New Member: 25 day Eggtopsies for first time hatch

[10sevol]

Hi Everyone. First post for a long time lurker.

We are in day 25 of our first attempt at incubating (12 eggs...RIR, Americauna, and barnyard mix). No hatch on day 25, and I've ready page after page here of discussions of things that could've went wrong. So, I wanted to post my story and hope for some advice.

We had tough time candling these dark eggs, but I tried it on day 7 and 14. While I didn't see movement, I did see some big dark shapes, and no definitive problems, and so I let them all ride it out. On 18, we took them out of the turner, refilled the water channels at the base of the incubator, and maintained 99.5 (still air incubator, non-calibrated thermometer).

So, today, I water tested all 12 eggs. 5 of them floated around 1/3 of the shell out of the water, and I set them aside for eggtopsies. The other 7 rode just under the water, or barely breaking the water's surface, and so I put them back in the incubator.

Of the 5 that I tested, two were yolkers. One looked like it died in the first week, just a small embryo. The other two were feathered out chicks, just dead. They looked what I would consider to be "hatching" size, definitely late termers. The yolks were not fully absorbed, but they seemed small (maybe partially absorbed)?

Of the remaining seven, one has a cracked shell at the pointed in, as though it attempted (or is attempting) to pip. The rest, no movement, other than the promising result on the water test.

Can you tell at eggtopsy if you drowned the chick by keeping too much water around? My second question is, given the water test, and the fact that two of the eggtopsies had nearly fully developed chicks, should I let the 7 go another day or two?

Thanks everyone!
Dan

 

[Kelsie2290]

Sorry about your hatch, it is really disappointing to have a bad one.
A couple of things I would check ... still-air (no fan) incubators need to be run at a higher temperature than forced-airs (with fan).... In a still air, it is also important where you are taking the temperature, with a fan the circulating air warms all around the egg while in still air incs temps are warmer at the top of the egg than at the bottom, so you kinds of need an average. From what is recommended on BYC the ideal temperature at the top of the eggs in still-airs is 101.5-102* .... A consistently cooler temperature usually increases incubation times and gives weak chicks and hatch rates will be lower...
Also calibrate/ double check your thermometer, it is not unusual for them to be off a degree or two.
Water wise, you want the eggs to lose about 13% of their weight during incubation, (either weigh them or check air-cells) if they don't lose enough the chicks can drown / lower hatch rates... during hatch itself they do need higher humidity to hatch, that will not cause them to drown.
You might as well leave them in there another day or two, but it is probably hopeless, sorry.
Not sure if you have seen it, but this is a wonderful article on hatching eggs in the Learning Center https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/hatching-eggs-101
And ... Hello and Welcome To BYC!

 

[10sevol]

Thanks so much for the reply. Your opinions make a lot of sense.

I was using an LG bator with the included thermometer (sort of conventional mercury style that is embedded in a 4"x4" plastic card. The LG instructions say to lay that thermometer on top of the eggs, and measure from there at 99.5.

It certainly sounds like it was just a little too cold based on your description of how air isn't consistently warm in a still air incubator. I didn't realize how sensitive these little guys are to temperature. In my mind, I'm wondering how nature keeps things so closely regulated!

We found some white leghorn fertile eggs from a local source, and I think we're going to give those a try. It was pretty tough to candle the batch we just had.

 

[lazy gardener]

White leghorn eggs would be an excellent choice for you. When you candle them, be sure to do it in a very dark room: even ambient light coming in through the night time window, and the multiple digital LED's in the typical house may make it a bit more difficult to see. Also, use a good flashlight with NEW batteries. You'll be able to see best if you hold the egg in one hand with the air cell up, and cup the flashlight in your other hand so it shines down through the air cell. Review the candling images before you start so you'll know what you're looking at. do you have a medical thermometer? Perhaps a digital one? You can use that to "calibrate" a regular bulb type weather thermometer. Get a cup of water, and use the digital thermometer to adjust the water to 100 degrees. Then add your bulb type of thermometer. If they both read 100 degrees, the bulb is accurate enough. If the bulb reads 98, you'll know that it's off by 2 degrees. So, when you're checking your temp, and the thermometer says 98, it's actually 100. Now, you can use that bulb to compare it to the thermometer that came with your incubator. Of course, you will have warm and cold spots in your incubator, so you must be very aware of that when you're placing and moving eggs. The last recommendation I have for you is to throw out the instructions that came with your incubator regarding adjusting the humidity. Do a thread search regarding "dry incubation". This should make your next hatch come out much better.

 

[10sevol]

Thank you. I have a couple of digital thermometers that I use for my BBQ smoker. I'll try to calibrate using those.

I also have access to a gun-type infrared thermometer at our office. I'm not sure how accurate they are, but I guess another opinion from another device couldn't hurt!

I will look into the dry incubation. I filled my water trays from day one (per LG instructions, again). So, I probably didn't help myself there either.

I built a candler out of a coffee can with a 3/4" hole drilled in the bottom, a lamp base, and a 60 watt bulb. I put some foam tape around the hole to protect the egg. That worked ok on about 1/2 eggs. There are a lot of good pictures on BYC that I wish I had studied beforehand because some looked very similar to what I could see. Next time, I'm using a 9 LED flashlight that we have.