Quote:
since he was a BB the protein was too high.. I've had them die from the same thing when the protein was too high for them.. But Heritage turkeys do better on the higher protein feed... just gotta watch those broad breasted guys.. they will start out limping then keel over on you very quickly
I have a BBW poult that had funky wings when she came from the hatchery & started limping almost right away. The wings have mostly straightened out but her 1 knee is really bad & her toe tucks under on that side. I feed a mix of 22% & 18% mixed with corn, oats, sweet mix & beef chop (over 3/4 is crumbles) & she is the only bird with a problem with her legs. Pretty sure her's was poor breeding to begin with since she arrived with issues. She gets around ok, but limps really bad.
sounds like her issue is genetic.. or a niacin deficiency
bad legs on a normal weight bird (for it's age) are usually caused by a lack of niacin, bad genes, or injury like a predator attack..
but if you have a "healthy" bird that is gaining weight rapidly (which is what the high protein feeds will do) their weight will cause leg issues since the bone isn't strong enough to support their weight.. in those birds a heart attack or flip usually comes soon after their legs start having issues... some will just up and die before that if too much bulk (fat usually) builds up around their hearts
the niacin issue can show up in both heritage and broad breasted birds (as well as other poultry like emu, ducks and geese)
but "flip" from too much protein is restricted to the fast growing birds like cornish cross, some strains of the 'freedom ranger" type birds and broad breasted turkeys
Not a high protien issue & she's almost exactly the same weight as the other poult from that hatch date so either they are both way too small or they are both girls. They are about the same weight as the red broilers who are a week older & the white broilers that are 3 weeks younger. To he that says 2 hens. I had another poult in that order that had wing issues & it only lasted about 2 days. I didn't think this 1 was going to make it either, but she's a fighter. She just has a bad leg & foot. Could be niacin I guess, but I would think that would affect the other poult & all of the ducks as well & they are all fine. I use an "all-flock" style feed so it should have plenty of niacin for ducklings & poults.
Nope..niacin deficiency is an individual thing
From Metzer Farms
"What if only a few of my birds have leg problems? Variability within a flock is normal. Each bird varies on how well it forms niacin from tryptophan, either due to genetics or the different microflora in their gut. It would not be unusual to have a single flock of birds, with some exhibiting a niacin deficiency and others walking perfectly normally - but all eating the same feed. "
Hmmmm...could be niacin then. She gets around ok for now but probably won't once she gets heavier. Kinda figured she would just end up getting processed early, or is this something that will kill her before she's big enough to process.
if she goes down on her legs she may very well end up dead .. if from nothing else than being able to move about and feed properly..
so long as she's still moving around ok you can try giving her extra niacin and see if you can catch it before it gets any worse... but if it's a genetic issue extra niacin won't help
I will have to separate her to make sure she gets the niacin. I have her in with 19 broilers & about 20 other chicks. Trying to remember what works best for niacin. Yeastor am I not remembering right.
How old is she?..
You can use regular niacin from the store (human vitamins)
if you use a 500 mg tablet you can just break it into quarters and add 1/4 of the tablet to the drinking water (one tablet is good for about 4 gallons of water.. so 1/4 tablet per gallon)
I usually just crush the tablets up and sprinkle it into everyone's feed since I don't separate them from their buddies.. But then again our chick starter is lacking in niacin for the ducks.. and I use gamebird starter for the turkey poults.. (our gamebird starter has enough niacin for the poults).. so i use it as a preventative.
if you're adding it to the feed keep in mind that one 500 mg niacin tablet has enough niacin for around 45 to 50 ducks.. so you would only need a pinch for the poult if he eats all his food.. otherwise some of the niacin will settle to the bottom of the dish.. so a bit more never hurts
I would have to check the dosage for Brewers yeast since I don't normally use it.
an alternative is liquid B vitamins.. if you use a brand that delivers 20 mg of niacin per dropper.. so a half dropper would work for a poult that's around 4 weeks of age if you're direct dosing
I use fermented feed, so adding the yeast to a small portion & feeding her separate would likely be the best way to go so I don't have to waste it on the other 50 birds in the pen who don't need it.
you should be good to go then.. I feed fermented too.. just have to swap the newest ducklings, goslings and chicks over to it this week as a matter of fact
yuppers
I start all my babies out on fermented. No transition needed. I just thicken it really well right before feeding to soak up excess water.
**~~>>Second Annual Cinco de Mayo Turkey Hatchathon<<~~**all poultry welcome!
- Thread starter ChooksChick
- Start date
- Mar 3, 2012
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- 411
Oh thank you I was nervous for their tiny duck legs. So just that feed alone and no added vitamins. That sounds easy peasy thanks!
Quote:
since he was a BB the protein was too high.. I've had them die from the same thing when the protein was too high for them.. But Heritage turkeys do better on the higher protein feed... just gotta watch those broad breasted guys.. they will start out limping then keel over on you very quickly
I have a BBW poult that had funky wings when she came from the hatchery & started limping almost right away. The wings have mostly straightened out but her 1 knee is really bad & her toe tucks under on that side. I feed a mix of 22% & 18% mixed with corn, oats, sweet mix & beef chop (over 3/4 is crumbles) & she is the only bird with a problem with her legs. Pretty sure her's was poor breeding to begin with since she arrived with issues. She gets around ok, but limps really bad.
sounds like her issue is genetic.. or a niacin deficiency
bad legs on a normal weight bird (for it's age) are usually caused by a lack of niacin, bad genes, or injury like a predator attack..
but if you have a "healthy" bird that is gaining weight rapidly (which is what the high protein feeds will do) their weight will cause leg issues since the bone isn't strong enough to support their weight.. in those birds a heart attack or flip usually comes soon after their legs start having issues... some will just up and die before that if too much bulk (fat usually) builds up around their hearts
the niacin issue can show up in both heritage and broad breasted birds (as well as other poultry like emu, ducks and geese)
but "flip" from too much protein is restricted to the fast growing birds like cornish cross, some strains of the 'freedom ranger" type birds and broad breasted turkeys
Not a high protien issue & she's almost exactly the same weight as the other poult from that hatch date so either they are both way too small or they are both girls. They are about the same weight as the red broilers who are a week older & the white broilers that are 3 weeks younger. To he that says 2 hens. I had another poult in that order that had wing issues & it only lasted about 2 days. I didn't think this 1 was going to make it either, but she's a fighter. She just has a bad leg & foot. Could be niacin I guess, but I would think that would affect the other poult & all of the ducks as well & they are all fine. I use an "all-flock" style feed so it should have plenty of niacin for ducklings & poults.
Nope..niacin deficiency is an individual thing
From Metzer Farms
"What if only a few of my birds have leg problems? Variability within a flock is normal. Each bird varies on how well it forms niacin from tryptophan, either due to genetics or the different microflora in their gut. It would not be unusual to have a single flock of birds, with some exhibiting a niacin deficiency and others walking perfectly normally - but all eating the same feed. "
Hmmmm...could be niacin then. She gets around ok for now but probably won't once she gets heavier. Kinda figured she would just end up getting processed early, or is this something that will kill her before she's big enough to process.
if she goes down on her legs she may very well end up dead .. if from nothing else than being able to move about and feed properly..
so long as she's still moving around ok you can try giving her extra niacin and see if you can catch it before it gets any worse... but if it's a genetic issue extra niacin won't help
I will have to separate her to make sure she gets the niacin. I have her in with 19 broilers & about 20 other chicks. Trying to remember what works best for niacin. Yeastor am I not remembering right.
How old is she?..
You can use regular niacin from the store (human vitamins)
if you use a 500 mg tablet you can just break it into quarters and add 1/4 of the tablet to the drinking water (one tablet is good for about 4 gallons of water.. so 1/4 tablet per gallon)
I usually just crush the tablets up and sprinkle it into everyone's feed since I don't separate them from their buddies.. But then again our chick starter is lacking in niacin for the ducks.. and I use gamebird starter for the turkey poults.. (our gamebird starter has enough niacin for the poults).. so i use it as a preventative.
if you're adding it to the feed keep in mind that one 500 mg niacin tablet has enough niacin for around 45 to 50 ducks.. so you would only need a pinch for the poult if he eats all his food.. otherwise some of the niacin will settle to the bottom of the dish.. so a bit more never hurts
I would have to check the dosage for Brewers yeast since I don't normally use it.
an alternative is liquid B vitamins.. if you use a brand that delivers 20 mg of niacin per dropper.. so a half dropper would work for a poult that's around 4 weeks of age if you're direct dosing
I use fermented feed, so adding the yeast to a small portion & feeding her separate would likely be the best way to go so I don't have to waste it on the other 50 birds in the pen who don't need it.
Quote: Ducks aren't supposed to get medicated feed. Not good for them. Use a gamebird or "all-flock" style feed if you can't find unmedicated starter/grower.
Quote: Awesome, we have a couple unopened bottles around here that were forgotten about until last night.
I'm so sorry things are going so bad! It sounds like you had a really rough day. I hope you feel better!
So sorry about all of this - I wouldn't have thought an incubator could get that high, since there is no earthly reason you would ever need the temperature that high. Something went really wrong. It sounds like the incubator is still fairly new, and therefore should be under warranty. I'd be contacting the company and seeking their advice re repair or replacement.
Ron, I think you meant to say "thermostat". The thermometer reads the temp - the thermostat controls it.
I don't want to be a kill joy but.....can we do a little less of the quoting within the quoting? For those of us on slower connections, it is time consuming to load the page only to have to scroll past all of those quotes that have now been quoted a zillion times....
My fourth poult hatched overnight (4 out of 4 - can't complain about that). It is very weak so it is resting in the incubator for today. Hopefully by tonight it will be strong enough to try slipping it under the Mama Hen. I slipped the third under around 10pm last night and it all seems to be going well. I've tried to check on things twice today but both times Mama was sitting with chicks and poults under her, letting them nap. I figured since all is quiet and no little bodies lying around, it must be going well and its probably better not to disturb her by lifting her to check on them.
Announcement is later today! Be patient! I have to do payroll first!
What is the correct kind? I must have missed it. I rescued 2 ducks on friday that were dumped overnight in front of a school in town. (well, maybe a goose and a duck. I am not sure) One most definately is niacin deficient. I am adding save-a-chick to the water and did do niacin in their tub, but maybe it is the wrong kind!!!!! Ack! will it hurt them? Here is my attempt to get a picture of her legs.
i am sorry to hear about the bad luck with the incubators. I am so nervous of that happening. I put mine in my closet in my basement office with no windows and no heat vents. The temps in there stay a steady 65 degrees, but I am still nervous.
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