need some direction for a sick chicken

[awagnon]

Hi y'all! Well, I guess it was bound to happen again. The same hen who had really severe crop issues a few months ago is back to acting off. She is molting a little bit, but I think it is more than just that. She's a red sex-link, approx 2 1/2 yrs old. Comb is red, but not as bright as usual. Eyes are bright and clear. No sneezing or nasal discharge. No facial swelling. Coordination seems fine when she walks around her crate. No mites/lice. She is standing and sitting without any trouble. She is drinking and picks at her food a little, but isn't eating much. Hasn't laid any eggs in over a year.

I made her some mash with her feed. Her feed is Naturewise Organic Egg Producer pellets. I have put Corid in her water in case it's a case of Cocci. I know there are strains that don't cause bloody poo. I am worming her with Fenbendazole according to the dosage for her weight. Doing the five day regimen. This is the second day on those. She tears up her grit like it's candy. Her poops are very watery, but not green, mucosy or bloody. Just a normal brownish color with obvious urates as well. VERY stinky.

Her crop is small, tho I feel like it's a bit larger than this morning when it was empty. She's just not eating much at all. She is the same one who dropped A LOT of weight when she had the crop issue. I weighed her yesterday when I brought her in and surprisingly she weighed 3.7 lbs. I was shocked as she doesn't feel like she'd even register on the scale. She weighed almost a pound and a quarter more than that Spring before last, before she got sick the first time. On the bird condition scale, I'd say she's at least a 1 if not worse. I don't know how she's made it this long. I had figured she had cancer since she really never got her weight back after getting over the crop problem. I guess I was wrong because she had a good spell of acting perfectly normal as she used to and was eating like a pig once her crop got better. I would think by now she'd be gone if it was cancer.

She is also making a weird motion with her head and neck from time to time. Kinda a combo of Cobra swaying, stretching, and 'walk like an egyptian' type movements. lol She doesn't seem to lose her balance or be dizzy during or after these gyrations. I also hear loud gurgling noises from her from time to time that sounds like my stomach growling when I am really hungry. lol

My questions are: can I give Miconazole with the Corid and wormer? I also read an herbal tea of catnip, lemon balm, and chamomile is good for their digestion. Is that OK to mix with everything? I don't want to overwhelm her system. I am really concerned about her weight and would love to get some muscle mass back on her before it gets too cold.

TIA for any help/advice anyone can give me.

 

[azygous]

It sounds like she may have loss of appetite due to molt, and also has a crop issue going on from your description of her neck gyrations.

The fact she hasn't laid in such a long time may point to a chronic reproductive issue, cancer or an infection. Both aren't out of the question for her breed.

We can't diagnose her problems, just give advice on how to treat her symptoms. First, since she isn't laying, feeding a layer feed is not helping her. Find an all flock feed like Purina Flock Raiser or a chick starter which have a generous amount of protein that would do her a lot of good if you want to put weight on her.

Her crop issue could be caused by her anatomy where a crop bra might be the solution rather than continual yeast treatments. And I suggest giving her a probiotic for a while to beef up her intestinal microbes.

This hen may turn out not have any serious reproductive issues at all. If a crop bra resolves the crop emptying and if a higher protein feed puts enough weight on her, she may just surprise you and begin to lay again once the days get longer.

 

[awagnon]

It sounds like she may have loss of appetite due to molt, and also has a crop issue going on from your description of her neck gyrations.

The fact she hasn't laid in such a long time may point to a chronic reproductive issue, cancer or an infection. Both aren't out of the question for her breed.

We can't diagnose her problems, just give advice on how to treat her symptoms. First, since she isn't laying, feeding a layer feed is not helping her. Find an all flock feed like Purina Flock Raiser or a chick starter which have a generous amount of protein that would do her a lot of good if you want to put weight on her.

Her crop issue could be caused by her anatomy where a crop bra might be the solution rather than continual yeast treatments. And I suggest giving her a probiotic for a while to beef up her intestinal microbes.

This hen may turn out not have any serious reproductive issues at all. If a crop bra resolves the crop emptying and if a higher protein feed puts enough weight on her, she may just surprise you and begin to lay again once the days get longer.

Thanks @azygous for your response. I understand a diagnosis is impossible here. I do know that this breed is prone to reproductive cancer, but given the length of time, I would have thought she'd already have passed from it. I have read that even tho they are very productive egg layers, they do so for only a short time, 2 years max, sometimes. She's had no symptoms of being egg bound or internal laying ever.

The current feed I am feeding, despite the name, is 21% protein. It's the highest I can find. The All Flock I have used in the past was lower than that. I think it was around 18%.

Would a crop bra even do any good if her crop seems to be in the correct position and doesn't overfill? Would it press on the crop and cause her to eat even less from the pressure?

Her crop is not distended nor does it hang down like I have seen in pendulous crop cases. After the bout with her crop before, she never really gorged herself enough for her crop to be wildly noticeable like her sisters' that had no crop issues. In checking her, morning and evening, I did find she was eating and emptying some tho during her recovery last time. If anything I don't feel like she's eating enough.

Would you continue the Corid and worming for the 3 more days if she were your hen?

Would the miconazole be OK to use in addition to Corid in her water or should I wait for 3 days when her Corid regimen is complete?

What about the herbal tea? Don't want to introduce any herbs that may work against other things I am giving her.

 

[azygous]

Yes, it's safe to continue the Corid and worming.

Have you methodically checked her crop in the morning before she eats to be sure it's perfectly empty? Have you made sure she has access to suitable grit? The neck gyrations indicate she has an uncomfortable crop.

A crop issue can cause weight loss if the crop always has something in it because the chicken won't feel as much hunger. If your soil is clay, it may not have the type of gravel in it chickens require. Also, poor gut flora can slow down absorption of nutrients, also causing weight loss. This can be a purely individual issue.

The herbs you want to give should do no harm. There are only a few "teas" that are toxic to chickens - coffee, black tea, chocolate, among them.

 

[awagnon]

Yes, it's safe to continue the Corid and worming.

Have you methodically checked her crop in the morning before she eats to be sure it's perfectly empty? Have you made sure she has access to suitable grit? The neck gyrations indicate she has an uncomfortable crop.

A crop issue can cause weight loss if the crop always has something in it because the chicken won't feel as much hunger. If your soil is clay, it may not have the type of gravel in it chickens require. Also, poor gut flora can slow down absorption of nutrients, also causing weight loss. This can be a purely individual issue.

The herbs you want to give should do no harm. There are only a few "teas" that are toxic to chickens - coffee, black tea, chocolate, among them.

Ok great, thanks @azygous. My question was can I use the Miconazole with the other two? Sorry if I wasn't clear.

I am making her a crop bra. I figure it can't hurt since it's non-invasive.

Yes, her crop is empty in the morning, but she really never eats more to fill it passed large walnut size, if even that large, during the day. I added some probiotics to her food. When I refresh it she acts like she starving, but then only eats 2 or 3 bites. ugh

The soil here in North Texas where I am is a sandy loam. I always have grit available in a bowl in the run along with oyster shell just to cover all the bases. I put sand down in the run to help with drainage and keep the mud down when it rains.

Haven't seen her do the gyrations yet this morning, but still hear loud gurgling like her tummy is growling. Never heard a chicken do that before this one! lol

 

[azygous]

How is she acting? Is she active and vocal? Or does she hang off at the edge of activities, hunched or otherwise depressed?

Yes, a crop bra is worth a try. You only need to have her wear it at night for now.

In my experience, when a chicken is underweight, I assume they have adjusted to a starvation diet and need jump starting with other foods besides commercial feed. Try a cooked egg and boiled rice for several mornings. This often encourages appetite by suddenly elevating energy levels with a shot of protein and carbs. Use Poultry Nutri-drench sprinkled over the rice to boost her nutrients to her organs.

 

[awagnon]

How is she acting? Is she active and vocal? Or does she hang off at the edge of activities, hunched or otherwise depressed?

Yes, a crop bra is worth a try. You only need to have her wear it at night for now.

In my experience, when a chicken is underweight, I assume they have adjusted to a starvation diet and need jump starting with other foods besides commercial feed. Try a cooked egg and boiled rice for several mornings. This often encourages appetite by suddenly elevating energy levels with a shot of protein and carbs. Use Poultry Nutri-drench sprinkled over the rice to boost her nutrients to her organs.

I have her inside, in a crate for the last 3 days. Brought her in because we had temps in the 30s at night and she's SO skinny! I really don't know where she gets the energy to stand. She stands and moves around for a good period of time in her crate. She does talk to me when I say something to her. She's got more energy than I would have thought at worming time - she has NO problem fighting me on that. lol

Still attacking her grit like it's candy, however, in watching her she crunches it in her beak and is now spitting it out.

I did give her some scrambled egg in coconut oil with some oregano sprinkled in this morning. She acted like she was gonna wolf it down, but only took about 3 bites. I have seen her go back and eat some more within the last hour or so. I will add some rice to it with probiotics sprinkled on it.

Should I stop the Corid and give her the Nutri-drench?? I know you aren't supposed to give extra vitamins when on that. Cocci is LOW on the list as every one else is showing NO symptoms.

She still has VERY watery, stinky poos. They have no blood or green color to them. Her comb is nice and red.

Before I brought her inside, she was starting to hang away from the flock and walk very slowly to me when I called her name. She'd peck at her food, but not eat anything. Had NO interest in her wormies I give them from time to time, and that is VERY unusual for her. She was pretty fluffed up, but again, she's going thru a light molt. She was eating very well and very food protective a week or so ago. She stands and walks with no stumbling or limping. She would stop & lay down more than usual tho. She didn't seem very interested in being near her sisters, but EVERYBODY is grumpy cause EVERYBODY is molting. ugh I did check for mites/lice, none were found. No red on a paper towel when checking under their roosts.

I have got to figure out how to post pics here for better info. I am old (lol) computers are not my friend.

 

[azygous]

Posting pics is easy as long as you have a photo file on your device. First click on the paper clip in the message window that says "attach files". This opens your files on your device. Select the file where the photos are, then select the photos you want to post. Then click "open". That will transfer them to the message window. Then select "full size" which is my preference since you get the most detail, and doesn't cost extra. Then hit "post reply".

A thought just occurred to me. You may have a chicken with a disorder called "pica". Other animals and humans can have it. It causes a desire to prefer to consume non-food items - gravel, dirt, paper, even hardware. Malnutrition is common since the pica victim doesn't eat enough actual food. It's very difficult to treat since it's in the wiring of the brain.

What you can do is limit access to the preferred substance hopefully forcing the chicken to pay more attention to the real food. I would withhold grit except for at the very end of the day so she can replenish what she needs to digest the food she's consumed before sleeping.

I know this may seem like we're wandering out into the weeds here, but I think it's something worth considering. And yes, perhaps focus on nutrition instead of possible coccidiosis which probably is a long shot anyway.

 

[awagnon]

Posting pics is easy as long as you have a photo file on your device. First click on the paper clip in the message window that says "attach files". This opens your files on your device. Select the file where the photos are, then select the photos you want to post. Then click "open". That will transfer them to the message window. Then select "full size" which is my preference since you get the most detail, and doesn't cost extra. Then hit "post reply".

A thought just occurred to me. You may have a chicken with a disorder called "pica". Other animals and humans can have it. It causes a desire to prefer to consume non-food items - gravel, dirt, paper, even hardware. Malnutrition is common since the pica victim doesn't eat enough actual food. It's very difficult to treat since it's in the wiring of the brain.

What you can do is limit access to the preferred substance hopefully forcing the chicken to pay more attention to the real food. I would withhold grit except for at the very end of the day so she can replenish what she needs to digest the food she's consumed before sleeping.

I know this may seem like we're wandering out into the weeds here, but I think it's something worth considering. And yes, perhaps focus on nutrition instead of possible coccidiosis which probably is a long shot anyway.

oh wow. I thought I read somewhere that you had to post pics to some photo bucket and share the link & for videos to YouTube and share a link somehow.

Well now that I know it's that easy, I may become obnoxious with chicken cuteness pictures. LOL just kidding. I am typing this and NOW I see the attach files button. Guess I am blind that I never even noticed that. Maybe I am not smart enough to have chickens. Ha Ha!

About to change out her water to stop the Corid and get her some more rice and eggs with some Poultry Cell. Is this the same thing as Nutri Drench? I can get some this weekend if not.

She's actually acting better this afternoon. Not one time has she done the gyration thing with her neck today. Thanks again for the advice!

 

[awagnon]

Ok, here are some pics of my sick girl, Freckles. One is her lying down puffed up and the other two of her poo the last two days. (Sorry, grossness factor).

One is today, she's finally showing more than a passing interest in her food. Yay!