PINK Silkies & how are they "created"?

[chiclet]

i inquired on this forum about 6 months ago, and got this reply:
"Only fill your sink about 1/4 full of warm water and use lots of food coloring (up to half or more of the small bottles). This is the color that gets down to the bottom layer of feathers. After soaking your bird for a few minutes sprinkle contents of 1 pack of kool aid directly on to the bird and gently rub in. Get an 8-10 oz glass of water and dump a packet of kool aid in it. Wait till it desolves then pour it over the bird. Use third pack of kool aid and sprinkle kool aid on to damp gloved hands and apply to duller spots on bird to even out the color. After the first time you should have the emasurements and technique down."
"Dyeing" to try it out....

 

[Smokin Silkies]

When I first saw them online, that wasn't the same photos I saw. I've been searching for hours now trying to find the site/link/forum...whatever but I just can't find it anywhere! Maybe I'm just losing my mind lol?!?! I'm going to continue looking but I have a feeling I won't be able to find it again

 

[Smokin Silkies]

Quote:

Please post pics if you try it lol!

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Quote:
who ever wrote this was yanking your chain/new nothing about the Lav gene/or was hiding how they made them... the Lavender gene is recessive at diluting black so it takes 2 generations... lavXblack =all black split to lav F1's... black split to lavXblack split to lav = 25% lav F2's... 50% black split to lav... 25% pure black...

but it works totally different with red!!! LavXred = 100% yellowish F1's look at a pic of the yellow on an Isabella colored bird... they are lighter than a buff color more of a yellow cream look... NOT PINK lol...


BTW i have know idea how to get the pink color... lol

Heritage, you needed to read a bit more thoroughly. Much of what is written is not inaccurate. It was specifically mentioned that lav needs to copies to show an effect.

Many folks get confused about exactly what dominant means and does not mean. Dominance is between the two alleles (variations) of a single gene present in a bird: Lav+ is dominant over lav, Bl is dominant of bl+, E is dominant over e^b, B is dominant over b+. Lav+ has no dominance of any sort related to b or E.

I believe that what Inewegg meant by "lavender silkies carry a dominant genes for black color" is that a brd who is lavender is lav/lav E/E, with E being extended black. However, not all lavenders ARE extended black. In general, silkies are typically e^b; with black silkies carrying sufficient melanizer genes to colour all ground colour with black. Any time you breed to a non-black, you take the chance of reducing the melanizers needed to cover the ground colour areas.

Anyways, lav does not work differently with red; it still takes two generations to produce a lavender diluted appearance.

The theory is that a deep mahogany red bird diluted with two copies of the lavender gene would produce a pinkish bird.

If you use a SQ mahogany red it is wheaten based plus mahogany. Cross to a lavender and the offspring will be E^Wh Co Mh Lav+ from the red parent and E or e^b co+ mh+ lav from the lavender parent.

E/E^Wh Co/co_ Mh/mh+ Lav+/lav will be black with mahogany red leakage. -OR-- E/Wh e^b Co/co_ Mh/mh+ Lav+/lav will be mahogany red columbian.

Breed the offspring together or back to a lavender and you will get a percentage of lavender diluted mahogany birds. I do not think it will be the vibrant pink as in the photo, but perhaps more of a mauve-ish colour. At least that is the speculation at The Coop. There are also some issues that could make for difficulties; especially on male colouring. Not a simple project.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Quote:
An animal that is displaying a recessive phenotype (such as lavender) can not be "carrying" a dominant gene (like black). Recessive genes require two copies of that gene in order to be expressed. So any bird with two copies of the lavender gene will be lavender and any bird without two copies of the lavender gene will not be lavender. Since lavender is a dilution gene that affects black, you have either black (no copies of the lavender gene), black split to lavender (black birds that carry one copy of the lavender gene), or lavender (two copies of the lavender gene).

Any bird can have both dominant and recessive genes; typically they have MANY of each. Dominance does not relate to the relationship between different genes, but to the relationship between different alleles of the SAME gene, For the most part, all creatures have two copies of every gene. In one copy is dominant and the other is recessive, the dominant one affects the creature, and the other is essentially OFF. If both copies are recessive, that affects the creature. And if the gene is incompletely dominant, and there is one copy of a dominant allele and one of a recessive allele, the affect is intermediate between that produced by the dominant and that produced by the recessive.

All chickens are Lav+/Lav+ or Lav+/lav or lav/lav. They all also carry two copies of the e-allele, sometimes called the "black" gene as E is named "extended black." A bird who is E/E lav/lav is lavender. A bird who is E/E Lav+/lav is black. Depending on OTHER genes present in the bird, some patterning may be present, and htere may or may not be ground colour leakage.

Base colour of a bird is black (or white in its absence)
Ground colour in a bird is red/gold/silver.

 

[SilkieTime]

I once e-mailed a nice lady and told her the first chick I hatched out was pink. She was very nice about it and told me she never got pink from her flock. Now this was two years ago and my first hatch. Later I found out what happened and it is very easy. Put in a large amount of baby grit in there broody and if they use it for there dust bath on the white chicks you will have the nicest pink color chicks you ever saw. It just doesn't last very long. Sorry
I was sure I had a pink silkie. Thank you Mary for being so understanding. I will never forget that.

 

[heritagehabitatfarms]

Quote:
who ever wrote this was yanking your chain/new nothing about the Lav gene/or was hiding how they made them... the Lavender gene is recessive at diluting black so it takes 2 generations... lavXblack =all black split to lav F1's... black split to lavXblack split to lav = 25% lav F2's... 50% black split to lav... 25% pure black...

but it works totally different with red!!! LavXred = 100% yellowish F1's look at a pic of the yellow on an Isabella colored bird... they are lighter than a buff color more of a yellow cream look... NOT PINK lol...


BTW i have know idea how to get the pink color... lol

Heritage, you needed to read a bit more thoroughly. Much of what is written is not inaccurate. It was specifically mentioned that lav needs to copies to show an effect.

Many folks get confused about exactly what dominant means and does not mean. Dominance is between the two alleles (variations) of a single gene present in a bird: Lav+ is dominant over lav, Bl is dominant of bl+, E is dominant over e^b, B is dominant over b+. Lav+ has no dominance of any sort related to b or E.

I believe that what Inewegg meant by "lavender silkies carry a dominant genes for black color" is that a brd who is lavender is lav/lav E/E, with E being extended black. However, not all lavenders ARE extended black. In general, silkies are typically e^b; with black silkies carrying sufficient melanizer genes to colour all ground colour with black. Any time you breed to a non-black, you take the chance of reducing the melanizers needed to cover the ground colour areas.

Anyways, lav does not work differently with red; it still takes two generations to produce a lavender diluted appearance.

The theory is that a deep mahogany red bird diluted with two copies of the lavender gene would produce a pinkish bird.

If you use a SQ mahogany red it is wheaten based plus mahogany. Cross to a lavender and the offspring will be E^Wh Co Mh Lav+ from the red parent and E or e^b co+ mh+ lav from the lavender parent.

E/E^Wh Co/co_ Mh/mh+ Lav+/lav will be black with mahogany red leakage. -OR-- E/Wh e^b Co/co_ Mh/mh+ Lav+/lav will be mahogany red columbian.

Breed the offspring together or back to a lavender and you will get a percentage of lavender diluted mahogany birds. I do not think it will be the vibrant pink as in the photo, but perhaps more of a mauve-ish colour. At least that is the speculation at The Coop. There are also some issues that could make for difficulties; especially on male colouring. Not a simple project.

hmmm lol interesting... maby its different in silkies idk... i was basing my answer off of some experiments a friend of mine did... and extensive reading i have done... i saw the birds he hatched with my own eyes... he crossed a lav ORP rooster over some hatchery RIR... the F1s where yellowish cream color with black tails and some smutty black and almost a yellowish brown on there breasts... unfortunately they where killed in a dog attack and i don't have any pics... i also have hatched some EE's from a Lav AM rooster over EE hens and got 3 young roosters with the same color on neck and hackle feathers with black breasts... like a BBR with the red washed out... i ate them they where good lol... i tried to take pics of them but u could not tell the color in any of the pics i took... im not good at taking pic's lol...

im going to to some more research and will get back with y'all... i might be wrong lol but idk how that color would have happened if i am lol...

 

[Smokin Silkies]

The pics that I did see before were a very light diluted pink color. They weren't anywhere close to the bright pink colored silkie posted. It was like a White with a very light Pinkish tint on it.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Realize that in crossing two colours, you take homozygoud genes and change them to heterozygous in the offspring, and in birds who were het to begin with, some of the offspring do not inherit the allele at all.

There are many pigment dilution genes, not just lavender. I would say tat there is a fair chance that the lavender orpington contributed Di to the offspring, which has no affect on eumelanin, but dilutes pehomelanin; so its presence would not show in a lavender bird, but is a remnant from their buff orpington heritage; crossed into a red bird, it would then dilute the red pigment. This of course is speculation, but seems likely. There is plenty of research to show that lavender requires two copies to dilute either pigment, not just black.

 

[oh snap]

Yeah there would be issues with the male...The males would be blue.