My dog had a seizure today

[seminolewind]

Hi, My Boston was 2 years old when he had his first seizure. I don't wish on anyone to watch a gran mal seizure. I've read alot, and the reason they don't put them on meds right away is because the meds destroy their liver, so the dog has to have at least several seizures a week or seizures that are long, I think almost 5 minutes.
It took us a year of seizures to realize it correlated with the use of a pesticide that contains permethrine/pyrethrins. That included Frontline etc., bug spray, raid, Home defense. The first seizure was 2 days after applying frontline. Then there were a few after spraying home defense around the house that is supposed to be safe for animals, LOL. We live in Florida, and most often you need to spray for bugs. Then we moved into a trailer park to wait for our house to be finished. He had a seizure every week. Looking back on it, we didn't have any bugs in that sleezy trailer, so it had probably been sprayed. Then we moved into our new house, and I sprayed, and he had seizures. That's when we realized that there was a correlation. It's been hard to not use bug spray, we use it around the outside of the house, but not in the yard. It seems to be enough. If someone actually sprayed their house and then visited me, he will have seizures. A few months ago, I sprayed some ants on the patio, and didn't leave him out there, just straight to the yard and back. I left for work one night, and to my horror I had left him out on the pation overnight. He had some awful seizures the next few days, to where his tongue turned blue, and he'd have several in a row. I could throw up.
If you think there is any chemical that may do this, and I've heard of floor cleaner, carpet cleaner, and swiffer causing sezures, don't use it. I don't believe "safe for pets" anymore.
And, remember, seizures themselves will not hurt the dog, its that they dont get oxygen while they are seizing that is the bad part. The other thing that saves me some pain is knowing that he has no clue what is happening. They go blank, wake up, are a bit woozy and have no idea. Karen

 

[Redfeathers]

Karen

Wow, thats just horrible that you had to see your dog seizure that often. I do use Frontline and have for years, I had put the last dose on him about a week before his seizure so I'm not sure if it's that. I have been careful to stop using some items that I was using before, so far he hasn't had another one.
I know what you mean about what it's like to see it happen, honestly it's one of the worst things I've ever seen and I hope to never have it happen again. Poor Flynn woke up so confused and upset that he just laid very still and growled, he almost seemed blind for awhile, he was looking right at me but it was like he couldn't see me. I didn't approach him while he was growling, he wouldn't bite me ever normally but I wasn't sure this time, so I waited until he found his feet, he walked towards me staring at me and growling and then he gently licked my chin and put his head on my lap...It made me cry because I could tell he was so lost. Anyway, thank you all for writing back and letting me know what it was like for you. It helps to have others go through what I went through to fully understand what it's like and yes, I admit, I want the sympathy.

 

[snugglepup]

Have you checked out the Canine Epilepsy site yet? I understand its a great source for information and support. I am fortunate that I have not yet had a dog that seizured. I hope I never will. I'm sorry for what your going through, it's always so hard to see our babies in distress.

ps- Frontline brand does not contain any pyrethrins or permethrins, the active ingredient is fipronil, which has an incredibly wide safety margin. Reactions to permethrins/pyrethrins do occur, sometimes as severe as seizures, although that is very rare... more common in cats than dogs. Most inexpensive OTC flea treatments contain these compounds (Hartz, Bio Spot, flea collars, etc).

 

[Redfeathers]

I have looked at so many epilepsy sites and other sites that I've learned probably way more than I needed to. Sometimes when you check out the web to learn something, you learn way too much that you get confused because some sites say one thing, others say another and then some say that what you learned isn't really how it is at all....I love/hate the internet. lol

I'm glad to hear the Frontline is safe. I rely on it to keep my dogs flea free, this is a bad area for fleas unfortunately and we have to keep up on the treatments.

 

[seminolewind]

ANY bug killer gives my dog seizures, Frontline was one of them, the first seisures came withing 48 hours of that product.and after that it was Home Defense, and products like Raid. However, floor chemicals can be a culprit, I have heard of that and your culprit may not be bug killers. . all I'm saying is to see if there's a correlation between some chemical and the dog's seizures. Of course, alot of dogs have idiopathic seizures. There is a forum about canine seizures on the net, can't remember the name.
If I ever have a problem with fleas, I think I will try DE, and pray it works. Karen

 

[nccatnip]

Witnessing seizures in your dog is quite scary. I, also, own a dog the seizes and luckily it is only about once a year. I would highly recommend the following:
1.Have a thyroid profile done. You will have to request the full panel, preferably done at the Univ of Michigan (it can be shipped)
2.Speak to the breeder and check the onsite registry for related dogs that may have health issues. http://www.irishsetterclub.org/current_research.html
3. Avoid Frontline, but Advantix and Advantage are okay. Memory fails me at this point but there is a chemical in Frontline that can induce seizures (not cause them) in seizure prone dogs.
5. Try a raw diet.
4. If showing him is fun, continue to do so. Just neuter when he is Ch.
Unfortunately, many causes of seizures are often impossible to diagnose. It is heartbreaking.

 

[snugglepup]

I'm curious since this keeps coming up. What makes you guys keep saying that Frontline is to be avoided? I'm wondering if its something I should research, although I haven't found anything so far. Or if it's one of those urban legends that gets started. Either way it's not something I've heard of, and I like to stay on top of things!

Are you sure you aren't confusing it with Advantix? Advantix has imidacloprid and permethrin. I have heard of permethrin sensitivity, very very rare in dogs, but more common in cats. Imidacloprid is very safe and extremely common. Its the same pesticide as is frequently sprayed on fruits and veggies for human consumption. I suppose in a seizure dog I would be inclined to avoid any pyrethroid compounds, but then I don't really like them in general anyway. Not good for the environment.

I think organophosphates is the class of insecticides that is most commonly known for neurological effects. And of course they are everywhere in home, pet, and agricultural use.

 

[nccatnip]

I am embarassed to admit I do not remember the exact pharmacology on why the Frontline was to be avoided in seizure prone dogs. It was not a factor in my dogs seizures, just one on a list of things to avoid in the future. It was relayed to me by my Vet that it did not cause seizures but research showed it could induce seizures in prone dogs. I continue to use it on my other dogs with no ill effects.
When my dog seized, my vet did an extensive work up excluding an MRI. It was determined her seizures were the result of hypoglycemia. She is very much a pack dog and both seizures were after the deaths of my other two dogs. She was in mourning and not eating well.
It was a very scary time for me and I apologize for not having further information on the Frontline, but there is no confusion about the brand. As far as being an urban legend, it is possible but with all the research and time my vet took at the time, I trust he was accurate.

 

[snugglepup]

Interesting. I will dig deeper and see what I can find.

 

[seminolewind]

Snugglepup, I'm sure Frontline is safe for most dogs. I'm sure the others are as well. I found my info on a message board that was about Frontline and seizures. I think you're right, I'm sure my dog has a seizure disorder, and there are certain chemicals that induce them, like anything that kills bugs. If anyone uses Frontline, and is not having problems, there is no reason not to use it. Its a good product, just so happens not for my dog.
I mostly just wanted to say that there may be a correlation between some chemicals and inducing seizures in dogs that have a seizure disorder. Like floor cleaner, which I've heard of as well. I also read that seizures usually show up in dogs around the age of 2.
Watching what kind of chemicals you use around the time the dog seizes may help one find a way of cutting way down on the episodes. Karen