Rooster balance problems - how big is the chance of Marek's?

[Eggcessive]

That is a good point about the possibility of the new chickens bringing in something else. I do not ever add birds from other flocks into mine, due the possibility of bringing in a disease. Carriers may be perfectly fine and may have fought off a particular disease in their own flock, but they still are carriers.

 

[5GodsDown]

Consider carefully what issues these outside birds could bring to your flock, not only what your flock might give them.
It's safest to NEVER take birds from outside flocks, only day old chicks from known safe sources.
Mary

I understand, therefore they will be "quarantained" for 2 weeks at least. There is a lot of chicken "swapping" around here, probably because we have too many. I notice lots of people from the Netherlands keeping chickens in their tiny backyards, then they decide to get chicks and suddenly the neighbours are angry because of course at least one rooster comes out... We have a huge rooster problem around here. I see at least 5 messages everyday from people wanting to re-home their rooster and a local bird sanctuary reported not too long ago they had over 300... Initiatives around here tend to try to keep you from buying from hatcheries. I'm glad my starting chicks were from a decent hatchery, they were vaccinated against Mareks and NCD, but unfortunately we have too many chickens looking for new homes around here.

 

[Folly's place]

Everyone has extra roosters, as there are at least as many as hens in every hatch. The cockerels are meant to be dinner, and that's hard for newer flock owners, even though most of them eat chicken from the market...
It's not logical, but that's what seems to happen, here too.
Mary

 

[Folly's place]

An actual quarantine is impossible at home!
New birds need to be totally separated from any others, as in 300 ft. downwind, or another facility not near your flock. No contact, direct or indirect, so foot baths, separate clothing, no sharing of any objects, for more like 30 days. Then add one of your birds to the new ones, and see if anyone gets sick. Wait another few weeks. Then hope for the best, because this still isn't 100% sure.
It's not happening here...
Mary

 

[5GodsDown]

Hi everyone,

I know it's been a long time, but I've only just received the results from Ghent University. Unfortunately Phil was tested positive for visceral Marek's disease. I've made my peace with it and the vet's got my back for any future questions or doubts. As a last update I would like to make this sad discovery into something educational and give you as much info as I can about my case. I will add the original report and translate the necessary parts. You will notice English is not my mother tongue so if you have a remark about something that is generally said in another way, please let me know.


Around the beginning of November my 9-10 month old ayam cemani roo Black Philip started losing balance and looking overall depressed. A week later he stopped walking.
I suspected Marek's because: age, losing balance, doing split, bright green droppings
My normal vet and avian vet didn't suspect Marek's because Phil was still able to MOVE the legs AND he didn't deteriorate fast enough. He was also diagnosed with coccidiosis, which often goes hand in hand with Marek's. After coccidiosis treatment he was alert again, eating and drinking well.

After I had taken care of him for a few weeks he got up again. I can't describe how happy I was. After just a day of standing up again he was walking around. Unfortunately, after another week he passed unexpectedly. It was December 5th by then.

My sweet avian vet did the necropsy for free. Due to an enlarged liver, spleen and kidneys Marek's was back on the table. Parts of him were sent to the lab for testing. Now we get to the report.

(1) submitted material: kidney, liver, heart, Nervus ischiadicus (sciatic nerve)
(2) histological findings

Liver: architecture of liver is disrupted by a dense infiltration of T-cells(? probably), mainly in the (some part of the liver). They have a pyknotic (=dead) core and a limited amount of cytoplasm.

Kidney: the interstitium (=space between tissue) has expanded by a dense infiltration of T-cells.

Myocard (=muscle in the heart): normal

n. ischiadicus: not present (only small piece of tumoral kidney)

IHC: CD3: Positive --> This is Marek's, I will try to explain it in normal language:
ImmunoHistoChemistry: CD3. CD3 is a certain antigen connected to T-cells. T-cells are the guys that react to an infection, part of the immune response. During the test they use certain molecules that can connect to the CD3 and will turn a certain color if connected. If CD3 can be detected it means an infection was present. In the case of Marek's T-cells can become tumors as Marek's is, in fact, a cancer.

(3) morphological diagnosis
kidneys and liver: image of acute/visceral Marek's

There's just one thing I still don't understand... how did the vet mistake an ayam cemani for an australorp?

It's been quite the emotional journey, but I've learned a lot from it. Thank you all once more for the help and support, it's really reassuring knowing there are always people on this forum ready to help.

 

[Eggcessive]

Thank you so much for posting your testing results, and so sorry to hear that it was Mareks. I was not surprised, but hoping for your sake that it wasn’t. You have a very good attitude about going forward with this in your flock, and it is good that you have a good vet who can help you. Hopefully, you won’t see a lot of sickness or death, but at least you know what you might expect.

 

[5GodsDown]

Thank you so much for posting your testing results, and so sorry to hear that it was Mareks. I was not surprised, but hoping for your sake that it wasn’t. You have a very good attitude about going forward with this in your flock, and it is good that you have a good vet who can help you. Hopefully, you won’t see a lot of sickness or death, but at least you know what you might expect.

You're welcome. My original 3 home raised chickens are vaccinated, at least there is a very slim chance I will ever lose them to Marek's. As for the future, there are uncertainties yes, but nothing impossible. I am not a breeder and have no aspiration to be one in the near future, although I would want to hatch one batch of eggs once. When Phil died I was sad, but relieved it was over. The hardest part was not knowing what was going on and what was going to happen. Was it Marek's? Should I cull him? But what if it's something else and he can recover? At least now I know I could act quicker when the same symptoms occur.

 

[Folly's place]

I'm so sorry, but it's good to have answers, even if they aren't good ones. Now you can move forward with your flock, and make good management decisions.
You certainly did everything possible for Phil, and his necropsy will save birds in your flock in the future.
All the best,
Mary