Partridge Orpington Genetic Colour Questions

[steynig]

Hi,

I need help establishing why this Partridge Orpington hen is a bit too dark on her saddle/ back? What genes can cause this, my guess is not Melanin since that will give her slated/ dark legs.

Can it be a columbian restricting gene perhaps?

Correct colour below:

 

[steynig]

Thinking about it, it cannot be columbian either since that will cause her to be gold/ buff columbian...

Any other ideas?

 

[Henk69]

Not all melanizers will darken the shanks, especially when the breed has Id (inhibitor of dermal melanin causes white legs)

 

[steynig]

Henk,

Does Partridge Orpingtons not contain Id anyway, thats why the legs are light? The presense of Id makes legs light, the lack makes it slate? I used your crossbreeds calculator in these assumptions.

 

[Henk69]

Henk,

Does Partridge Orpingtons not contain Id anyway, thats why the legs are light? The presense of Id makes legs light, the lack makes it slate? I used your crossbreeds calculator in these assumptions.

Correct. So you have some leeway with the melanizers.

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
its not Columbian, columbian would make her look like a Buff Columbian Orp

 

[steynig]

K, so it is possible that this one is id/Id with Ml/ml+, and that the single Ml is not enough to make the legs dark due to Id/Id, but enough to make her saddle darker...

Reason for all these questions besides the interest in it is I want to breed a double laced orpington, therefore I would have to understand what genes are currently present in the flock and combine the correct pair.

They were bred with a Black Orpington a couple of years back, so all kind of genes could be present. I have partridge hens and roosters with dark legs, if they are Ml/ml+ and I mate them i should get a double laced.

If however they are Id/id+ it can also cause darker shanks, and I will then be waisting my time. This is unlikely though since the Black Orpington used by the original breeder was probably Id/Id, it can also be that from whatever breed they took the Partridge pattern first, they used a id+/id+ bird and then I will also be waisting my time.

I will give it a go and see what comes out, will post some photos of the dark leg partridge orps, don't know if an id+/id+ shank is different from a Ml/ml+ In appearance?

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
No, Melanotic has not effect on Dermal melanin, id+ does, so I would guess your bird has id+/id+ or other genes affecting the expression of Id/ but Ml has no effect on dermal melanin

 

[steynig]

But if she is id+/id+ her legs would be darker so I doubt it. Also, if she was Ml/Ml her legs would definitely be darker, it will however turn her into a double laced. The only difference between a pencilled/ partridge and a double laced is the Ml/Ml effect, partridge having light shanks and double laced dark shanks so Ml must affect the shanks...?

I think you are right though, there must be some other genes involved here...

Here is the current flock:

- Perfect partridge hens
-partridge hens with dark saddles
-partridge hens with dark saddles and dark legs

 

[steynig]

If the partridge hens with black legs have white soles, it can be Ml/ml+, and if they have dark/ blue soles they are Id/id+ or Id/Id.

This is also one of the chicks that hatched, looks an awful lot like a quail? If it is indeed quail, then the parent flock must contain Ml and Co right? I have a hen that shows virtually no lacing on breast, this can be the Co, and she has dark legs which can be Ml?