Should I help this chick hatch or it is ok?

[yinepu]

they should be able to pip internally since you have had a couple hatch without any problems.. the main problem comes when they have pipped EXTERNALLY and the membrane dries out.. remember the inside of the egg is a lot higher in humidity than the incubator air (which is why your humidity spikes when a chick hatches).. it's when the chick pips and is too weak to continue that they have problems.. I have found that if a chick doesn't have the strength to make an INTERNAL pip that there is USUALLY something wrong with the chick.. like a defect of just a very weak embryo

I would do some exploration on the egg that is giving you the most worry.. just remember that if you do decide to go exploring on that one that you put a wet sponge or something in the incubator when you remove it to keep the humidity high for the ones that have pipped

As for seeing into the egg.. I read an article once where "windows" were installed in eggs before incubation (done in a sterile lab) so the students could view the growth of the embryos without ever touching the eggs and while keeping them safe inside an incubator.. I have no idea if the eggs made it to hatch.. but it would be so cool to be able to do that and watch a chick make it to hatch that way!

 

[evers310]

Yinepu, what are your thoughts on the few that have air sacs across the length of the egg? Does that sometimes happen?

And as far as pipping the shells ourselves should we go ahead and do that for the one thats ip but no activity for a while now... does the shell over the air sac also have blood vessels in the membrane there? Or does the membrane cut across the shell right there and separate the two?

And if we decide to pip the 2 that rocked two days ago but nothing since: say we get in there and it hasnt pipped do we just moisten the membrane up and wrap it in wet paper towels and put it back for a while, or do you attempt to break the membrane as it would have done if it did an ip? the second part of that doesnt really seem safe so probably not what you would do...

 

[yinepu]

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air cells along the side of the membrane (down the length of the shell) are usually due to detached air cells.. i got this in most of my shipped eggs.. had i laid them down on their sides the air cells may have reattached in the "wrong" place.. as it is I kept mine upright in egg cartons and also incubated them standing upright in hopes that the air cell would reattach in the proper place.. now like I said it's USUALLY a problem in eggs that have been shipped.. but I did get some eggs from a relative which had the same issues and they were not shipped.. in those cases I think it may have been either rough handling or improper nutrition for the hen resulting in a weakening of the air cell.. eggs like that can hatch.. but you will usually have a chick who tries to pip in the wrong area .. they can hatch.. but they can also bleed to death if they puncture too many veins while trying to hatch..

in the anatomy of an egg.. only the membrane that surrounds the chick will have veins.. if you noticed when you candled that the air cell itself does NOT have any veins.. so when i go exploring I always candle first to find the exact location of the air cell before puncturing the egg.. and i make sure I always puncture the shell at the air cell... the only time i wouldn't is if the chick has an external pip.. then i start working on the egg at the area of the pip since i know that's where the chick's beak is

for live chicks that have not pipped internally they are not ready to hatch yet.. so if i find a chick that hasn't pipped internally but is still alive.. I just keep a wet paper towel over the membrane to allow the chick to finish absorbing the yolk and cut off the blood flow to the veins.. if you try puncturing a membrane on a chick that is alive but not shrink wrapped and hasn't absorbed the yolk yet you can cause it to bleed to death.. chiocks like this will usually finish hatching on their own so long as the membrane stays moist

 

[evers310]

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that being said, i will not pip the ones showing no internal pip. If it doesnt internally pip then I will just have to let it be and help it if it needs me to once it does. No sense in opening them up and possibly doing more harm than good when they arent yet ready to hatch anyways. Plus with my humidity fiasco, I bet the now exposed membrane if i were to pip one would just keep drying up..

have you ever opened one that was shrink wrapped but never internally or externally pipped?

what have you discovered in pipping eggs for them? like, what were some of the situations you saw that had occurred in the egg?

Once we pip the 1 egg that has internally pipped, do i remove the extra shell and work with it like i did the others as far as keeping the membrane moist and working with it as the vessels dry up, or do i pip it in the air sac area, keep the membrane moist then leave it be?

And will pipping it with my husbands razor knife by chipping away at the shell be ok or is there a better method?

Should I candle daily from here on out to check for internal pips? When should I give up and assume i've gotten all that are going to hatch out?

 

[yinepu]

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do you know if all the eggs were set the same day? if they were.. then after all the ones you KNOW are alive have hatched.. THEN i would go back and do some exploration on the ones that are questionable.. you can candle them every say at this point since your hatch is as much as over

I have opened a few that were shrink wrapped that had never pipped.. a friend of mine called me and asked for help.. apparently their humidity was much too low throughout the entire process (or so they told me).. out of 6 eggs 4 were shrink wrapped in the shell with NO pips.. the other two were dead.. in all honesty the two dead ones almost looked like little mummies.. it was the strangest thing I had ever seen..and have never seen any like it again.. my first gut instinct was that they had some sort of humidity AND bacterial problem.. but we never sent the eggs out to be tested to find out exactly what happened.. it was one of those strange hatches that you never run into if you follow the general "rules".. the chicks that were alive were pretty deformed.. so we ended up culling the entire bunch.. to this day I have never heard of it happening to anyone else or figured out the cause

for my hatches, I have never had any shrink wrapped that hadn't pipped.. not saying that it can't happen.. just I have never run into it.. the only time i have had shrink wrapped chicks was with "new homemade incubators" that my brother had made that didn't have all the bugs worked out of them yet.. I still had good hatches.. just had to work out the specs for each individual incubator before I could trust them to give me a trouble free hatch

for the internal pipped eggs.. what I would do is remove any loose shell and then check the membrane.. if it's dry and there is no blood I would start working on the membrane.. if there is still blood flow to the membrane I would wrap with the paper towels and put it back into the incubator

for pipping I use an awl or an ice pick... I used to use those really heavy carpet needles.. but as I have gotten older I prefer the feel of a nice pointy awl or ice pick..i know some people like exacto knives or something similar.. but I am enough of a klutz that I know I would end up slicing my fingers open!

 

[evers310]

unfortunately no i do not. these were taken from the mother hen because she was accidentally stomping one egg a day and i'd find them dead. 3 or 4 days later after taking them and putting them in my incubator they started hatching, and thats what sparked this thread!

they are actually from 2 different nest boxes because 2 mamas were swapping out and setting on both sets of eggs. one of the hens was the one i just told you about. Because of that, i put a #2 on the ones I put in the incubator a day or 2 later because I suspected they may have different hatch dates. I am not sure which day sparked this thread but I believe the day before that was when the eggs from nest box #1 started pipping. whichever day it was that I said my last zipper hatched (yesterday or late the night before actually...) that egg was my 1st of batch #2 to pip. 3 of the 4 "good eggs" are #2 as well and 2 of those have pipped today. the 4th "possible good egg" (the one that appears internally pipped but no activity) was from the 1st bunch. As well as all of the others that have hatched. However, my 2 rockers from the eggs with no internal pips are from the 1st batch too so I believe these hatch dates are just all over the place!

 

[yinepu]

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lol.. well. that confuses things a whole lot more!

ok.. since you have eggs that have been set at different days.. and the silly hens never bothered to mark their calendars (I am STILL trying to figure out how to teach my girls to do this for me .. but they are still insisting that it's on a need to know basis and I don't NEED to know)!.. I would keep an eye on the eggs that haven't done anything.. candle them again once everyone else that you KNOW is good have hatched... and if they are still showing no signs of movement or life then either float test or go exploring.. or both

 

[djennings]

I had an egg yesterday morning pipped and it was driving my DH crazy

Every 5 minutes he was coming in looking at it thru the window, then come and get me cause it wasn't zipping yet

finally after about 12 hours of no zipping and looking at what little bit of membrane that was showing, it was very white, I decided to help the silkie. I took it out and wrapped it in a warm paper towel, took a pair of tweezers and took off only the half of side of shell that the pip was on. Membrane was solid white and tough. I noticed there was not any red veins attached to that so applied warm moisture to membrane with Q-tip and took tweezers started very gently from where beak was poked out to removed white membrane. I noticed another I will call very thin inner membrane veins were on. Left that one alone. wrapped moist paper towel around egg, put back in and told DH to leave it alone.

He got up around 2 this morning and it had hatched.

 

[yinepu]

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Congrats!

 

[evers310]

Alright these are not the eggs we've been talking about.. but the mother hen in the 3rd nest box has left her eggs (it seems) they stink to high heaven because either some of those got squished and the babies died in there or some rotton eggs got squished. Egg goo and shells are all over the rest and boy did i mention that they stink!!! I held my breath and candled them anyways.. (you know me!

) 3 or 4 dont look like they were viable eggs, several of them have air sacs but the dark area is sloshy (im guessing those arent good) and there ar like 3 or 4 that have air sacs and arent sloshy. none of them pipped internally. and in one of them i cant even see an air sac.

what to do what to do what to do..... is it ok to wash that crap off of any that might possibly still have a chance? theyre cold too so im going to be pleasantly surprised if any of them make it.

somebody pls get back to me asap about washing them or not.. i cant do anything with them if i cant clean them off. bleeeecchhh!!