Questions from a first-timer (Freedom Ranger/Kosher King)

[MidMountainFarm]

Hi everyone,

I'm new here, and we're preparing to start our chicken journey this summer. We're going with meat chickens - likely Freedom Rangers and Kosher Kings - and will have them on pasture as much as possible. A few questions in planning out our adventure:

- Timing: Part of our objective in getting chickens is to help prepare ground for planting (barley, as well as meadow seed mix). We realize they won't fully till the land, but hope they can help remove the grass and vegetation to minimize mechanical means to prepare the ground. That being said, the barley and meadow seed need to be planted around October 1. Tracking back roughly 14 weeks (we're thinking of letting them get slightly bigger - to about 12 weeks - to be able to scratch and forage more aggressively, and allowing a week or two from when the chickens are off to planting), that puts us in late June/early July. We are in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Maryland, where mid-summer temperatures can range from lows in the 60s at night to mid-90s high during the day. Will the birds be able to handle these temperatures at a relatively young age?

- Brooding: Most of the brooding guidance I've read suggests keeping the brooder in a garage, barn, or other enclosed space. Our challenge is that our barn is not very well secured, and we have quite a proliferation of nimble predators (foxes, raccoons, snakes, possums, coyotes, etc, etc.) We are planning to use the Chickshaw model from Justin at Abundant Permaculture, with some modifications (e.g. no layer boxes). I've read that some people have used the Chickshaw as a brooder outdoors, with a heating plate and some additional insulation, particularly on the floor. We are considering using the Chickshaw as a brooder, protected by electric fencing outdoors in a sheltered area near the house. Is this a terrible idea?

I'm certain more questions will arise as we embark on this journey, but at the planning phase - and constructing our set up - these seemed the most pressing. I'm already exceptionally grateful for all the knowledge here, and am infinitely more informed and confident (though still retain a healthy dose of humility going into this)!

Best,

Ben

 

[Ridgerunner]

Hi, welcome to the forum from Louisiana, glad you joined.

I've read that some people have used the Chickshaw as a brooder outdoors, with a heating plate

How many chicks? A heat plate will have limitations on how many chicks it handles and Rangers grow pretty quickly. I like the idea but will you have enough heated area for your chicks.

and some additional insulation, particularly on the floor.

Not sure what you mean by insulation. I put a piece of plywood on the floor in my brooder I built in the coop in colder weather to hold in the heat. I used 1/2" hardware cloth on the floor. It stays dry as the poop drops straight through. I do not use any bedding. I'd stay with the 1" wire he recommends as the chick poop stops passing through at some point with the 1/2" and you want this for older birds too, not just as a brooder. With my dual purpose chicks the poop starts getting stuck at about 12 weeks. Not sure what age it would be with Rangers. To clean the plywood off I just tilt it and scrape it.

I use a heat lamp to provide heat. I have breeze protection so a wind doesn't hit them. I think you'd need wind protection no matter your heat source, whether that is a heat plate, a heating pad cave, or a heat lamp. The Chicksaw should work well as a brooder but you need to keep rain out and wind from hitting the chicks. Maintain good ventilation too.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I can't speak to the chicksaw - no experience, but I've had birds out in those temps at 8-10 days w/o issues. Prior to that, I raise them in 27 qt totes w/ a heat plat in the back of my RV. I never have more than 12 at a time - its a limitation of tote size, but I could easily fit two or three totes on the back couch if I needed to brood more birds at once before turning them out. The current batch will be moved out next weekend, age 2 weeks, tems expected to be lows in the mid 40s.

I'm in N FL btw, I share your temps, and often exceed your humidity. Beautiful country you live in.

 

[MidMountainFarm]

Hi, welcome to the forum from Louisiana, glad you joined.


How many chicks? A heat plate will have limitations on how many chicks it handles and Rangers grow pretty quickly. I like the idea but will you have enough heated area for your chicks.


Not sure what you mean by insulation. I put a piece of plywood on the floor in my brooder I built in the coop in colder weather to hold in the heat. I used 1/2" hardware cloth on the floor. It stays dry as the poop drops straight through. I do not use any bedding. I'd stay with the 1" wire he recommends as the chick poop stops passing through at some point with the 1/2" and you want this for older birds too, not just as a brooder. With my dual purpose chicks the poop starts getting stuck at about 12 weeks. Not sure what age it would be with Rangers. To clean the plywood off I just tilt it and scrape it.

I use a heat lamp to provide heat. I have breeze protection so a wind doesn't hit them. I think you'd need wind protection no matter your heat source, whether that is a heat plate, a heating pad cave, or a heat lamp. The Chicksaw should work well as a brooder but you need to keep rain out and wind from hitting the chicks. Maintain good ventilation too.

Thank you!

We're thinking 25 chicks. For the heat plates, Premier One sizes them based on number of chicks, and we thought the medium size (for up to 30 chicks) would be best. I wanted to try to avoid a heat lamp, but could be convinced otherwise.

For the insulation, I thought of using rigid foam insulation on top of the wire mesh while they're young. We have some leftover from other projects. Would they be liable to peck and eat it? We could put cardboard overtop of the insulation as well.

When you mention needing breeze protection, how significant a barrier do you think would be necessary? We hoped the chickshaw placed in a sheltered area would be sufficient; do you think more would be needed?

Thanks, again!

Ben

 

[MidMountainFarm]

I can't speak to the chicksaw - no experience, but I've had birds out in those temps at 8-10 days w/o issues. Prior to that, I raise them in 27 qt totes w/ a heat plat in the back of my RV. I never have more than 12 at a time - its a limitation of tote size, but I could easily fit two or three totes on the back couch if I needed to brood more birds at once before turning them out. The current batch will be moved out next weekend, age 2 weeks, tems expected to be lows in the mid 40s.

I'm in N FL btw, I share your temps, and often exceed your humidity. Beautiful country you live in.

Thank you!
That's a thought to do them for a shorter period in the garage. We were hoping to avoid having them in the garage due to the smell and dust, but could potentially swing it for a week or so.

Yes, we feel very fortunate to be looking after this patch of land for a while!

 

[Ridgerunner]

Thank you!

We're thinking 25 chicks. For the heat plates, Premier One sizes them based on number of chicks, and we thought the medium size (for up to 30 chicks) would be best.

I don't have the experience with heat plates or Rangers to know how well that would work. I'd feel fairy comfortable trying it.

I wanted to try to avoid a heat lamp, but could be convinced otherwise.

I use heat lamps and that is the way I'd go. The thing people are most concerned with heat lamps is fire. It is hard to get people to answer questions in this forum. The few that will that have had fires generally talk about the lamp falling. If you don't use that clamp that comes with it but hold it in place with wire or a chain so it can't fall I believed you eliminate the vast majority of fire risk. With your wire mesh floor you will not use any bedding. Your Chicksaw is made of wood but it is a lot harder to start a fire with wood than it is with bedding. I think you could make the fire risk very small.

Your Chicksaw is 6' x 6' if I read that right. Lots of ventilation around it. You could put one or two heat lamps up on the back wall spread out to keep that area plenty warm. It has good ventilation up front so the front could stay cool. One of the risks of a heat lamp in an enclosed space is that they can turn that space into an oven. I think your Chicksaw has enough ventilation to avoid that. One of the biggest problems I have with brooding outside is the temperature swings. You want an area warm enough in the coolest temperatures and cool enough in the hottest temperatures. The heat plate and heating pad cave work really well for that but I'd be OK with heat lamps in your set-up. Maybe turn them off when it gets warm enough during the day and only use them at night. I think you are only going to need heat for a couple of weeks anyway.

I have nothing against the heating pad cave or heat plate. Both are very effective if set up right. My only hesitation with either is number of chicks and how fast Rangers grow.

For the insulation, I thought of using rigid foam insulation on top of the wire mesh while they're young. We have some leftover from other projects. Would they be liable to peck and eat it? We could put cardboard overtop of the insulation as well.

I see no need for insulation under them. They could and are likely to eat insulation. Just put cardboard or plywood on the floor to stop breezes from coming at them for underneath. I'd use plywood for a reduced fire hazard if you use a heat lamp.

When you mention needing breeze protection, how significant a barrier do you think would be necessary? We hoped the chickshaw placed in a sheltered area would be sufficient; do you think more would be needed?

The only place I see wire on the sides that goes all the way down is the front. If you place about a foot of cardboard vertical at the bottom of that wire mesh and set the heat plate on cardboard or plywood the wind will be blocked from below and the sides.

 

[MalSabreur]

Hi everyone,

I'm new here, and we're preparing to start our chicken journey this summer. We're going with meat chickens - likely Freedom Rangers and Kosher Kings - and will have them on pasture as much as possible. A few questions in planning out our adventure:

- Timing: Part of our objective in getting chickens is to help prepare ground for planting (barley, as well as meadow seed mix). We realize they won't fully till the land, but hope they can help remove the grass and vegetation to minimize mechanical means to prepare the ground. That being said, the barley and meadow seed need to be planted around October 1. Tracking back roughly 14 weeks (we're thinking of letting them get slightly bigger - to about 12 weeks - to be able to scratch and forage more aggressively, and allowing a week or two from when the chickens are off to planting), that puts us in late June/early July. We are in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Maryland, where mid-summer temperatures can range from lows in the 60s at night to mid-90s high during the day. Will the birds be able to handle these temperatures at a relatively young age?

- Brooding: Most of the brooding guidance I've read suggests keeping the brooder in a garage, barn, or other enclosed space. Our challenge is that our barn is not very well secured, and we have quite a proliferation of nimble predators (foxes, raccoons, snakes, possums, coyotes, etc, etc.) We are planning to use the Chickshaw model from Justin at Abundant Permaculture, with some modifications (e.g. no layer boxes). I've read that some people have used the Chickshaw as a brooder outdoors, with a heating plate and some additional insulation, particularly on the floor. We are considering using the Chickshaw as a brooder, protected by electric fencing outdoors in a sheltered area near the house. Is this a terrible idea?

I'm certain more questions will arise as we embark on this journey, but at the planning phase - and constructing our set up - these seemed the most pressing. I'm already exceptionally grateful for all the knowledge here, and am infinitely more informed and confident (though still retain a healthy dose of humility going into this)!

Best,

Ben

May I suggest that if you want to clear ground you try a couple of un- ringed pigs? They will do the job a lot quicker than chickens will. They are cheaper to run than a tractor and you can eat them afterwards. Durocs would do, or one of the heritage breeds like Tamworths. Move them frequently though before they go down too deep. We had a friend who had a rare breeds farm and some of the pigs, .like Mangalitzas cleared the soil to a depth of 2.5 feet and it had to be harrowed afterwards o level it out. They cleared everything though, nettles, brambles, dock, the lot, leaving the ground well cleared and fertilized for the vegetable plot they turned the area into.