Rooster and a Guard Dog?

[Folly's place]

Puppies and shock collars are a bad mix! It's about fencing, good fencing, and/ or electric fencing of some sort. How much land do you have? A LGD is wasted on a small property!
A good 'Invisible Fence' type system works for many dogs, but again, not until they are at least a few months old, and house trained.
Expect maybe two years of training and supervision before you have that perfect dog...
Mary

 

[KathieMc]

Using a shock collar on a Great Pyrenees is going to be pretty hard...they'll grow a thick mane around their neck which would make it hard to place an electric collar on them correctly. Not to mention, if you don't know how to use the collar properly, you can do some harm to the dog. You may even cause the pup/dog to mistrust you.
Does you family have their heart set on this breed or could you all sit down and figure out another breed that would work best in your situation?

 

[KathieMc]

OP, I'm not sure the person that suggested the "shock" collar used it properly.
Usually the collar will have three settings...beep, vibrate and shock. You would never go straight to shock while using it to train a dog. If you ever get a chance to get your hands on one of these collars, put the setting on shock, at one of the lower settings...it's not pleasant. Like I mentioned before, the person using the collar needs to know the correct way to use it as not to cause harm or distrust to the pup/dog.

 

[Phantom_k9]

Puppies and shock collars are a bad mix! It's about fencing, good fencing, and/ or electric fencing of some sort. How much land do you have? A LGD is wasted on a small property!
A good 'Invisible Fence' type system works for many dogs, but again, not until they are at least a few months old, and house trained.
Expect maybe two years of training and supervision before you have that perfect dog...
Mary

Using a shock collar on a Great Pyrenees is going to be pretty hard...they'll grow a thick mane around their neck which would make it hard to place an electric collar on them correctly. Not to mention, if you don't know how to use the collar properly, you can do some harm to the dog. You may even cause the pup/dog to mistrust you.
Does you family have their heart set on this breed or could you all sit down and figure out another breed that would work best in your situation?

Ok, so we may need to re approach keeping the pup on the property...
We have roughly 2 acers of land, with only half fenced in. I'll make a diagram to explain as its easier than trying to type it out. (I tried my best)

But TLR, a really deal, big fence is out of the question for us financially. It just isn't a possibility right now.
Perhaps there are different means to teach a dog not to leave the yard?

 

[Phantom_k9]

OP, I'm not sure the person that suggested the "shock" collar used it properly.
Usually the collar will have three settings...beep, vibrate and shock. You would never go straight to shock while using it to train a dog. If you ever get a chance to get your hands on one of these collars, put the setting on shock, at one of the lower settings...it's not pleasant. Like I mentioned before, the person using the collar needs to know the correct way to use it as not to cause harm or distrust to the pup/dog.

I have no idea how exactly they did use it, but believe me it is not my intension to harm the dog / make him distrust us. As a general rule of thumb, I wouldn't do to the dog what I would be to scared to do to myself. I haven't had a lot of time to research recently, but believe me I am the type to research things like this until google can't give me any new results.

 

[Folly's place]

Any dog will be your most expensive flock protection method! And without some sort of fencing, that dog will be in trouble at the neighbor's, or dead in the road. This is truth.
If it's legal where you live, electric poultry fencing, or electric fencing, is the least expensive type of fencing.
Big dogs take a five or six foot tall fence, not a puny four foot thing, and dig protection.
Get a dog because you want to have one, train it, and have the funds for it's care, veterinary care, feeding, and training. It won't be an automatic flock protection device!
Mary

 

[Phantom_k9]

Any dog will be your most expensive flock protection method! And without some sort of fencing, that dog will be in trouble at the neighbor's, or dead in the road. This is truth.
If it's legal where you live, electric poultry fencing, or electric fencing, is the least expensive type of fencing.
Big dogs take a five or six foot tall fence, not a puny four foot thing, and dig protection.
Get a dog because you want to have one, train it, and have the funds for it's care, veterinary care, feeding, and training. It won't be an automatic flock protection device!
Mary

I agree with you 1000%. Up until now the only thing stopping us from getting a dog was not having a proper fence. We DO want a dog, we DO want to train it, we can provide it with what it needs, and I'm sure we could figure out how to cover vet visits when necessary. But you have to understand my desperation here!
I'm about to leave for college, and currently I have been the main protector of the flock. I have lost count at how many potential hawk attacks I have intervened in, along with my judgment when it comes to when we should or should not put up our birds. As far as I can tell, a guard dog is the solution for when I'm gone. Myself and my sister have been wanting a dog for years now, and now we have a need for a proper guard dog for our birds. We can't go to a breeder and throw money at buying a dog let alone pay a spiked price to train him, so to hear a friend of ours is wiling to give us (what could be) the perfect dog almost seems like a gift from God. As for training, I believe we can do it ourselves. While I could be a fool for thinking this, its the best I can do ATM.
I understand your concerns, believe me I have had them as well. But this is one of those cases I feel we just need to take a risk and do what we can to address problems as they arise.
For all I know, we could be able to put in a fence by the time the pup needs it. However, my parents are dead set on either a good fence or none at all.

 

[Phoenixxx]

I have yet to see a physical fence that will contain an LGD. They are champion diggers and excellent climbers! We use the invisible fence for ours. Train the new puppy to it right away on the mild collar (which is the equivalent of shuffling your feet across carpet and touching a doorknob), then at about 5 or 6 months when the teenage wanderlust kicks in, switch to the stubborn dog collar set to max and set the correction zone at least 15' wide.

Aside from having a golden retriever for a family dog when I was a child, my first dog as an adult was a Kuvasz. LGDs are NOT like other dogs, so as long as you understand that, then you will be okay - and if you've never had a dog before, then you won't know the difference LGDs are independent thinkers, which means they won't always listen to you. This can lead to frustration, until you realize that the reason for the disobedience was because there really was something more important going on! They are very sensitive to punishment and harsh corrections, so training with a shock collar is not advisable. (The fence is different - it's an invisible boundary that is fixed and gives a warning tone first, not a random "zap" that they can't understand.) They also cannot be tethered on a line, except for short periods with supervision, as this can create an aggressive dog.

As for the rooster, if there's any chance at all that he might attack your new puppy, do your chicken chores and regular flock tours carrying him at first. You don't want the puppy to be afraid of - or worse, defensive/aggressive towards - your chickens.

The playful stage is the most challenging, and it can last a looooong time! Try to stop chasing before it starts (this is tricky with a first dog, since you will be learning to read his body language) by redirecting the puppy's focus. If chasing does happen, stop it immediately and say a deep and firm "NO" at the same time, then remove the puppy and try again another time. Reward calm behaviour with treats and/or praise, and these rewards can be at anytime... Dog laying in the yard just relaxing, toss a treat without saying a word.

Raising any dog to be good with chickens is a challenge, but with the GP you will get a dog that is also protective and nurturing. If you're up for the challenge, I say go for it, and your efforts will be well rewarded I loved my first Kuvasz so much that we now have three of them! Oh: if you lose a bird or two, it's not the end of the world

 

[Phantom_k9]

I have yet to see a physical fence that will contain an LGD. They are champion diggers and excellent climbers! We use the invisible fence for ours. Train the new puppy to it right away on the mild collar (which is the equivalent of shuffling your feet across carpet and touching a doorknob), then at about 5 or 6 months when the teenage wanderlust kicks in, switch to the stubborn dog collar set to max and set the correction zone at least 15' wide.

Aside from having a golden retriever for a family dog when I was a child, my first dog as an adult was a Kuvasz. LGDs are NOT like other dogs, so as long as you understand that, then you will be okay - and if you've never had a dog before, then you won't know the difference LGDs are independent thinkers, which means they won't always listen to you. This can lead to frustration, until you realize that the reason for the disobedience was because there really was something more important going on! They are very sensitive to punishment and harsh corrections, so training with a shock collar is not advisable. (The fence is different - it's an invisible boundary that is fixed, not a random "zap" that they can't understand.) They also cannot be tethered on a line, except for short periods with supervision, as this can create an aggressive dog.

As for the rooster, if there's any chance at all that he might attack your new puppy, do your chicken chores and regular flock tours carrying him at first. You don't want the puppy to be afraid of - or worse, defensive/aggressive towards - your chickens.

The playful stage is the most challenging, and it can last a looooong time! Try to stop chasing before it starts (this is tricky with a first dog, since you will be learning to read his body language) by redirecting the puppy's focus. If chasing does happen, stop it immediately and say a deep and firm "NO" at the same time, then remove the puppy and try again another time. Reward calm behaviour with treats and/or praise, and these rewards can be at anytime... Dog laying in the yard just relaxing, toss a treat without saying a word.

Raising any dog to be good with chickens is a challenge, but with the GP you will get a dog that is also protective and nurturing. If you're up for the challenge, I say go for it, and your efforts will be well rewarded I loved my first Kuvasz so much that we now have three of them! Oh: if you lose a bird or two, it's not the end of the world

I think I have misspoke when I said "shock collar". What I meant was the invisible fence idea. That's my bad, I had no idea there was a difference! And thanks for the in depth advice!

 

[tribalacres]

Hello,

We have four LGD’s. We learned the good, bad, and deadly. You’ve received some incredible advice thus far but I truly believe most, including me, are sharing their own experiences and it could be different for you.
We have two that stay in our chicken and duck area. They have NEVER escaped the fence. Ever. We’ve had them for almost a year. We have two that roam our property, 50 acres. They’ve never left the property and they do not cross our electrical fences.
Rewind, they killed a couple of birds and that when I realized I didn’t do my homework. We listed the two on the market place and someone said why don’t you train them. We hired a trainer used to LGD’s - $60 bucks a session and in five weeks it was the best three hundred spent. We did use shock collars, for two weeks and it trained them. We slowly reintroduced them to the animals and practiced, “leave it!” and other life saving trainings. They’ve not killed an animal since, and like someone above mentioned they are the most expensive guard animal but I wouldnt Trade it for the anything! We lost several animals to predators, we’ve not lost one since. Hope my experience helps as well as the great advice above.