New Point of Lay Hen - Pale/Wattle turned pale .....

[Canine and Co]

What is a gram stain? (Excuse my ignorance) @Wyorp Rock

I rang the vet to ask about testing and explained what i've tried and previous test results and they (unfortunately) suggested best thing may be putting to sleep (I don't think there is a wide knowedge of hens in this area as it is rural and farmers wouldn't rush to the vets). I haven't taken her in - I want to give her every chance before I give up on her. She is about 38 weeks old (I checked with the breeder). She laid an egg without a shell yesterday - in her life she has only laid approx. 3 eggs - all without shells. I'm guessing due to lack of eating - her body hasn't got the right nutrients in her. She will occaisionally peck at food - but rarely eats it.

I have some tylan in stock, vitamins and Apple cider vinegar that I can try at the end of the coxoid treatment this week.

Thank you.

I've attached a couple of pics. (Not brilliant - but I will take another today). The pics are of my other cream legbar - who sits by her during the day. Ginger is the one in the run - not sure if you can see how pale she is in comparison. Her wattle have almost shrunk into nothing!

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Poor thing!
She's not doing well is she?

A gram stain is a test used to check for bacterial infection.

What "type" of Tylan do you have - water soluble (powder) or injectable (liquid)? IF Injectable, that can be given orally now even if you are giving the Coxoid. IF powder, then I would not mix the Coxoid and Tylan together in the water. While there are no contraindications that I know of using the 2 together - usually you only want to add 1 medication to water.

Once you finish the Coxoid. I would also get some B vitamins into her. If you don't have those, I would give her a little beef liver if possible. If things are like they are here, certain supplies/foods/etc. are limited, you simply cannot get it or the price has gone up!
I would also try to get some Calcium into her since she may be deficient in that - a soft shelled egg she may need Calcium or it could be another "symptom" that is presenting itself. You can give a supplement like Caltrate or I usually keep TUMS (which is a calcium antacid) on hand. I would give only for 2-3 days.

You are doing everything you can for her. I know it must be frustrating and heartbreaking - you've hung in there with her.

 

[Canine and Co]

Thank you so much.

The Tylan I have is water soluble (powder). Funnily enough i've recently ordered some intensive Vit D and Calcium supplement, along with some more poulty intensive vitamin drops.

Tonight I syringed some of the medicated water (as well as the drench this morning) and syringed a small amount of liquid vitamins (hope that was ok to give her at the same time as the medicated water) and I put tiny amounts of scrambled egg mixed with cream (I know it's not really nutritional - but I just wanted to encourage her to eat something).

After Wednesday this week - she will have had Coxoid for 7 days. Do you think I should put her on vitamins for 3 days and then start the Tylan? Or would it be ok to syringe the Tylan and then some vitamins at the same time? Sorry for all the questions!

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Generally you do not want to give extra vitamins that contain B1 (Thiamine) when treating with Amprolium (Coxoid, Corid, etc.) since it acts as a Thiamine blocker to starve/reduce the number of Coccidia so the bird has the ability to resist and overload.

After you finish the Coxoid, I would begin the Tylan and give vitamins - I know of no contraindications of giving them together.

 

[Canine and Co]

Thank you @Wyorp Rock - that makes sense (I hope I haven't caused any issues giving her some vitamins for two days).

This is Ginger today! I will update with how she is in a few days after she finishes her 7 day Coxoid medication.

 

[Canine and Co]

Update:-

It's been a week since my last post. Ginger is hanging in there but is skin and bone under her feathers. She is still very pale and her wattle curls up - almost disappearing from sight. During the last two days i've noticed her wings are hanging down.

* She has now had 8 days of Coxoid (drenching and in her water);
* After this I syringed a poultry Nutri Vitamin intensive boost and have given her Tylan for 4 days (in her water).
* I try to tempt her with food and she shows some interest - but I don't think she is eating
much at all.
* Her poop is still quite watery (and white/green in colour).
* I have checked her for mites and she is clean (she has had red mite and louse powder
prevention every couple of months).
* She was last wormed early April I think - I will double check (when I sent her sample to the lab she was free of worms but had high levels of Cocci).

It's literally heartbreaking to see nothing work. I am thinking of giving her Coxoid again for 2 or 3 days (I have a little left) and see if it is that she needed longer on this treatment? I could worm her again - but would be worried her little body can't take it just yet - what do you think? I also have ACV I can add to her water instead (maybe syringe a small amount in her? May help if she has problems internally??? I may be grasping at straws here!).

I've attached pictures of her as she is today. Not sure about the situation with her wings - unless it is that she is literally that weak?

Any help or advice is gratefully received.

Thank you Donna.

@Wyorp Rock

 

[Wyorp Rock]

She has now had 8 days of Coxoid....I am thinking of giving her Coxoid again for 2 or 3 days

I'm sorry she's still not doing well.

No, I would not give any more Coxoid.
The fecal float showed not worms and you wormed in April. I would not de-worm her.

Her crop looks quite puffed out in the photo - is it completely empty/flat in the morning before she has had anything to eat or drink?

I think I would try giving her vitamins, some buttermilk or yogurt, egg and chick starter if you have it.
Check that crop. The wings hanging down - I'm thinking she's failing.

 

[Canine and Co]

Sad to say the crop is just her bone jutting out - it always feels empty morning and evening. I will be carrying her to bed soon, so I will check again and try and take a pic under her feathers if I can.

I have been trying her on some chick crumb (medicated) for the last 6 days, i've also tried to tempt her to have it as mash or with some porridge. I also have tried her with some scrambled egg but she is not interested in anything. She goes to peck and move food around her bowl, but I think she only has a bit of corn. I did put a tiny bit of yoghurt in her mouth during the week just to put something in her and I could do that again. She has been on Poultry Nutri Drops (A fast acting pick-me-up packed full of vitamins and minerals and extra B vitamins to help support birds in stressful situations) for the last 4 days.

Thanks

 

[Canine and Co]

NB - it says that the Nutri drops are good following antibiotic treatment, but i've given this at the same time - do you think it has been ok to do this?

 

[Wyorp Rock]

I have been trying her on some chick crumb (medicated) for the last 6 days

It's o.k. to give the vitamins while giving antibiotics, just not when giving the Amprolium (Coxoid).

What is the "medication" in your chick starter? You are not in the US right(?) so does the medicated feed have Amprol/Amprolium or another ingredient?