Peafowl 201: Further Genetics- Colors, Patterns, and More

[Peafowlssssssss]

Your bronze w/e hen with silver pied male could give you some silver or pied w/e chicks, IB for sure not bronze. If that pair never produced any chicks you should change the partners.

 

[KsKingBee]

Your bronze w/e hen with silver pied male could give you some silver or pied w/e chicks, IB for sure not bronze. If that pair never produced any chicks you should change the partners.

I thought all Silver Pieds are naturally already White Eye.

 

[Birdrain92]

I always thought Silver Pied carried a Pied, White Eyed, and White alleles

 

[KsKingBee]

I always thought Silver Pied carried a Pied, White Eyed, and White alleles

Silver Pied is the working of the Pied and White Eye gene working together with the White gene.

 

[WestKnollAmy]

Silver pied I understand but introducing the Bronze is new to me and it seems to be for everyone else too, as no one seems to understand my question. This makes me even more determined to work with my Bronze now. I do not especially like the coloring but I really thought the Progressive Bronze that was created was a beauty so I figure I can work on some of that in the next 10 years or so.

 

[Kedreeva]

Silver pied I understand but introducing the Bronze is new to me and it seems to be for everyone else too, as no one seems to understand my question. This makes me even more determined to work with my Bronze now. I do not especially like the coloring but I really thought the Progressive Bronze that was created was a beauty so I figure I can work on some of that in the next 10 years or so.

As far as I understand genetics across animals, the title "progressive bronze," though widely accepted among the peafowl community as the colloquial term for what is happening to that bird, is probably a misnomer... It is far more likely that the bronze with increasing white patches on it is afflicted by vitiligo. It's a skin condition/disease that occurs rarely in humans and animals which causes the autoimmune system to attack pigment cells/melanocytes.

It is, as far as anyone can tell, harmless and non-communicable and non-genetic, so while the bird is healthy and safe for other birds to be around, it is unlikely to pass on the condition to offspring. It is also probably not something one should attempt to breed for, as the causes and effects of the disease are not well researched.

 

[WestKnollAmy]

Okay, it was explained to me differently.
So I guess I should say what I am shooting for is a pied Bronze with more white on it than a regular pied and less than silver pied. I was confused when I saw one on how they got that amazing pattern and it was explained as a certain way of breeding some birds but still a fluke.
Your explanation is very good! Thank you!

 

[Kedreeva]

Okay, it was explained to me differently.
So I guess I should say what I am shooting for is a pied Bronze with more white on it than a regular pied and less than silver pied. I was confused when I saw one on how they got that amazing pattern and it was explained as a certain way of breeding some birds but still a fluke.
Your explanation is very good! Thank you!

It sounds like what you are aiming for is a high-white expression pied bird, which is mostly a fluke. I say mostly because I breed pieds here, and I breed for a double white shoulder (white patches covering both shoulders, because I think that looks cool)- all my hens are double white shouldered hens, and most of the kids produced are white shouldered from them, so how the condition expresses seems to have at least a tiny bit of genetic basis, but where the pigment cells fail to migrate to on any given bird is still pretty much a toss up.

It might help to understand that pied is not a set genetic pattern. The gene doesn't say "put white here, and here, and here." In fact, pied is a different, harmless genetic condition called leucism which affects the way the embryo develops. During development, the condition causes pigment cells to fail to migrate from the neural crest, and the white patches are a result of this failure- where no pigment cells exist, there can be no color. But, because the migration (or lack thereof) is random, the patterns vary from bird to bird and the amount of expression varies even within a clutch.

It may also help to understand that the expression of Pied versus the expression of White or pied is a factor of the Pied bird having one white and one pied gene. Imagine the genes as follows: White (W), Pied (p), white-eye (w). Dark pied birds are (pp) and express normal colors except for a white throat patch and white primaries. Pied birds are (Wp) and express with random patches of white over their bodies. White birds are (WW) and express as totally white birds. White-eye birds may be (w) or (ww) where a (w) bird may or may not express any indication of carrying one gene, and a (ww) bird should have a lighter color and possible small patches (or even just singular feathers) of white over their body. A silver pied bird should be (Wp + ww) resulting in an interaction of white, pied, and white-eye genes to create a bird which has almost no color but is not completely white. It is, as far as I can tell, not a bird with (WW, Wp, ww) genetics, because that would result in a completely white bird.

So to go back to the beginning, you're looking to breed a high-expression (Wp) bird. Which is mostly a fluke, but may be helped along by finding other high-expression birds and breeding them together in the hopes of reproducing the effect of their leucism in their offspring.

 

[Dany12]

"progressive bronze," ...Never heard that!
On the other hand progressive pied yes!

Here a wild peahen in a National Park in Sri Lanka!
The authorities ... who do not know anything about peacock say it's a white peacock!

For me it is a peahen with "vitiligo" as Kedreeva says!
It is not all white ... the red belly ... the gray wings .... dotted chest.
It is not the first female with "vitiligo" that we can find in this National Park! ... There is no discolored male!

 

[KsKingBee]

Silver pied I understand but introducing the Bronze is new to me and it seems to be for everyone else too, as no one seems to understand my question. This makes me even more determined to work with my Bronze now. I do not especially like the coloring but I really thought the Progressive Bronze that was created was a beauty so I figure I can work on some of that in the next 10 years or so.

It is likely to take more than ten years especially since you are uncertain of the parents to the bird you are working with. If I hatch out a Bronze SP this coming year I will let you know.