Not an Emergency...Marek's in the Flock

[CottonGinWaste]

Thanks. I should have said "survived" instead of cured. I have two survivors from my original flock that have never shown symptoms. I am ok with un-symptomatic.

You're on the Gulf Coast?? Who do you use for blood tests/etc? I'm in Mobile and chicken vets are hard to find; I'm going to check with the one vet listed as "Avian" tomorrow (since today is Fat Tuesday and everything is closed). I suspect Marek's in a sick bird (hatchery stock; vaccinated) and want to verify yes/no.

 

[Nambroth]

Nambroth, thank you taking the time to write such a thorough reply. I read through your article as well, it is very well-written. I really wish I would have found it before I ever bought chickens. Hindsight is great, isn't it?

Yeah-- hindsight sure is great! I barely knew anything about Marek's until my rooster died. I don't know if it would have changed anything, but 'getting' the disease is how a lot of us tend to find out about it... You're not alone.


I am having my vet find out what we need to do to get the test for Marek's done at Texas A&M. I think I am going to have one chicken tested from each of my little groups and see what comes back. Getting to my vet is a problem for me because they are over an hour away plus I worry about cross contamination during the trip. I would like to combine all the blood samples in one shipping container to help save on costs.
I hear you. My vet is about 2 hours away, which can make things a lot more troublesome than they already are.

To my knowledge, none of my chicks were vaccinated. I know for a fact that the ones from the breeder weren't and I would be shocked if the ones from the farm store were. I have mixed feelings about vaccinating for Marek's anyway. Unless I misunderstand, vaccinated chickens can still acquire and spread the virus, they just don't show symptoms? On one hand, I would rather know my chickens have it so I didn't spread it to others, on the other, I really wish my feathered friends did not have to suffer with this terrible disease. You just can't really win.


You understand right-- even vaccinated birds that develop resistance will still become infected if they are exposed to Marek's. It is safe to say ANY chicken, regardless of vaccine or genetics, will become infected with Marek's if it is exposed to it. What happens next is dependent on vaccine, genetics, health, the voodoo chicken gods, etc.
So, any exposed chicken, vaccinated or not, will manufacture and shed the virus for life. It is generally understood that birds with active infections-- meaning that they are having an immune response and symptoms and are actively fighting the virus-- shed MORE virus, but even perfectly healthy birds can shed some amounts of the virus.
However, look at it this way...
1: You vaccinate, and never know if your chickens are carriers or not, because none of them seem to get sick. You sell, adopt, or show birds and accidentally spread the disease. Or..
2: You don't vaccinate, and never know if your chickens are carriers or not (a lot of people have flocks that have built genetic resistance) because none of them seem to get sick. You sell, adopt, or show birds and accidentally spread the disease.

In scenario 1, you have the added peace of mind that you did everything you could to keep your chickens alive.
In scenario 2, there is always a chance they haven't been exposed yet, and will later become exposed and may suffer the illness.

I think a lot of people have it in their unvaccinated flocks and just don't realize it. They may have a chicken die once in a while, from 'who knows what, chickens just die' and...? I think you can see what I am getting at. There is an unknown factor either way! People accidentally spread this pretty often because they just don't know their birds are carriers. So the choice to vaccinate or not is very personal.

 

[BigECarter]

You're on the Gulf Coast??  Who do you use for blood tests/etc?  I'm in Mobile and chicken vets are hard to find; I'm going to check with the one vet listed as "Avian" tomorrow (since today is Fat Tuesday and everything is closed).  I suspect Marek's in a sick bird (hatchery stock; vaccinated) and want to verify yes/no.

I found a vet in Saucier, on Hwy 49, but he didn't do much. Diagnosed mites and worms and gave me some antibiotics. I ultimately sent a bird to the state lab in Pearl MS for a necropsy. DH packaged the bird and brought it to the nearest health department. A courier took her to Jackson that night, and then to Pearl in the morning. $8, so way cheaper than if we had paid to have her overnighted.

I seem to have lucked out with a virulent form of Marek's. I have a paralyzed pullet from Murray McMurray - but I also have 8 healthy pullets too, so I'm not complaining much.

 

[KAT Bird]

I found a vet in Saucier, on Hwy 49, but he didn't do much. Diagnosed mites and worms and gave me some antibiotics. I ultimately sent a bird to the state lab in Pearl MS for a necropsy. DH packaged the bird and brought it to the nearest health department. A courier took her to Jackson that night, and then to Pearl in the morning. $8, so way cheaper than if we had paid to have her overnighted.

I seem to have lucked out with a virulent form of Marek's. I have a paralyzed pullet from Murray McMurray - but I also have 8 healthy pullets too, so I'm not complaining much.

How old were your Murray McMurray pullets when you got them? How old when they were exposed to the carrier birds? Just curious because I put three pullets out with my carrier birds and they were about 26 weeks old at the time. So far, so good...they have been together since early November. I also have seven pullets in my basement that I will be putting out in the coop (weather permitting) around the end of March. They will be 26-30 weeks at that time. I am keeping them away from the carriers until they start laying. The "trigger" in my original bunch seemed to be the stress they were under at point of lay. I was hoping by getting past that stressor without being exposed to the virus might help. Also hoping they have better developed immune systems as they age. It is all a guess at this point.

 

[BigECarter]

My MM chicks were days old when I got them. Full exposure at around 4 weeks. And they are at the point of lay, so that seems to have been the trigger for the one that is succumbing. She also had coccidiosis - maybe at three weeks? I forget.

I know we should cull but she is so alert and happy. Poor girl.

 

[KAT Bird]

My MM chicks were days old when I got them. Full exposure at around 4 weeks. And they are at the point of lay, so that seems to have been the trigger for the one that is succumbing. She also had coccidiosis - maybe at three weeks? I forget.

I know we should cull but she is so alert and happy. Poor girl.

I kept a few of mine for awhile before euthanizing them. It is a hard decision and it is different with each bird. Bertha was the hardest for me because she seemed content as a lap chicken. She would sit with me and I would pet her until she fell asleep. She would hear me come home from work and cluck louder and louder until I came and got her. She would sit on a towel in the kitchen and watch me cook dinner. She sat on my lap on the riding mower while I cut the grass. Took naps in my cat's bed and basked in the sunlight through the windows. Preened her feathers after I gave her baths. I finally decided it was time when she refused to eat. I tried hand feeding her with a syringe but she hated it. I knew after awhile she wasn't going to eat again on her own and she just looked tired. I would put her on the floor and move a few feet away, she could still stand on her legs and very awkwardly walk to me. Then she would lay down and pant. I held off hoping for a miracle but it never happened. She really didn't seem to suffer until she stopped eating and even then she just seemed more lethargic. Sort of how I remember feeling when I had mono.

Enjoy her while she is with you and you will know when the time is right. I will hope that maybe she will be one of the miracle birds that manages to survive.

 

[BigECarter]

Ursula is still with us. She seems to get worse, then levels off. She can scoot around on her wings. She loves her treats - scrambled eggs, cat food, and tomatoes are wolfed down. I'm ashamed to say that I haven't weighed her in a while, but I suspect that she is gaining. She has started some mouth breathing, which I take to indicate internal tumors, so that's a bad sign. But, unlike any of my previous Marek's birds, she is very alert and talkative.

None of the MM pullets are laying yet, but they are squatting so I know they are close. Even Ursula's waddles have reddened dramatically.

Has anybody had a Marek's symptomatic hen lay an egg? Is it even possible, or will she become egg bound?

 

[casportpony]

Ursula is still with us. She seems to get worse, then levels off. She can scoot around on her wings. She loves her treats - scrambled eggs, cat food, and tomatoes are wolfed down. I'm ashamed to say that I haven't weighed her in a while, but I suspect that she is gaining. She has started some mouth breathing, which I take to indicate internal tumors, so that's a bad sign. But, unlike any of my previous Marek's birds, she is very alert and talkative.

None of the MM pullets are laying yet, but they are squatting so I know they are close. Even Ursula's waddles have reddened dramatically.

Has anybody had a Marek's symptomatic hen lay an egg? Is it even possible, or will she become egg bound?

I have many with the ocular form that lay.

-Kathy

 

[KAT Bird]

Some of mine did lay eggs. In fact, that seems to be the stressor that caused the Marek's symptoms to start. Is Ursula panting? Is it worse at night?

 

[BigECarter]

Yes, she is panting, maybe a little more at night. She has some use of one leg, and is getting around a little better, although she may be learning to utilize her wings more. Her appetite is great and she is extremely alert. I thought the panting was indicative of tumors. Hadn't considered an egg.

One of the pullets laid a soft shelled egg night before last. Any suggestions on what I should look for or how to help Ursula?