Not an Emergency...Marek's in the Flock

[ten chicks]

Thank you all for information. I have sent in questions regarding marek's vaccine and the use of "caine' products to the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association. They are checking with experts regarding this and said they will get back to me with information.

 

[Nambroth]

Thank you,but my original post was regarding Marek's,ILT was mentioned b/c in Canada(possible elsewhere)they have been using a combined vaccination HVT+ILT(Innovax-ILT). It is confusing,the articles i provided links for say that chicks vaccinated with live virus can shed virus to unvaccinated birds. I will be discussing this with my vet,see what he has to say regarding vaccinated birds shedding virus to unvaccinated birds.

Ah-- I see, if that is true, that might be a problem!! I was not aware that the Innovax Marek's vaccine came only when paired this way. The only info I can find is the Innovax-ND (which is a combo Marek's and Newcastle vaccine). Is that an option for you? The Innovax-ND has live HVT combined with dead ND... so they should be protected (as far as that goes) by both but cannot spread either disease...
http://www.innovax-vaccines.com/media/uploaded/docs/IS-3096 Innovax ND-SB Q&A.pdf

Thank you for clarifying. I was misunderstanding what you meant. If the suggested Marek's vaccination in Canada is the Innovax-ILT, then that is a problem and I will add it to my FAQ....

 

[seminolewind]

I have read many articles stating that virus can be shed by vaccinated birds,if they were vaccinated with a live virus vaccine. Links to a couple.

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ps030

http://www.poultryclub.org/poultry/health-and-diseases/

Vaccinated birds can carry and shed the virus, but the virus was not given to them by the vaccine. The vaccine also, only protects against developing tumors, but they can still get the virus from other sources, not the vaccine.

Vaccine is material that will evoke the body to build antibodies against a disease without giving it to them. Turkey Marek's is a live vaccine. It comes on ice and is mixed with broth. The body is tricked into thinking it's chicken Marek's and produces antibodies. Attenuated Chicken Marek's virus is usually made sterile or missing an element that makes it impossible to multiply. Canine rabies vaccine is the same way.

Live virus vaccine has always been better than dried. But both still work. And live virus is altered so that it can not give an animal the virus.

 

[seminolewind]

Thank you,but my original post was regarding Marek's,ILT was mentioned b/c in Canada(possible elsewhere)they have been using a combined vaccination HVT+ILT(Innovax-ILT). It is confusing,the articles i provided links for say that chicks vaccinated with live virus can shed virus to unvaccinated birds. I will be discussing this with my vet,see what he has to say regarding vaccinated birds shedding virus to unvaccinated birds.

If live virus caused chicks to shed true virus, what would be the point in vaccinating??

 

[ten chicks]

This is the question i would like an answer to. The articles i have read from different parts of the world,not just Canada claim that if you purchase vaccinated chicks and bring them into a flock of unvaccinated chickens you run the risk of them contracting virus via shedding of virus from vaccinated chicks. I know this is contrary to what everyone is saying,but i am confused as to why so many articles on this subject say elsewise.

As previous mentioned,i have sent these questions to the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association and they have replied that they are consulting with experts and will reply with the information i requested.

Everyone that has replied to my questions are probably correct,but b/c i have come across these discrepancies,i need to be 100% sure.

 

[Nambroth]

If live virus caused chicks to shed true virus, what would be the point in vaccinating??

I am thinking that it's because in the case of Ten Chick's vaccine, produced by Innovax, it is Marek's vaccine HVT paired with the Infectious laryngotracheitis (ILT) vaccine, which can indeed cause shedding of live ILT virus, which is why Infectious laryngotracheitis (ILT) vaccination must not be done flippantly and one should take careful consideration all of the factors before vaccination.

It seems to me that the danger of this pairing is that the vaccinated birds cannot shed MDV but can shed ILT....
I'm sure this vaccine was developed for the poultry industry, most of which now practices "all in - all out" husbandry and so are not worried if 100% of chicks are vaccinated....
A little different than what we experience in small backyard flocks of pets or 'pets with benefits' for some. Even if they are just livestock, the husbandry is different in small backyard or small farm conditions...

 

[seminolewind]

Not having a good time. One near dead. One symptomatic this morning. One possibility. All from one vaccine group. Last week one roo died, Marek's.

I spent today shuffling and disinfecting. I moved my 5to6 year old Polish girls to be separate. I left 3 skinny hens and one skinny roo together. I moved a "resistant" roo and 2 vaccinated hens separate from the others. One vaccinated Wyandotte sleeping all day.

It may have been the vaccine. Very sad.

 

[schnebbles]

I'm sorry Seminole, that's so darn sad Sickening. When did you vaccinate? were they older birds when vaccinated? I'm STILL on the fence about vaccinating mine. I wanted to get 2 favorelles and found someone who has some but they aren't vaccinated and I told her I better wait until she can hatch some and vaccinate day old. I'm not risking the lives of pullets who are fine and not exposed as bad as I want them.

this just sucks! it's awful and it's not fair.

 

[Haunted55]

Not having a good time. One near dead. One symptomatic this morning. One possibility. All from one vaccine group. Last week one roo died, Marek's.

I spent today shuffling and disinfecting. I moved my 5to6 year old Polish girls to be separate. I left 3 skinny hens and one skinny roo together. I moved a "resistant" roo and 2 vaccinated hens separate from the others. One vaccinated Wyandotte sleeping all day.

It may have been the vaccine. Very sad.

Me too Seminole...yesterday i found one of my original girls unable to walk and having to use her wings to balance. Not sure if it's injury or Marek's yet. She's fat and sassy but they are under a lot of stress as I had to bring in over 50 birds for the Winter. Everyone is on edge. I am hoping this will settle and she'll recover.

 

[casportpony]

So sorry you guys... Maybe it's that time of year? 'cause I've got a few that are looking iffy, one with ocular changes that spends most of the days in the bushes, a young stunted one that been yawing non-stop, and the one that walk like her legs are tied together... Then of course there's the one that just died, that's the one that went from drunk looking to unable to stand a a couple of days. FWIW, it seems like I lost a few around this time last year, too.

Again, sorry for your losses and your sick birds.

-Kathy