Missouri folks- regarding avian influenza, are we a test out state?

So, here is the deal. States have what is in the US Legal System generally described as "the Police Power". It is the general authority to make law for the public health and welfare, and its a BROAD delegation of authority for response to disease. States are largely unchecked in their ability to use those powers, temporarily, in the face of outbreaks, particularly. The ability to enforce a quarantine - to literally lock families into their home (or even an entire town within its borders) and prevent exit falls squarely within that power, and originates from a time when there was neither widespread testing, nor reliable testing for particularl ydiseases - so the law that has developed around those uses of State power do not rely upon such discriminating requirements. There are plenty of examples of locking an entire family in, though only a single member is symptomatic. Its possitively medieval, yes, but it remains (with caveats and carve outs) the state of the law essentially worldwide.

The US State statutes delegating that power (usually to the Commisioner of Agriculture or similar) were written in a time when the US was largely agrarian, many states were highly repliant upon agriculture as their primary products for export, and a disease outbreak could wipe out entire industries. Those delegations are VERY broad. In many cases, the States can simply designate a zone where disease has been found and destroy every bird, or cow, or pig, or whatever within it. Whether or not that action constitutues "a taking" for which just compensation must be paid is a closer question - but the answer is probably not.

Now, cheaper, faster testing together with public outrage has *mostly* resulted in more surgical use of that grant of authority by State Ag Comms (or equivalent). Typically, they establish quarantine zones for monitoring, assert the authority to destroy every [designated] animal type breaking quarantine [plus all similar animals they come in contact with]. That forms the quarantine itself. Within the quarantine, if any animal tests positive for whatever disease has been designated a health emergency, the whole flock/herd is culled.

CA spent the beter part of two years getting END/vND under control. Millions of birds were culled - and they used Google maps, among other resources, to find backyard owners. There's nothing you can do to hide birds now if the satellites have already seen your coop(s). The EU has been dealing with AI for several years now, its found from the UK to Isreal - and their actions to contain it make CA's look like half measures. Even so, "well meaning" {ahem} idiots in CA managed to export vND to two neighboring states, resulting in large culls there as well. They did the same the decade before.

Please, if your flock is designated for culling due to illness - don't try to "save them" by placing hundreds, thousands, literally millions of other people's birds at risk. Its selfish, irresponsible, and illegal. Be a good citizen, seek compensation thru the legal system, and start over when this has passed. The State has intruded into our lives in lots of places where I disagree, but in this, the State's power is traditionally strongest - defense of the community and the containment of disease (an aspect of community fdefense) are the oldest and most traditional powers - and purpose - of community governance. It is, historically, why the State exists.
 
So, here is the deal. States have what is in the US Legal System generally described as "the Police Power". It is the general authority to make law for the public health and welfare, and its a BROAD delegation of authority for response to disease. States are largely unchecked in their ability to use those powers, temporarily, in the face of outbreaks, particularly. The ability to enforce a quarantine - to literally lock families into their home (or even an entire town within its borders) and prevent exit falls squarely within that power, and originates from a time when there was neither widespread testing, nor reliable testing for particularl ydiseases - so the law that has developed around those uses of State power do not rely upon such discriminating requirements. There are plenty of examples of locking an entire family in, though only a single member is symptomatic. Its possitively medieval, yes, but it remains (with caveats and carve outs) the state of the law essentially worldwide.

The US State statutes delegating that power (usually to the Commisioner of Agriculture or similar) were written in a time when the US was largely agrarian, many states were highly repliant upon agriculture as their primary products for export, and a disease outbreak could wipe out entire industries. Those delegations are VERY broad. In many cases, the States can simply designate a zone where disease has been found and destroy every bird, or cow, or pig, or whatever within it. Whether or not that action constitutues "a taking" for which just compensation must be paid is a closer question - but the answer is probably not.

Now, cheaper, faster testing together with public outrage has *mostly* resulted in more surgical use of that grant of authority by State Ag Comms (or equivalent). Typically, they establish quarantine zones for monitoring, assert the authority to destroy every [designated] animal type breaking quarantine [plus all similar animals they come in contact with]. That forms the quarantine itself. Within the quarantine, if any animal tests positive for whatever disease has been designated a health emergency, the whole flock/herd is culled.

CA spent the beter part of two years getting END/vND under control. Millions of birds were culled - and they used Google maps, among other resources, to find backyard owners. There's nothing you can do to hide birds now if the satellites have already seen your coop(s). The EU has been dealing with AI for several years now, its found from the UK to Isreal - and their actions to contain it make CA's look like half measures. Even so, "well meaning" {ahem} idiots in CA managed to export vND to two neighboring states, resulting in large culls there as well. They did the same the decade before.

Please, if your flock is designated for culling due to illness - don't try to "save them" by placing hundreds, thousands, literally millions of other people's birds at risk. Its selfish, irresponsible, and illegal. Be a good citizen, seek compensation thru the legal system, and start over when this has passed. The State has intruded into our lives in lots of places where I disagree, but in this, the State's power is traditionally strongest - defense of the community and the containment of disease (an aspect of community fdefense) are the oldest and most traditional powers - and purpose - of community governance. It is, historically, why the State exists.
No- I don't don't you understand. I understand culling if one or more of my birds is infected. If they were infected with avian influenza then culling would be merciful. If they were infected they were going to die anyway.That is not what I'm trying to stop. What I'm worried about is them being culled anyway despite being locked down and uninfected just because they're within like 6 miles of a confirmed case.
 
No- I don't don't you understand. I understand culling if one or more of my birds is infected. If they were infected with avian influenza then culling would be merciful. If they were infected they were going to die anyway.That is not what I'm trying to stop. What I'm worried about is them being culled anyway despite being locked down and uninfected just because they're within like 6 miles of a confirmed case.
I do understand, and I did answer that.

They can.

Will they? Probably not.

Is it within the police powers of the State to do so? Yes. Yes it is.

Most likely, if your flock is tested, and one is infected, all will be culled.

Most likely, if you are close to an infected flock, but your flock tests clean, none of your birds will be culled.

But if the State decides that testing is too expensive, too time consuming, or simply inconvenient, and the Ag Commisioner (or whomever the power is designated to) wants to declare an area around an infected bird, and cull everything in range? Yes, they can do that.

Clear enough for you?

If you want to look at the Statutes (I'm not going to argue with you, I'm not a lawyer, just offering the practical effect of similar statutes nationally, and the history of their use), you want to read Missouri Revised Statute, Title XVII, Chapter 267.560 et seq.
 
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I do understand, and I did answer that.

They can.

Will they? Probably not.

Is it within the police powers of the State to do so? Yes. Yes it is.

Most likely, if your flock is tested, and one is infected, all will be culled.

Most likely, if you are close to an infected flock, but your flock tests clean, none of your birds will be culled.

But if the State decides that testing is too expensive, too time consuming, or simply inconvenient, and the Ag Commisioner (or whomever the power is designated to) wants to declare an area around an infected bird, and cull everything in range? Yes, they can do that.

Clear enough for you?
I know they CAN. What I wanted to know for sure is whether they WILL or not. And just because it's within their power to do so doesn't mean it's good or fair. I and other people actually taking biosecurity seriously shouldn't have to suffer because of the government's laziness. And in the end if this were to happen, no amount of compensation money would make it okay because these are my pets we're talking about. I'm quite aware they don't care about any emotional attachment to the chickens, but I'm just saying, there is nothing anyone can say or do to make me think its okay for them to just go in and slaughter healthy birds without even testing them first.
 
I know they CAN. What I wanted to know for sure is whether they WILL or not. And just because it's within their power to do so doesn't mean it's good or fair.

The only person who can answer "WILL" works for your State - no one on BYC can honestly provide the reassurance you seek.

I make no argumement regarding its goodness or fairness.
 
I live in Wisconsin but my baby chicks come from cackle hatchery in Missouri. So i hope i can get them before it reaches Missouri.
 
No- I don't don't you understand. I understand culling if one or more of my birds is infected. If they were infected with avian influenza then culling would be merciful. If they were infected they were going to die anyway.That is not what I'm trying to stop. What I'm worried about is them being culled anyway despite being locked down and uninfected just because they're within like 6 miles of a confirmed case.
This HPAI is stressing many of us, myself included. I'm in NC and it's been confirmed and continues to be found here, so I can relate to your concern. I just wanted to say that HPAI doesn't have a 100% mortality rate. Yes, it has a high mortality rate especially for chickens, but there are some that won't succumb to HPAI if they contract it. I've been reading about domestic ducks having a lower mortality, although still high, than chickens. It certainly sounds like an absolutely horrible virus that I hope will be under control with minimal deaths soon. We've been chatting about this since @Folly's place shared the information with us. Please feel free to join us there as we track and discuss this h5n1 in the USA. I wish you and your flock the very best 💜
 
Here’s info for Missouri:
https://health.mo.gov/emergencies/panflu/avian.php

When reading all about this round of the fast spreading avian flu “they” say it is often deadly so I wonder if we keep our flocks away from potential contagions (wild & traveling birds) and start to uplevel their nutrients & comfort (de-stress as much as we can, clean the coop), could we help prevent infection? Could they survive it should one get infected? It seems so.

We are going to believe we can and do our best to try. VetRx, Nutridrench, Probiotics, ferment our feed, lots of fresh veg & fruit and eggs & water. And lots of OBSERVATION, LOVE & ATTENTION 💗
 
Here’s info for Missouri:
https://health.mo.gov/emergencies/panflu/avian.php

When reading all about this round of the fast spreading avian flu “they” say it is often deadly so I wonder if we keep our flocks away from potential contagions (wild & traveling birds) and start to uplevel their nutrients & comfort (de-stress as much as we can, clean the coop), could we help prevent infection? Could they survive it should one get infected? It seems so.

We are going to believe we can and do our best to try. VetRx, Nutridrench, Probiotics, ferment our feed, lots of fresh veg & fruit and eggs & water. And lots of OBSERVATION, LOVE & ATTENTION 💗
I think that's a great plan. I was just considering supplements too, i saw some poultry probiotics at the feed store and I almost bought some. I think I will get some for them next time. It definitely couldn't hurt, and I was already planning on planting them a little garden even before hearing about bird flu and tomorrow I'm working on bird proofing their run so they can finally go outside again. Poor girls haven't seen dirt in a long time in between winter weather, keeping them away from hawks, and now preparation for bird flu.
 
Here’s info for Missouri:
https://health.mo.gov/emergencies/panflu/avian.php

When reading all about this round of the fast spreading avian flu “they” say it is often deadly so I wonder if we keep our flocks away from potential contagions (wild & traveling birds) and start to uplevel their nutrients & comfort (de-stress as much as we can, clean the coop), could we help prevent infection? Could they survive it should one get infected? It seems so.

We are going to believe we can and do our best to try. VetRx, Nutridrench, Probiotics, ferment our feed, lots of fresh veg & fruit and eggs & water. And lots of OBSERVATION, LOVE & ATTENTION 💗
From what I've read, not all chickens will succumb to HPAI, but any infected survivors will continue to shed the virus, possibly infecting more birds. The mortality rate is high in chickens though. Interestingly enough not all domestic ducks will show signs of being infected, but they will also shed the virus even if asymptomatic. Something I need to look into more is that I remember reading somewhere that chickens are lifetime carriers once infected. This is why they euthanize entire flocks. Again, I need to go back and brush up on this so don't quote me on this or give up hope just yet. It's always a good idea to keep your birds as healthy as possible and take measures to avoid any contact between your birds and any other birds, wild and domestic.
 
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