"Quaviary" Build

[Nabiki]

It sounds like liver disease, but not sure on the cause. It's a lot to unpack. I don't know if a vet friend of mine has time to look at it, but I'll ask.

 

[eddie_van_quailen]

It sounds like liver disease, but not sure on the cause. It's a lot to unpack. I don't know if a vet friend of mine has time to look at it, but I'll ask.

Thanks for your input I have a vet friend looking at it too, so no worries at all. You're right that it's a lot to unpack, there's so much going on in this report

After some more reading (perhaps too much) I'm thinking that, due to age/breed/bad luck/or another impossible-to-know reason, her immune system couldn't fight off an opportunistic infection. If that's the case, there's nothing else I really could have done, and there is little/no risk to the other animals on the farm. I'm not super worried about the E. coli because I know it's part of the common gut flora for many animals and most strains generally pose no threat unless the host's immune system is otherwise compromised. I'm only worried now about the MG/MS test results... but all I can do there is wait.

 

[Nabiki]

Here is the response from my vet friend.

Sounds like sepsis. The question is what the underlying cause was. E coli is everywhere, and is the third reason we wash our hands after touching raw chicken (Campy and Salmonella being tops) and also is in feces everywhere, so I'd doublecheck husbandry. However, the Mycoplasma test is still pending so it could be that. I assume she gets her quail from a reputable source and hasn't introduced anyone or anything recently?

Yeah, make sure there's good cross ventilation, that all waste is thoroughly cleaned, food and water systems, etc. It could also just be luck of the draw but I alwasy use cases of illness to have people stop and assess everything in their animals' environment. Doesn't matter if it's a farmer, a dog, or a lizard. Same way people take mental stock and make sure they aren't slacking in their human lives.

Also double check that there's no points of ingress and egress for wildlife, etc, rodents, because they can contaminate things too.

 

[eddie_van_quailen]

Here is the response from my vet friend.

Thank you for sharing this! My main priority with dissecting all of this is to see if any changes are necessary in my husbandry practices... The feedback from your friend confirms some of my suspicions and it's great to have that extra validation.

The air flow in the aviary is pretty good, I think. There is siding on the lower 18" of all 4 walls, but besides the vines on 2 of them, and the solid roof, the rest of the walls are just hardware cloth which allows for good airflow (and it's pretty windy where we are). The only animals I've ever seen inside the aviary are lizards, which can fit through the 1/2" hardware cloth. We haven't had any rodent issues that I've noticed (knock on wood). However, wild birds (finches, towhees, and hummingbirds) are often seen in the grape & passionflower vines on the walls, which may be an argument to remove them. I'm considering it, though I do appreciate the shade & rain protection they provide.

I'm pretty good about turning the substrate every 2ish weeks (or whenever it looks dirty), which does kick up dust, and I usually add a fresh layer of wood chips over the top at that time as well. We did a full replacement of the substrate in... gosh I want to say it was right around the same time Pearl got sick, maybe just after. Definitely within the last 3-4 months, since I usually do it in fall & spring. Since Jenny got sick, I have switched to store-bought pine shavings, just in case there was any fungal/bacterial contaminant in the last batch of wood chips from Chipdrop. That last batch also sat out in our pasture for ~6-8 weeks while I was using them, as we switched the drop location, so I'm wondering if the sheep could have contaminated them somehow, though wild birds are probably the more likely culprit if the chips were contaminated.

Our water system (bucket connected to PVC pipe with nipple waterers) also has a closed L-shaped section that I rinse, but am unable to clean with soap & scrub brush because of the curve and the way we sealed it. I am replacing it this weekend with a bucket, so I can more easily wash all components thoroughly with soap, in case it's somehow incubating something.

The only additions to the aviary have been the quail we hatched a year ago from eggs bought from a reputable breeder (TOF). There have been no new quail introductions from off the property in over 2 years, when we got the original 3 from a neighbor (both still alive) and the 2 from SWGB (both now deceased).

But... we did get chickens in March. I have considered this as a possible catalyst, and if either the MG/MS tests come back positive it will all but confirm it. It's been low-ish on my list because I'm super conscious of washing hands between taking care of each flock, and I have boots that are worn specifically only in the aviary. Also, at the time Pearl got sick in April, the chicks were still in the brooder inside a building >50 feet away from the aviary. By the time Jenny started showing symptoms, the chickens had moved to their coop in the pasture, which is ~150-200 feet away from the aviary (with our house in between). They do free range, but tend to stay in the fenced pasture. Since their symptoms manifested ~2-3 months apart, it's also possible that Pearl's illness is completely unrelated to Jenny's, despite some overlap in symptoms. With that being said, the coincidence of this happening so close to the time we got the chicks indeed has me suspicious. Alas, all I can do now is wait for the final test results to come in.

So my current suspicions and their solutions are:

Wild birds/sheep in the wood chips & wild birds in the vines - Remove vines from the walls, and use store-bought pine shavings in lieu of wood chips in the future. I am also pricing out a switch to sand and considering doing away with the deep litter system altogether.

Contamination in the water system - Dismantle the PVC system and replace it with a bucket that is easier to clean.

Contamination in the feed - The feeders were changed in March when I discovered the mold after Pearl got sick, and it's no longer a problem. It is possible Jenny was infected with something before I changed them and it only just manifested months later, but this is unlikely. Regardless, I am keeping the new feeders as they are.

The chickens - I honestly am not sure what I will do if either/both of the MG/MS tests come back positive. If this turns out to be the case, it could mean that, despite my best efforts, the chickens must have brought something to the property and I transferred it to the aviary by forgetting to change my boots or wash my hands one of the times I was in there. This truly would be the worst case scenario, and I am holding out hope that the tests both come back negative, because I will be completely devastated and unsure of how to proceed if this is the case.

Anyway... thanks to anyone who is still reading my exhaustive (and exhausting) analysis... I will post another update when all of the test results are available

 

[Nabiki]

It sounds like you're doing everything you can, and I certainly applaud all of the effort you're putting in. It may not have been anything in particular, just age and an opportunistic infection, but it never hurts to look deeper.

 

[eddie_van_quailen]

Well, I am here with some great news today. Mycoplasma tests (MG and MS) were both negative. I think I took my first deep breath in weeks after I read that news

So, that's it I suppose. We will proceed with the planned change to the watering system anyway (just in case) and will continue being meticulous about hygiene and separation between the flocks. I’m really glad I went ahead with the necropsy, if it had been something infectious things could have gone very differently!

I’ve attached the final report here (with personal information redacted) in case anyone is interested in reading the final version.

Thanks for letting me vent my anxieties here!

 

[Nabiki]

Well, I am here with some great news today. Mycoplasma tests (MG and MS) were both negative. I think I took my first deep breath in weeks after I read that news

So, that's it I suppose. We will proceed with the planned change to the watering system anyway (just in case) and will continue being meticulous about hygiene and separation between the flocks. I’m really glad I went ahead with the necropsy, if it had been something infectious things could have gone very differently!

I’ve attached the final report here (with personal information redacted) in case anyone is interested in reading the final version.

Thanks for letting me vent my anxieties here!

The document is completely blank for me.

 

[eddie_van_quailen]

The document is completely blank for me.

Oh, weird! Here are screenshots instead:

 

[Nabiki]

Thanks!