Political Ramblings

[chickened]

So are the ones that send their children to private schools admitting that the public school system is broken ?

Our middle school principal that i got to know well thanks to 2nd son sends her son to a private school.

 

[Capvin]

I really do not know how much other countries spend per student on their educational system. All I know is that our system has gotten far behind in basic skills. And my point on paying teachers more money is really very simple. If a really good doctor can get $100,000 per procedure or a really good lawyer can demand a retainer of $100,000 for a case, then that doctor and that lawyer will strive to get the best results or they wont be able to command that kind of compensation. I am certain that if a school system says we will pay big salaries to teachers that get results, then I am certain that those teacher who qualify will get good results. Admittedly that is pretty simplistic and is certainly more complex then just teacher salaries. My kids went through the public system through the sixth grade and after that I wanted some assurances that I would get results. I could not find that in the public system and I could afford the private route and took it. No regrets.

 

[hemet dennis]

I really do not know how much other countries spend per student on their educational system. All I know is that our system has gotten far behind in basic skills. And my point on paying teachers more money is really very simple. If a really good doctor can get $100,000 per procedure or a really good lawyer can demand a retainer of $100,000 for a case, then that doctor and that lawyer will strive to get the best results or they wont be able to command that kind of compensation. I am certain that if a school system says we will pay big salaries to teachers that get results, then I am certain that those teacher who qualify will get good results. Admittedly that is pretty simplistic and is certainly more complex then just teacher salaries. My kids went through the public system through the sixth grade and after that I wanted some assurances that I would get results. I could not find that in the public system and I could afford the private route and took it. No regrets.

But if the doctor and lawyer are guaranteed a raise and more cases no matter the outcome of the former cases will they still strive to get the the best results or will some just skate by doing the minimum ? Teachers in public schools are not payed by how well they teach or how well their students learn. In fact it's against almost all of their contracts and any calls to change that have been met with strikes. It's almost impossible to fire a bad teacher as long as they show up and don't mention God.

 

[thaiturkey]

It's not just about the quality of teachers, is it? Student achievement depends also on the curriculum, the standards set by external examinations, teacher training and the quality of the facilities provided to teacher and students. However good those are, if you pay teachers peanuts you will get monkeys.

 

[kevs-chickadees]

Wow! I think this thread is dead and don't check into it for a while and look what happens..... All this good stuff I'm missing.

 

[theuglyduckling]

I live in Puerto Rico and my fiance is going to college to be a English professor. Right now one of his assignments is to go observe a class at any school of his choice and he was given the assignment the week before Thanksgiving. Well he has tried to go almost everyday since and hasn't been able to because they have "activities" basically every time he has gone. He told his professor about it and she herself went through the same problem when she was going to college. I find it sad that they seem to put so much effort into activities rather than teaching their students. Yesterday he was helping a classmate and she had transferred a file onto his computer and it was an essay about her observing a tenth grade class. The essay pretty much stated that the students were given an essay assignment about what makes a good friend and out of about 20 plus students and three did the assignment. They were given two weeks to accomplish this. They were supposed to write and present it in English and three students that were presenting wouldn't even present it in English the teacher tried to encourage them to present the assignment it in English in Spanish. Out of the students that presented the assignment only had around three sentences. The students who didn't do the essay had to write an essay as to why they didn't write the previous one. She (the teacher) then proceeded to lecture the students about why they should organized an responsible and then proceeded to compare herself to other teachers and nag about why she is more responsible than the others.

My fiance in the past has had to teach at schools twice just as a practice. In one school he had to teach at it was a elementary school. The kids didn't want to listen to him or the other teachers (which is probably typical in an elementary school), but their way of trying to get the kids attentions were by singing a song and getting the kids to sing along. I understand the teachers might not want to come along as being strict, but its school you are going to where you supposed to be learning. The teachers should be a little more strict rather than trying to be a friend.

The second school he had taught at was a high school where he had enjoyed it very much. The students listened, but even then they also didn't want to even participate in any activities that had to do with what he was teaching. The only way he could get them to do work was by offering them points and even then some still wouldn't want to participate. One student had told him that she liked his class better than the teachers. I find that crazy considering that he isn't even a teacher yet.

Another thing that is bad here in the school system is security and safety. In the second school that my fiance taught at they were always having lock downs due to shooting threats. He had gone one day when they had a lock down. The real teacher for that class was not only a teacher, but a security guy for the school so my fiance had to watch the class until the lock down was done with. If my fiance wasn't there the students would have been left alone in a class with no supervision.

I personally believe that Puerto Rico is behind most schools in the states and needs A LOT of work.

 

[theuglyduckling]

Capvin
Quote:
"I guess the concept that says if you raise teacher's pay you will attract better teachers is too difficult for some to grasp. As for studies regarding putting out smater kids all you need to do is compare our system to other country's who are far ahead of us in all scholastic respects. For me, all I need to do is look to my own backyard. I chose to spend the money and sent my kids to well regarded private schools. It resulted in Air Force Academy, Stanford, and Columbia where each one graduated and each is very successful. To be really honest I am thrilled to see people with your short sided opinions regarding education because it assured me that my grandchildren will be way ahead of the pack."

The prison has started a new program here in Puerto Rico where they are trying to get college students to teach prisoners. Last semester no one would do it. So my fiance who is studying to be an English professor decided he wants to do it and wont be getting paid until next August when he gets his degree to teach. Next semester he can teach, but wont be getting paid for it because it'll be another practice for him, but the semester after that if he likes teaching the prisoners he hopes to get a job as teaching them. He rather work at the federal prison teaching prisoners rather than working at a school until he can teach as a professor because he'll get paid the same amount that a professor gets paid for and of course because he will be helping prisoners get an education.

 

[rufus]

All kids deserved a good basic education. But money doesn't over come some problems. If a kid doesn't have the support at home he will probably fail. Parents have to do their part. Kids shouldn't show up to school not knowing their colors or numbers. If their parents are so zonked out that they can't feed the kid breakfast and make sure it is reasonable clean before they go to school, the kid is probably lost. Schools and society just can't do everything; that is what parents are for.

 

[nova022]

I guess the concept that says if you raise teacher's pay you will attract better teachers is too difficult for some to grasp. As for studies regarding putting out smater kids all you need to do is compare our system to other country's who are far ahead of us in all scholastic respects. For me, all I need to do is look to my own backyard. I chose to spend the money and sent my kids to well regarded private schools. It resulted in Air Force Academy, Stanford, and Columbia where each one graduated and each is very successful. To be really honest I am thrilled to see people with your short sided opinions regarding education because it assured me that my grandchildren will be way ahead of the pack.

It is fortunate that you had the money to send you kids to private schools. My short sighted opinion is that if you simply pay the teachers you already have more you will simply have higher paid people who aren't getting the job done. If my tax dollars are paying to educate children I would rather it not be poured into a bottomless pit. Maybe public education is not the answer. Maybe the voucher system is a better idea. Let everyone have the opprtunity to send their children to well regarded private schools.

 

[mom'sfolly]

The problem with voucher systems is that private schools don't have the same requirements as public schools. They don't have to follow the same curriculum, they are exempt from much of the state testing requirements (the lucky dogs), they don't have to provide special education for gifted and for handicapped students, they don't have to provide classes for children who's first language isn't English, they don't have to take students with discipline problems, they don't have to deal with kids who's parents aren't in the picture or kids who are homeless.

Comparing charter and private schools to regular public schools is seldom an apples to apples comparison. It is frequently an apples to unicorns comparison.