Quick genetics question!

[sylviethecochin]

Curious; no idea where that could have come from as neither parent ought to possess it. With that in mind, if it is true lacing, you could see some laced offspring from him, though remember that as he only has a single copy of any of the genes listed above, you will get a wide variety of offspring. Try plugging him into the chicken calculator

I did have a Production red rooster (Chester) with some pretty nice (black) lacing in his breast feathers. I think it may just pop up from time to time, because he came from TSC, and none of the other ones in his straight-run batch ever had it.

EDT: None of his three or four offspring that had color patterns that might show lacing showed lacing either.

 

[Sneebsey]

It can't just pop up, but as lacing requires several genes in order to express correctly, it could be a chance pairing has resulted in those boys; say, a cockerel with colombian and melanotic mates a hen with pattern gene and boom, lacing.

ETA: Thinking about it, that's probably where the lacing came from, as the RIR would have Colombian, and the Orp would have Melanotic and Pattern Gene to bring in the nice dark lacing on blue.

 

[HuffleClaw]

I did have a Production red rooster (Chester) with some pretty nice (black) lacing in his breast feathers. I think it may just pop up from time to time, because he came from TSC, and none of the other ones in his straight-run batch ever had it.

EDT: None of his three or four offspring that had color patterns that might show lacing showed lacing either.

That makes sense! He was pure mohagany when he hatched but that changed!

 

[nicalandia]

I don't think that rooster is a cross between a Blue Orp and a RIR. That cross should give you a solid black or solid blue chicken. There will likely be some leakage but nothing like that red. Are you sure it wasn't a Lavender Orp?

I agree with this, I suspect the "Blue Orp" mother is hiding eWheaten perhaps the result of a Blue Orp x Buff Orp cross, the hen is hiding wheaten so she is E/eWh Ml/ml+, Pg/pg+, Co/co+, when crossed to the RIR this yielded eWh/eWh Ml/ml+, Pg/pg+ Co/co? resulting in an incomplete lacing pattern, I have done several back cross to buff orp and every time E/eWh birds were never this restricted.

The chicks he sired are E/ewh therefor looking like pure Extended black chicks at hatch

 

[HuffleClaw]

I agree with this, I suspect the "Blue Orp" mother is hiding eWheaten perhaps the result of a Blue Orp x Buff Orp cross, the hen is hiding wheaten so she is E/eWh Ml/ml+, Pg/pg+, Co/co+, when crossed to the RIR this yielded eWh/eWh Ml/ml+, Pg/pg+ Co/co? resulting in an incomplete lacing pattern, I have done several back cross to buff orp and every time E/eWh birds were never this restricted.

The chicks he sired are E/ewh therefor looking like pure Extended black chicks at hatch

The father was the blue orp not the mom, thank you for the wonderful information though! I really appreciate it

 

[HuffleClaw]

A few more pictures

 

[Sneebsey]

I agree with this, I suspect the "Blue Orp" mother is hiding eWheaten perhaps the result of a Blue Orp x Buff Orp cross, the hen is hiding wheaten so she is E/eWh Ml/ml+, Pg/pg+, Co/co+, when crossed to the RIR this yielded eWh/eWh Ml/ml+, Pg/pg+ Co/co? resulting in an incomplete lacing pattern, I have done several back cross to buff orp and every time E/eWh birds were never this restricted.

The chicks he sired are E/ewh therefor looking like pure Extended black chicks at hatch

I would expect an E/eWh cross to show red, hence my position that the Orp father was likely ER/E; with the additional melanisers present in blue birds, he could pass as E/E and be used for breeding. With this in mind, my position is that @Kayla’s Chickens cockerel is ER/eWh; we see a lot of colour in ER cockerels, and with both eWh and the pattern genes working to push out the blue pigment, that is why we see the large amount of red.

In my fattening pen I have E/eWh cockerels showing some red, ER/eWh cockerels showing a lot of red, and E/ER cockerels showing barely any red at all, hence my thoughts.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I would expect an E/eWh cross to show red, hence my position that the Orp father was likely ER/E; with the additional melanisers present in blue birds, he could pass as E/E and be used for breeding. With this in mind, my position is that @Kayla’s Chickens cockerel is ER/eWh; we see a lot of colour in ER cockerels, and with both eWh and the pattern genes working to push out the blue pigment, that is why we see the large amount of red.

In my fattening pen I have E/eWh cockerels showing some red, ER/eWh cockerels showing a lot of red, and E/ER cockerels showing barely any red at all, hence my thoughts.

Could you please post some photos of your ER/eWH cockerels? Thanks.

 

[Sneebsey]

This boy shows the most red out of all of them. RSL (eWh/eWh?) over BlCM (ER/ER). We still see the darker tones in the undercarriage, but the Wheaten with Colombian is really bringing out that red pigment through the chest.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Thanks. Look at those black legs.

That leads to all kinds of speculation. I picked up melanizers from a breeder that had Black Ameraucana, it was pretty strong in turning red chickens black. I was hoping to get Extended black but she warned me there could be some Birchen in the mix. I thought the Birchen would be easy to deal with but did not appreciate the power of melanizers.

My guess is that the Blue Orp to start with had recessive melanizers that had no effect on the red feathers of the OP's rooster. I'm not sure how many different melanizers there might be or whether they are dominant or recessive. But what ever was turning that original blue orp solid black was not extended black. With the color of the OP's rooster's legs I'm not even sure it was Birchen.