Moving Forward- Breeding for Resistance to Marek's Disease

[Michael Apple]

Dr. Mason also reviewed pics of the other hen's odd liver that LH still has on her phone (she never deletes any of my messages, must be hundreds, lol) and he said it looked exactly like Spotty Liver Disease, that it is making a comeback now. Interesting, that's exactly what I originally felt it was myself.

I sometimes wonder if tests performed confuse the liver disease caused by Vibrio bacteria with fatty liver disease, which can happen to birds in moult condition for awhile or inactivity. Thioctic acid (an antioxidant) should be an ingredient included in poultry supplements to support and detox the liver. Choline is often added in diets, but not thioctic acid.

 

[seminolewind]

Cynthia, smart man. You will not just have One chicken symptomatic or die with Marek's. If one has it they all do. The dust in your house would have virus in it.

There must be a hundred illnesses that have tumors similar to Marek's. I read about 4-5 more that they have to differentiate between to diagnose which is which.

Michael, I hear ya. Sometimes I wonder how much a pathologist knows, or feels like being more definitive on.

 

[speckledhen]

Cynthia, smart man. You will not just have One chicken symptomatic or die with Marek's. If one has it they all do. The dust in your house would have virus in it.

There must be a hundred illnesses that have tumors similar to Marek's. I read about 4-5 more that they have to differentiate between to diagnose which is which.

Michael, I hear ya. Sometimes I wonder how much a pathologist knows, or feels like being more definitive on.

Yes, he is, very much so, and he cares. He's a treasure and I'm lucky to have his ear. He's always happy to consult with me. He went on a 3 week vacation recently and he's been told he can't do that again without written permission from both of us, LOL.

 

[seminolewind]

How do you get so lucky to find these people?

 

[speckledhen]

Quote:
Clean living.

J/K. I have no idea. I'm blessed with a great friend in Ladyhawk. I think I'm a hanger-on with her good fortune, first in her vet in Oregon who just happened to be doing a long term study on dwarfism in poultry when dwarfs began popping up in my Delawares and he did genetic testing on two of Isaac's daughters she had, was thrilled to do it. And now, her vet in Ky, who treats the finest race horses, is not above also treating her chickens, says he makes enough off of their owners he doesn't care about getting rich off of her pet chickens. He even tries to get by without her paying him for checking on them. He's even been known to pop by unnannounced to check on a bird he treated or her Arabian mare, who is very attached to him. Horses know who the good guys are! He is smart and intuitive and really loves her Lancelot, who he not long ago stitched up after a predator fight. He's helped me long distance more than once, even asks her about me and my birds. What a guy, right?

 

[chooks4life]

Ok, ok, ok, already! lol, I'm starting to get jealous now.

 

[speckledhen]

Ok, ok, ok, already! lol, I'm starting to get jealous now.

Not trying to rub it in, lol, just feel very lucky to have Dr. Mason's expertise available. Ladyhawk found him for her horse when she saw some educational videos he made and was very taken with how he handled the horses and how they responded to him. Chickens like him, too.

 

[ChicKat]

... he has a better chance of winning the lottery than I do of having Marek's in my flock, that disease doesn't happen in a vacuum, not in one single bird that not show up in almost 50 others........

That reinforces what you have thought all along, that you didn't have Merek's. It also seems to me that a hen with two baseball sized tumors would not be able to sustain that strain - and it must be tremendously hard on the little body. Just having them could have been the cause of death couldn't it?

 

[speckledhen]

That reinforces what you have thought all along, that you didn't have Merek's. It also seems to me that a hen with two baseball sized tumors would not be able to sustain that strain - and it must be tremendously hard on the little body. Just having them could have been the cause of death couldn't it?

To clarify, in case some folks are confused, the hen with the baseball size tumors was going on 4 years old. She is not the one I had necropsied by the state, who was about 16 months old. I knew that Hope didn't have Marek's, that something else had gone wrong inside her. I wonder if her sister had the same odd malfunction but she just quit eating and died fairly quickly. Same thing, started laying around the same time as her sister, laid a few eggs then quit abruptly, went downhill, didn't last long. She was not as large framed as Hope, though she was from the same stock. I bet if I had opened her up, I would have found tumors in her liver as well. I still wonder about some genetic trigger, though the breeder denies ever seeing this issue. It's too much of a coincidence, to my way of thinking for the sisters' deaths not to be related somehow. Those two hens are not related at all to this Marek's scare.

Hope was a humongous Buff Orpington hen. Folks used to ask when she was young if she was the same age as the others in the pen with her. That alone may have kept her going with those huge baseballs inside her, but dang, I am astounded at her strength.

 

[ChicKat]

To clarify, in case some folks are confused, the hen with the baseball size tumors was going on 4 years old. She is not the one I had necropsied by the state, who was about 16 months old. I knew that Hope didn't have Marek's, that something else had gone wrong inside her. I wonder if her sister had the same odd malfunction but she just quit eating and died fairly quickly. Same thing, started laying around the same time as her sister, laid a few eggs then quit abruptly, went downhill, didn't last long. She was not as large framed as Hope, though she was from the same stock. I bet if I had opened her up, I would have found tumors in her liver as well. I still wonder about some genetic trigger, though the breeder denies ever seeing this issue. It's too much of a coincidence, to my way of thinking for the sisters' deaths not to be related somehow. Those two hens are not related at all to this Marek's scare.

Hope was a humongous Buff Orpington hen. Folks used to ask when she was young if she was the same age as the others in the pen with her. That alone may have kept her going with those huge baseballs inside her, but dang, I am astounded at her strength.

It does sound like something genetic that both sisters had. Her strength was amazing. Her size may have enabled her to deal with it longer...but even that fast growth could have been somehow related. never-the-less - it does show that there are other sources of tumors than Merek's.

sorry that you have to go through this, but finding the truth is always worthwhile IMO. Hope that you will get complete results before too long.