Making a California grey?

[shmccarthy]

I was reading about California grey chickens and how they were originally derived from a Barred Plymouth Rock rooster with a White leghorn hen. I have read mixed information about them, I believe. Some sources say that they are made over many generations of breeding but I also read that they don't breed true. I'm just confused now I think. I have a barred rock rooster

And two white leghorn pullets

The other pullet has some spots on her breast with lightly barred feathers. I don't have a picture of her though.
I know the barred rock rooster isn't show quality or anything, but I think he is really pretty and even more so important he is extremely sweet tempered. I am going to be hatching eggs a bit after my pullets start laying, and was wondering if breeding him and my white leghorns would produce California grey or at least something like them?
I've read that the white leghorns color is dominant but so is barring I think. And I saw some pictures of "ghost barring" from crossing a white leghorn rooster with a barred rock hen. Would I not have ghost barring because my rock is a rooster? If anyone has any information/thoughts about this, it would be greatly appreciated because I think I'm just confusing myself! Hah

 

[Eelantha]

Very interesting questions you have here, I'm curious as to the creation/continuation of California Greys too so I'll be tagging this post closely in case someone gives an answer someday.

 

[centrarchid]

California Grays do breed true and to best of my knowledge developed from a cross of Barred Plymouth Rock and White Leghorn. They are used to make California Whites by crossing with White Leghorns. The resulting California White females are white with patches of nonwhite mixed in.

 

[Eelantha]

California Grays do breed true and to best of my knowledge developed from a cross of Barred Plymouth Rock and White Leghorn. They are used to make California Whites by crossing with White Leghorns. The resulting California White females are white with patches of nonwhite mixed in.

By breeding true, do you mean that if I mate the F1 babies from my Plymouth Rock roo x White leghorn hen, then those california greys will produce more California Greys? Sorry for asking this question, but I'm not familiar yet with all the abbreviations/terms used on this site, much less the complicated, oftentimes very confusing poultry vocabulary used in the art of breeding chickens xP

Also, I've read at least three times that California Grey roosters are manfighters on top of aggressive breeding males on the hens. Is this caused by one of the two parent's temperament, or a result of the cross between the two breeds? The rookie chicken backyarder that I am fancies (among other possible chicken projects) a colorful egg basket provided by nice, calm, cold hardy chickens; most white-egg layers are flighty and disadvantaged against the cold, so the California Grey appeals alot to me for being a white egg layer that fits all of my needs. But if the male of the non-standard species is a renown man fighter, I'll back off the breed for my own safety.

 

[nicalandia]

By breeding true, do you mean that if I mate the F1 babies from my Plymouth Rock roo x White leghorn hen, then those california greys will produce more California Greys? Sorry for asking this question, but I'm not familiar yet with all the abbreviations/terms used on this site, much less the complicated, oftentimes very confusing poultry vocabulary used in the art of breeding chickens xP.

No he meant that the breed on itself was stabilized by it's creators to breed true, if you cross your F1 cross to each other you will only generate Mongrels that will vary in size, color and temperament.. Recreating a breed from its known constituent parent breed is really not easy at all, if you would like to breed a California Grey type of breed, I suggest using a Barred Rock rooster over a Brown Leghorn hens, F1 Hens will be barred and intermediate in size and laying capabilities, if you would like larger hens than the F1 hens, just cross them back to Barred Rock, all birds will be barred, but if you would like to have a smaller more productive bird just cross the F1 cokerels back to Brow Leghorns, 50% of the back cross to Leghorn will be Barred

 

[Eelantha]

No he meant that the breed on itself was stabilized by it's creators to breed true, if you cross your F1 cross to each other you will only generate Mongrels that will vary in size, color and temperament.. Recreating a breed from its known constituent parent breed is really not easy at all, if you would like to breed a California Grey type of breed, I suggest using a Barred Rock rooster over a Brown Leghorn hens, F1 Hens will be barred and intermediate in size and laying capabilities, if you would like larger hens than the F1 hens, just cross them back to Barred Rock, all birds will be barred, but if you would like to have a smaller more productive bird just cross the F1 cokerels back to Brow Leghorns, 50% of the back cross to Leghorn will be Barred

Aha, so the F1 babies don't breed true from the get-go... I should have known there was a catch somewhere, obviously when it comes to making a chicken it's never that easy! xD

But, how come I need to use brown leghorns for this cross, if the first California greys were bred by mixing Barred Rock roosters and White Leghorn hens together? I thought the barred genes would show over the white plumage despite the leghorn possessing the dominant white gene?

 

[nicalandia]

I thought the barred genes would show over the white plumage despite the leghorn possessing the dominant white gene?

Not at all... Dominant white will turn any barring pattern to all white, the benefit of using brown leghorns over white leghorns is that white leghorns will hide so many unwanted genes under the all white color, on my crossing to white leghorns(F1xF1) I have found, mottling, blue, barring, ER Birchen and when doing a breeding project you don't want to waste time and many generations getting rid of unwanted genes, that is why the brown leghorn are about the best possible cross when recreating a "California Grey" type of bird

 

[Eelantha]

Oooh... so breeding two F1 together gives this many color varieties? Interesting.

But, one thing I want in my own California Greys is a comb better suited for the cold... giving them the brown leghorn's (Rose? Pea?) comb would be a good idea in this case. Finding a brown Leghorn though, that will be something - the most popular one in Quebec is the industrial white leghorn, the brown one is almost nonexistent xD The cushion comb would be even better; I wonder if the california grey will retain his white egg color if I cross the f1 rose comb babies with a pea comb brown or beige egg parent? I think I'll make a separate post about this, see what others could come up with for answers.