooner had I realized that Marshmallow was a cockerel, the next day, he mated my hand. I was shocked! I had no idea he would do that, least of all a 2.5 week old chick!!! So I stopped handling or petting him any more than necessary and it's been fine. Until yesterday evening, he flew at me, like he will fly at the wall of the pen. He kind of flew at my hip, and I didn't really respond, except to brush him off. He's five weeks now.

This morning, doing all my morning things and moving them into the enclosure with the big chickens (they are still sleeping in a brooder in the basement at night), I was basically ignoring, but didn't realize he must have been slightly perched on a ladder. I must have turned my back to him to adjust a feeder or something and next thing I knew, he flew onto my back. Ugh.

I wasn't sure exactly what to do, but I stood up and took him off my back, so I had him by the feet. He sat / flustered in my hand like that for a moment, while I decided what to do with him, so I hung him down until he stopped flapping. And when he was finally calm and relaxed, I placed him gently on the ground. I finished what I had to do and left the enclosure. It looked like he stayed on the ground like that for a few moments before getting up and going back to his business.

So I guess I have the same question as OP. How do I respond to these types of behavior? Did I do the right thing? How long do I need to grow him out / give him a chance before I cull? At five weeks, he's certainly not going to hurt me, but my knee jerk reaction is to say if he's got these kind of behaviors going on right out of the gate, how much work is it worth teaching him to behave?

I am sure there is the possibility he may come around and behave just fine, hypothetically, but that remains to be seen. What can I do in the meantime to give him the best chance of coming around? Or if / when I decide he's a cull, what do I do with him? Should I just separate him and grow him out at that point? I'm all new to this, and I have a lot to learn, so any advice and links to good articles would be appreciated.

Alternately, the other suspected cockerel is a little harder to catch, he's more timid and runs away from me vs. Marshmallow who was always so "friendly" and bold. Sterling I would rather keep as a mate for Ivy, as well, as they are both Silver Laced Wyandottes, where Marshmallow is either a Starlight Green Egger or Sex Link who won't breed true anyway. If I had all the space in the world, I wouldn't be opposed to keeping a bold, brave rooster in the mix who's more or less expendible, but only if he's not causing me problems.

Did you raise them yourself or with a broody?

This above mentioned behaviour can stem from letting the little chicks perch and sleep on your when raising them without a mother hen. They will then see you as their mother and perch and jump on you as they would on their mother hen. And when bringing a dish with their food this can lead to them flying up to your shoulder to be the first to get to see what yummy stuff you bring.

But some cockerels get early hormonal overdrive and even try to mate with their mother hens and hatch mates, the earliest I saw with mine was a BCM at 3,5-4 weeks old.