Need some input.... Meat CSA.

[Raiquee]

Jeff,

I think people gave you good advice. I think my only advice is the price per pound comes out to roughly 7.50 a pound. Now, I know this is convience and good beef and everything but I'd be a little ticked to be paying that for ground beef and not getting a better cut. All in all, the consumer is going to look at it for what the price is and what they are getting. Being someone who was looking into meat CSAs, you box looks very likeable with the steak cuts in it. Without? I would probably pass. I think people on this board are very resourceful and like using the ground beef more than steak (as it goes a heck of a lot further!) but people on inner city and on the edge of the latest food craze may still want that ribeye.

Although the idea of two boxes, a "standard" and a "premium" is a great one. You could offer on the standard one maybe a bit smaller (maybe take out the steaks, some sausage and the "select chicken") and lower the price on it, then include in the premium 2 choices of steak, sausage (or maybe some unique sausage instead of italian like chirizo?) and "select" chicken and have a higher price. That was you can divide up your cow accordingly and only take so many premium shares.

Your price seems doable, I think for your cheaper box, try to at least bring it under 200, if not more so (if you take our steaks and lighten the load a bit), as 199 always looks better than 200, ya know?

Good luck to you too!

 

[WhiteMountainsRanch]

Wow this sounds awesome Jeff! I wish we had something like this around here! I would SO be in on it!

 

[Brunty_Farms]

Quote:
See the price was $240 at first with the steaks... and $220 without. I could probably go down to about $210 without the steaks if I decided to do that. The problem that I see with including them is that I can only do two steaks per month. The price is expensive, no doubt if this was bought by the half or quarter they would save money but they do have that option as we sell half and whole pigs along with quarters of beef. But the thought of taking on a half of an animal is daunting to city folks. Even though they will more than likely use all of the meat over the course of the year they still can not come to grips of a whole animal or a quarter in their freezer.

So you think it would be more appealing to have the steaks included for $240 / month instead of the $210 / month without the steaks? Keep in mind that the steaks will basically sit in storage exclusively for just meat CSA members for when they need them or want them.

I'm really going to offer only one box package this year just for the simplicity of it. Keep in mind we sell at farmers markets, have two other types of CSA's (Standard and a Poultry only which both can have the option of adding a side of pork), also sell from the farm, and try to live somewhat normal lives! SO with that said we are going to keep it simple this year, however I do love the idea of having 2 or 3 options but for our sanity we are going to stick with just one.

Price in my area really isn't an issue, people in my area want the quality and understand the labor that is involved so I'm hoping that it's not an issue. When I first started this business I was always so concerned about pricing but when it comes down to it, you have to be sustainable and make a profit or you're not going to be in business too long. Low prices are a lose, lose situation. If I can't stay in business, consumers don't have an alternative. I would be perfectly fine with selling everything retail, but figured customers would like the convenience of picking up a box of meats and being done.

I have a lot to think about, thanks for all of the replies and keep them coming. I'm still in the air about the steaks so this helps a lot.

 

[Brunty_Farms]

Here are some sample meat CSA's look at them and see where we stand with everything that I have posted. Do you think we are giving too much? I know for one that I couldn't eat for a whole month on any of these CSAs which I'm starting to believe that it's not geared towards a family at all.

http://stillmansfarm.com/meatcsa.html

http://www.naturesharmonyfarm.com/georgia-meat-csa/

http://www.grassfedcow.com/meat_csa.pdf

http://www.marinsunfarms.com/meatclub/meatclub.html

 

[WhiteMountainsRanch]

Those ones you listed don't seem to be nearly enough food.

 

[ShadyHoller]

Is it possible that supplying a full month's worth of meat might make it less attractive to some consumers?

I don't subscribe to a CSA myself, because my garden is like the little shop of horrors (growing out of control, with a mind of its own) but a lot of my friends get vegetable CSAs. I have heard them complain that their CSA packages are too big, and they can't use it up in time. They appreciate having everything that comes in the CSA, but they don't want to have their menu set for them for the whole month, determined by what was in the CSA package. Some people I know like the adventure of going to see what is to be found at the farmers' markets, and they will go get something obscure from time to time (goat, rabbit, etc.) so if you give them a whole month's worth of meat in their CSA, that will fill their culinary calendar, and not leave room for much else.

So, in other words, I guess there might be a balance for many CSA customers: big enough to replenish the freezer and pantry once a month, but not so big that it pushes out any other grocery options.

I'm not trying to tell you how to do it, just throwing that perspective out there for food for thought (pun intended).

 

[TimG]

A few disjointed comments and questions.

From one of the CSA sites you linked:

You can expect to save up to 20% by purchasing your meat through the CSA packages as compared to purchasing incrementally from our Butcher Shop or Farmers Markets and even more by ordering further discounted additional items.

This is the mentality I would have if I were to join a CSA, I'd want to be getting a discount by buying in this manner. It appears to me that you believe customers will pay a premium for the convenience of monthly meat deliveries/packages. You have experience, I am not claiming you are wrong in general, just pointing out that some people think "discount" when they buy a package. I am sure a lot depends upon how you market it.

The four CSAs you linked serve large metropolitan areas: Boston, Atlanta (2), and San Francisco. One of the CSAs mentioned a $15/pound ribeye -- that seems high to me, but could well be typical in a high cost of living big city like Boston or San Francisco (I don't really know about Atlanta). The average price of the meat at the CSAs linked seemed to be $7-$8 per pound. That's about what I would expect to pay for a ribeye -- the thought of paying that for ground meat or stew meat is, well, foreign to me.

I know your inquiry is mostly about logistics rather than trying to figure out whether you will have a market for your product. And, I believe you when you say you will have a market. I'm curious though, how big a metropolitan area are you serving?

I don't imagine that people who join meat CSAs and pay a premium for the service are likely to be thinking about filling their freezer with the meat. If they were thinking about filling their freezer, they'd be buying a half or quarter. So, despite my previous comment that people could freeze the extras for use in non-CSA months, I don't think that is the mentality CSA members have. Their CSA meat is much more likely to be a substitution for a portion of their regular meat purchases. They're not thinking "I'll join this CSA and never buy meat at the grocery store [or farmers' market or butcher or whatever]". With this in mind, I'd suggest smaller monthly packages. Someone can always buy multiple packages if they want more. Your goal shouldn't be to cover a family's monthly meat consumption.​

 

[ourflockof4]

If I'm correct here Jeff is between Cleveland and Canton OH. Some of the more high end burbs are in that area. I believe some cities, like Hudson for example, have a large green/ sustainable movement going on right now. If he is pulling a client base from those areas they will pay the extra cost and not even blink.

I think that some of us, myself included, don't really know cost of true grass feed meat. I'm 60 or so miles to the west and I pay about $1.80/lb for pork & beef from a local farmer, including processing at a USDA facility. But grass feed only meat is harder to come by in my area, thus I'm sure it cost more.

A few side notes though

It would be hard to adjust the amount of meat in this case unless you adjusted the number of shares, and more shares would mean more work/selling effort.

The quantity would be about right for our flock of 4, but our kids don't eat much. As mentioned earlier though, most of us board members probably have a little different eating habits then the average person, or your average costumer.

Also I know of 4 inspected processing facilities within 15 miles of my house, but none of them really packeage for resale. I haven't looked into it at all, but your a la carte steak idea may require different packaging that may involve additional processing cost.

 

[Brunty_Farms]

Quote:
Ya, I'm about 10 minutes from Hudson. I live in Bath Township so I'm extremely close, not to mention the customers in Bath have a higher income per family as well. Lebron James and his family still have homes in Bath so that tells you my client base. However my goal here isn't to get the highest amount of money but to get paid for my time. A lot of people that are interested live on the outskirts of Cleveland. Any big city all over the country has it's pockets of people that want good food. Toledo, Columbus, Dayton, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Canton, Akron, Cleveland, are just a few in Ohio. Obviously one being in PA but they are close enough to tap into. Every state all over has the same thing, you just have to find them, because Ohio is no LA, Atlanta, Chicago, ect. Just a farming state with a lot of knowledgeable consumers. Like you said, there is a lot of work in pasture raised meats mainly for beef. I'm paying $2.50 / pound hanging weight for the cows which is a wholesale price, which doesn't include cut and wrapping. But yes, all of the beef will need to be USDA approved and privately labeled because I'm a third party on the beef. The pork however I can save about 10 cents / pound because they are mine and I don't need that label saying that it's my pork. However more than likely everything will be USDA / privately labeled Brunty Farms so if I have to, I can sell at a market or a store.

Like you said, you can't just adjust the meat however you want unless you adjust the shares. For example there are 36 members which can comfortably use up a whole cow in a month. This was based off of the steaks, since you only have so many, you can only have so many share holders. For instance there is only 24 t-bones so that means that 12 people get t-bones one month. Since there is 24 ribeyes, 12 people get ribeyes, and the last 12 people will get the 12, 3-4 lb sirloins making it an even 36 steaks or packages. This will then rotate the next month. Since I'm not about to give someone just 1 steak it only makes sense to give them a package of 2 if you're going to do steaks. Everything else falls into place after you get the steaks taken care of. For example I believe that you get around 48 roast of various parts of the cow. That's enough to give 36 people or members 1 roast a month. However I still have 12 left over.... which I will more than likely sell A la Carte. But if I take on 12 more members, it totally screws up the steak part of the share... which like someone already said, without the steaks, I don't want it. So I can't skimp just to make it work. I'd rather have extra than not enough.

If you start doing multiple packages of multiple weights this is where I believe you can screw up big time. Because you get overwhelmed and run into the issue of not having enough product to go around. For instance the CSA's I have pointed out in the links, I think have fallen short. Maybe it works in their area but it wouldn't work here. I personally believe that there just isn't enough food in the box for families. See, and I point this out to Tim... a lot of those CSA's are targeting people with lots of money that don't care what they are getting. They feel like they are doing a good thing by buying from a local farmer and can sit high on a pedestal because of it. But in reality you know as well as I do that the meat in those packages would barely feed me for a month let alone a small family. However the customers I'm dealing with watch what they spend carefully. They don't mind spending the money for a good food but they want to know they are getting what they paid for. Like for example here is a sample share from a well known meat CSA

A monthly share may include 1 young Poulet Rouge broiler chicken (3 pounds), 1 doz eggs, 2 lbs ground beef, 1 lb ground pork, 2 lbs pork chops, 1 lb sirloin steak, one 3.5-lb roast and 2.5 lbs stew beef.

Now priced individually in my area your looking at $10.00 for the chicken, $4.00 for the eggs, $10.00 for the beef, $5.00 for the pork, $12.00 for the chops, $12.00 for the steak, $16.00 for the roast and maybe $10.00 for the stew. Total $80.00... which keep in mind is premium retail prices at a farmers market. The price for this share is $120.00. Which me personally is not really doable for my area. For instance by myself I could eat the dozen eggs in two weeks. Say I went out to eat twice a week, I would have to plan 5 meals (just for dinner) I could have 1 pound ground beef (leftovers for lunch) for Monday. Tuesday I would go out for wings

, Wednesday would be steak night ( however I would cut that sirloin into 4 pieces giving myself steak night for a month), Thursday would be pork chops I eat two of them so that's one package or one pound, Friday would be a half chicken on the grill, Saturday would be a nice dinner with the family I guess, which would leave Sunday for a roast ( again I would cut this up into 3 pieces as I wouldn't be able to eat a 3 pound roast.

After doing this, this would leave me for week two, a half a chicken, a pound of ground beef, a pound of Pork, a package of pork chops, steak, and again stew. Say I had the pork for breakfast with my eggs on Monday, and used the leftover sausage to make sandwiches for lunch. Monday night would be the chicken and the leftovers for Tuesdays lunch. Then for Tuesday, wing night. Wednesday would be some steak, with a date, at eight...

couldn't help myself( so that leaves me with 1 steak left). On Thursday I would have some chops. On Friday I would make Burgers with the beef and eat the remaining for Saturdays dinner ( decided to stay in). Than for SUnday I had some friends over for the Cleveland game and we finished of the roast for some pulled BBQ beef sandwiches and some beer. That leaves me with two weeks left out of the month to plan for meals. However if I didn't cook and was like the average single guy, I would have went out to eat more and have ordered a pizza at least once a week. I bet I could stretch that 15 pounds of meat over a month.

However the whole point of that was, a family would kill that in a week to 10 days leaving them to find meat either A la Carte from the farm or buying from a grocery store.

I think that when planning out a CSA that you should do at least 3 weeks of meals leaving plenty of room for going out and ordering food in. What I'm getting at, my customers would look at these CSA's and respectfully decline because it's not a fad for them, it's a lifestyle. They are willing to pay the money but want enough meat or food to show for it. However too much like a half or a whole would be way too much and probably overwhelm them.

The biggest thing in this is knowing that your filling a niche. It's not designed to fit families of two nor families of 8. See if a couple came up to me and was really interested in the box program and really wanted it, I would advise them to find someone to go half with, such as a family member or a close friend. It would be a perfect fit. Same with a family of 8 that is looking for a bargain, I would tell them, you should really look into buying a half of pig and a quarter beef for your family. And would proceed to tell them that you save money by buying the whole animal.

I disagree with the 20% savings if you're buying a CSA. I think it should be the opposite because it's more work. For instance I have to take the animal to the processor, pick it up, divide it up, then pack it and distribute it. Which is more work than bringing it home from the processor and putting it into the freezer for future sales at a farmers market. And way more work than selling the animal to a customer and having them pick it up straight from the processor. If the customers want to save money I will direct them in the right direction. If they want convenience, I will have that too.

Now my head is really spinning. Thanks again for the comments....​

 

[ourflockof4]

I think that you are on the right track, and will do well with it. If you realize that your a la catre cuts aren't moving as well as you would like them to then you could also go one step further and do another value added task. If the extra roast or whatever aren't moving then you could have them ground the next month and pressed into patties that may sell better in the summer months.

I guess the next step is how do you plan on implementing it? Are you going to start to take orders now for one that starts in May? Or are you going to spend the summer at the market selling it for a next winter or spring start? Does your source for beef have enough availible for you start when you want to? Also would your source be able to sell you only one side if you needed it? If so then that may open up your options on when you start, and your number of people the first year. Between the butcher and the farmer they should be able to find a taker for the other half if your numbers aren't what they need. If your raising all the hogs yourself you also have the flexibility of how many to butcher, and as long as you are selling half's, and outlet for any extra that you may not need.