Tums in the bath water or drinking water?
Sick chicken...Now She's not breathing well. UPDATE in ORGINAL POST
- Thread starter Carli
- Start date
sorry- in her drinking water
had to do this with my duccle banty, and the poor girl laid an egg nearly the size of a standard fowl!
had to do this with my duccle banty, and the poor girl laid an egg nearly the size of a standard fowl!
Ha! I thought that but as I started to post it I thought...I better make sure...
sharon
sharon
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- #14
- May 4, 2010
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I think it's mites. I gave her a bath (she's now resting quietly in a dog kennel in the indoor mud room) and while in there, she let me mess with her. I was moving her feathers around and noticed a couple of brown bugs, very small, crawling in there. I gave her some ACV in her water and food. Heading to the search function now......
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- #15
- May 4, 2010
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Okay, heading to the feed store tomorrow to buy permethrin spray. I *just* scooped out the coop litter three days ago and put down DE. I also mixed it with their litter (dry den). Do I need to completely get rid of it and wash down the coop or can I just spray the litter and all the wood/crevices inside the coop and nesting boxes? I won't be able to do the nesting boxes for a few days because I have a hen in their hatching out eggs hopefully, literally, any moment now. Once I move her, I can do the nest boxes.
So the bugs I saw on the hen were medium brown in color and moved quickly deep into the feathers. Is this mites or lice?
So the bugs I saw on the hen were medium brown in color and moved quickly deep into the feathers. Is this mites or lice?
- Thread starter
- #16
- May 4, 2010
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Anybody willing to answer the last questions here above?
I am not sure, but I thought you treated them the same anyway.
When do those dang mites die anyway? doesnt the cold kill them?
When do those dang mites die anyway? doesnt the cold kill them?
It does sound a lot like egg bound. I had a leghorn hen pass last year, on halloween, from being egg bound. She was lethargic, had labored breathing and was laying on the floor of the coop. That was before I knew what to look for. She passed quickly, too. Overnight, literally. That was a hard lesson to learn. I would take the teasing and soak her sooner, rather than later.
here is a thread that may help- it did end up being mites- you could treat her for both actually, but after looking at the article, i am thinking lice or mites.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum//viewtopic.php?id=219553&p=1
and a thread i started about one of my hens-
https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=359077
also, here are some articles, by a fellow BYC'r Threehorses- Ivomec and Eperinex will kill worms, but has the added advantage of killing external parasites- use it like frontline-
https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum//viewtopic.php?id=219553&p=1
and a thread i started about one of my hens-
https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=359077
also, here are some articles, by a fellow BYC'r Threehorses- Ivomec and Eperinex will kill worms, but has the added advantage of killing external parasites- use it like frontline-
IVOMECTIN, EPERINEX FOR WORMING
By Nathalie Ross [email protected]
Here is some information on the use of Ivomectin Products. I just wanted to help you out a little here. First, despite what people advise, any pour on Ivomectin product shouldn't be used in water. It's designed to be weatherproof for cattle and soak into external skin. It also needs to be given in a precise dosage so that you're getting what you pay for. Both Ivomectin pour on and Eprinex- Ivomectin pour on are used the same, though some people use Eprinex at a higher dosage with success. Eprinex of course is the 0 withdrawal product by Ivomectin. If you go with Ivomectin injectable, you'll also need to buy propylene glycol to use with the injectable. By the time you do this, you've spent the same amount of money as the pour on with what I feel isn't the same level of effectiveness honestly, but some people have access to injectable and not pour on so it's an option.
For the pour on Ivomectin (not Eprinex) the dosage I use is as follows: 1 drop - OEGB sized small bantam female 2 drops - OEGB sized small bantam male 3 drops - average bantams 4 drops - large bantams, small commercial fowl 5 drops - most commercial fowl, small giant hens 6 drops - giant breeds of chicken I always use a 3 cc syringe that I just fill to about 2 cc's with a 20 gauge needle. The needle WON'T be injected into the chicken, but does make it easier to dispense a controlled correct sized drop. It also is easier to get in there between the feathers. For location, you'll want to find an easy to reach spot with as little fluff as possible. I've had the best luck with the back of the neck when I am by myself. I just pick up the chicken in my left hand, ruffle around the feathers with my right hand until I find a nice clear spot, then rotate the syringe around to dispense the drops exactly on the skin. If you hit the fluff, it will soak in before you can do anything and will be wasted. That stuff soaks in like lightening (which I discovered to my horror when I accidentally got about 1 cc of it on me from the bottle - I'm worm free now!)
While you have the bird up, look them over. This is a great opportunity to nip things in the bud! Take advantage of it. Generally I like to recommend that first time wormers use Piperzine (Wazine being the most common brand) before using Ivomectin the first time. This is a common practice with most livestock men and women. You use a less effective, less broad spectrum wormer first just in case there's a high load of roundworms. If there is a high load of roundworms and they're all killed at once, you risk either impaction or the bird having a reaction to the foreign proteins that the dead/stunned worms become. The best way in my opinion of doing this is to worm with Piperzine in the water first - full strength 24 hours, then instead of following up in 10 days with Piperzine, use the Ivomectin Ivomectin or better yet Ivomectin eprinex (for 0 withdrawal time). Using this program, I worm once a year. Once I have wormed with Ivomectin, I don't use Piperzine again unless I do a second worming during the year or have reason to suspect they've encountered a heavy level of parasites. In fact, I worm once a year almost exclusively.
I use Tramisol as my second wormer if I have to (which is rare for me, even her in parasite ridden Texas). Some people like to use a daily preventative like DE between worming. Some confusion comes when people call DE (Diatomaceous Earth) a wormer; it's not. It's an aid to preventing small dosages of worms, the small batches that your birds will pick up daily. It's not good at killing larger batches of worms however. BUT it's natural and, if you use the codex food grade DE, it's quite effective and can even be spread in the bedding and on the birds to help ward off mites and feather lice. It won't hurt anything if the other animals pick it up, either. You just use it less than 2% in your feed, or in the free choice box for your usual oyster shell, etc.
I hope this has helped you to understand a little about Ivomectin and how to get the most out of it. It's a super wormer and will do right by you if you keep its proper use and design in mind! Good luck with your flocks! Nathalie Ross, Houston, TX http://threehorses.homestead.com/ Check out Nathalie's site she has good articles there. Also any more information needed you can email her at [email protected]
Thanks Nathalie for this very good information.
Glenda L Heywood
By Nathalie Ross [email protected]
Here is some information on the use of Ivomectin Products. I just wanted to help you out a little here. First, despite what people advise, any pour on Ivomectin product shouldn't be used in water. It's designed to be weatherproof for cattle and soak into external skin. It also needs to be given in a precise dosage so that you're getting what you pay for. Both Ivomectin pour on and Eprinex- Ivomectin pour on are used the same, though some people use Eprinex at a higher dosage with success. Eprinex of course is the 0 withdrawal product by Ivomectin. If you go with Ivomectin injectable, you'll also need to buy propylene glycol to use with the injectable. By the time you do this, you've spent the same amount of money as the pour on with what I feel isn't the same level of effectiveness honestly, but some people have access to injectable and not pour on so it's an option.
For the pour on Ivomectin (not Eprinex) the dosage I use is as follows: 1 drop - OEGB sized small bantam female 2 drops - OEGB sized small bantam male 3 drops - average bantams 4 drops - large bantams, small commercial fowl 5 drops - most commercial fowl, small giant hens 6 drops - giant breeds of chicken I always use a 3 cc syringe that I just fill to about 2 cc's with a 20 gauge needle. The needle WON'T be injected into the chicken, but does make it easier to dispense a controlled correct sized drop. It also is easier to get in there between the feathers. For location, you'll want to find an easy to reach spot with as little fluff as possible. I've had the best luck with the back of the neck when I am by myself. I just pick up the chicken in my left hand, ruffle around the feathers with my right hand until I find a nice clear spot, then rotate the syringe around to dispense the drops exactly on the skin. If you hit the fluff, it will soak in before you can do anything and will be wasted. That stuff soaks in like lightening (which I discovered to my horror when I accidentally got about 1 cc of it on me from the bottle - I'm worm free now!)
While you have the bird up, look them over. This is a great opportunity to nip things in the bud! Take advantage of it. Generally I like to recommend that first time wormers use Piperzine (Wazine being the most common brand) before using Ivomectin the first time. This is a common practice with most livestock men and women. You use a less effective, less broad spectrum wormer first just in case there's a high load of roundworms. If there is a high load of roundworms and they're all killed at once, you risk either impaction or the bird having a reaction to the foreign proteins that the dead/stunned worms become. The best way in my opinion of doing this is to worm with Piperzine in the water first - full strength 24 hours, then instead of following up in 10 days with Piperzine, use the Ivomectin Ivomectin or better yet Ivomectin eprinex (for 0 withdrawal time). Using this program, I worm once a year. Once I have wormed with Ivomectin, I don't use Piperzine again unless I do a second worming during the year or have reason to suspect they've encountered a heavy level of parasites. In fact, I worm once a year almost exclusively.
I use Tramisol as my second wormer if I have to (which is rare for me, even her in parasite ridden Texas). Some people like to use a daily preventative like DE between worming. Some confusion comes when people call DE (Diatomaceous Earth) a wormer; it's not. It's an aid to preventing small dosages of worms, the small batches that your birds will pick up daily. It's not good at killing larger batches of worms however. BUT it's natural and, if you use the codex food grade DE, it's quite effective and can even be spread in the bedding and on the birds to help ward off mites and feather lice. It won't hurt anything if the other animals pick it up, either. You just use it less than 2% in your feed, or in the free choice box for your usual oyster shell, etc.
I hope this has helped you to understand a little about Ivomectin and how to get the most out of it. It's a super wormer and will do right by you if you keep its proper use and design in mind! Good luck with your flocks! Nathalie Ross, Houston, TX http://threehorses.homestead.com/ Check out Nathalie's site she has good articles there. Also any more information needed you can email her at [email protected]
Thanks Nathalie for this very good information.
Glenda L Heywood
MITES
Despite what poultry protector claims to do, it does not treat mites. It's an enzyme. What it does is it cleans away (some) mite eggs and that in turns disallows mites from hatching out as much. But it doesn't kill mites.
Mites live in the wood cracks, in the joints, under roosts, in nestboxes, and off of birds most of the time. They just travel to the birds to eat and drain their blood really. So in order to get the mites, you're going to have to spray the coops unfortunately. The best product for this is a product that is 10% permethrin - usually marketed as livestock lice spray, or goat lice spray. Industrial poultry houses actually dilute it and spray it directly on the bird - it's safe enough for that. But you will use it on the wood 3' up from the ground, on eyes in the wood, in cracks, and on the nestbox wood. Then use the permethrin dust (always read the active ingredient and make sure both are only "permethrin") on the ground under the bedding (just scrape aside, sprinkle lightly) replace the bedding and sprinkle it (stir in). You can also use on the birds, though ivermectin drop on will work for 3 days. But in 7 days when the mites are rehatching you will want to redo the treatment by dusting them with permethrin dust. HOpefully the Poultry Protector will have decreased the number of eggs (though it doesn't kill them - nothing kills the eggs, but the spray will immediately kill emerging mites that are hatching).
Since you've used Adams on the boxes, yo uwon't have to repeat those. But use the adams on the roosts - under the roosts. Glove up, use a paper towel, and spray it on the paper towels and wipe the roosts.
Also in the mean time, boost everyone's blood with some boiled eggs as a treat, maybe vitamin/electrolytes in the water to counteract anemia and dehydration.
Mites are a pain, but thankfully you caught them - they're quite tricky to catch!
Despite what poultry protector claims to do, it does not treat mites. It's an enzyme. What it does is it cleans away (some) mite eggs and that in turns disallows mites from hatching out as much. But it doesn't kill mites.
Mites live in the wood cracks, in the joints, under roosts, in nestboxes, and off of birds most of the time. They just travel to the birds to eat and drain their blood really. So in order to get the mites, you're going to have to spray the coops unfortunately. The best product for this is a product that is 10% permethrin - usually marketed as livestock lice spray, or goat lice spray. Industrial poultry houses actually dilute it and spray it directly on the bird - it's safe enough for that. But you will use it on the wood 3' up from the ground, on eyes in the wood, in cracks, and on the nestbox wood. Then use the permethrin dust (always read the active ingredient and make sure both are only "permethrin") on the ground under the bedding (just scrape aside, sprinkle lightly) replace the bedding and sprinkle it (stir in). You can also use on the birds, though ivermectin drop on will work for 3 days. But in 7 days when the mites are rehatching you will want to redo the treatment by dusting them with permethrin dust. HOpefully the Poultry Protector will have decreased the number of eggs (though it doesn't kill them - nothing kills the eggs, but the spray will immediately kill emerging mites that are hatching).
Since you've used Adams on the boxes, yo uwon't have to repeat those. But use the adams on the roosts - under the roosts. Glove up, use a paper towel, and spray it on the paper towels and wipe the roosts.
Also in the mean time, boost everyone's blood with some boiled eggs as a treat, maybe vitamin/electrolytes in the water to counteract anemia and dehydration.
Mites are a pain, but thankfully you caught them - they're quite tricky to catch!
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