Silkie breeding, genetics & showing

[ScaredOfShadows]

Great info, Sonoran!! Thank you! I will be setting up and assigning cage cards for our county barn from now on and I have a LOT to learn!

Also good to know! I would have thought the same thing. But you said something similar about one of my roosters that had an overly large comb, but great texture. And guess what??! ALL of his offspring have had very small and beautiful combs! Combs must be easier to breed out with a good bird? I was afraid I'd end up with huge combs on everyone, but that didn't happen at all.
Here he is with badly sunburned feathers and his HUGE comb!

But I've got some older cockerels out of him and they are showing no signs of their combs getting this large!

OH-- of course I must add that I am using a couple of hens that have fantastic combs. VERY tiny-- almost not even there and very, very dark in color. They really offset him very well.

Your boys comb is large but not huge by other roos I have seen. Their combs should be wider and rounder as opposed to longer/taller and while its 'preferred' they have smaller combs its not a DQ or even a fault as long as it is not grotesquely huge and the appropriate comb type.

 

[Hawkeye95]

Your boys comb is large but not huge by other roos I have seen. Their combs should be wider and rounder as opposed to longer/taller and while its 'preferred' they have smaller combs its not a DQ or even a fault as long as it is not grotesquely huge and the appropriate comb type.

you've seen bigger!!!? LOL Hard to imagine, I thought his was pretty big! I have been gone every single day, I'm getting a little frustrated! (I'd like some down time) I still want to post the picture of the Frost I saw at the fair and the wings of the one boy I am debating on. Sigh. But even though I'm on right now, I'm about ready to head out again for the day. Won't be back until 4pm, and then we have piano lessons and then dinner. Another long day.

OH-- and Sonoran, we had all of those AOV's at the Fair for the silkies, but they did list the variety they were showing in for the AOV. There was the Frost, and Blue Partridge. I need to figure out who it is that has the Blue Partridges, maybe I could sell her mine. I ended up with the accidental color the breeder sent me. (not on purpose). It's a beauty and is turning out with great wings, crest, everything. I thought it might look a little better then the ones I saw at the fair, even. I just don't know what to do with it! I'm pretty sure it's a pullet, so if nothing else, I can sell her as a backyard egg layer for someone in the city looking for a fluffy bird. It's not showing a lot of signs of the gold leakage like I thought it might, though. So maybe it won't make a good partridge project.

 

[littlecritters]

Quote: It is not the "best" comb I have ever seen, but it is far from "bad." Certainly not a reason to rehome him as a pet.

I'm glad to hear the comb isn't as bad as I thought. Unfortunately, this guy is really long in the back and I think he is heavy for his age at 16-18 weeks. I am trying to find my postal scale, so I can weigh him.

Here is his brother...who has a much smaller walnut type comb, is lighter in weight, smaller in stature but still has a long back (not as bad as the boy above). This picture makes his back appear shorter than it really is.

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[littlecritters]

Here are a few pics of the wings on our black silkies that are approximately 17 weeks old. I am concerned with the quality of the feathers, especially the ones that consist of only a quill and also the feathers that appear on just one side of the quills. Would these feathers be considered a fault or even a DQ?

I think some of these birds also have weak wings, as they look split when gently spread open. BTW, these birds have amazing foot feathering. I just wish their wings looked as good as their feet.

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Any input on these wings and feathers?


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[Hawkeye95]

I'm glad to hear the comb isn't as bad as I thought. Unfortunately, this guy is really long in the back and I think he is heavy for his age at 16-18 weeks. I am trying to find my postal scale, so I can weigh him.

Here is his brother...who has a much smaller walnut type comb, is lighter in weight, smaller in stature but still has a long back (not as bad as the boy above). This picture makes his back appear shorter than it really is.

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Yeah, nice to know Sonoran doesn't think the comb is too bad. But my worry would be that his wattles are VERY red. Definitely a long back. I think you're being very wise to choose another bird instead. Trying to pick the best of what you have can be hard when you've started to grow attached to them or they all have one fault or another. I like the boy below better-- but do check his wings. I would take red wattles over a bird that has bad wings..

Any input on these wings and feathers?
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I couldn't really judge, so I didn't say anything. Judging wings-- you need a fuller shot of the wing coming off the bird and be able to see the entire spread of the primaries and the secondaries off the body. I just see tips of feathers. And I don't worry too much about shredding unless my wings are perfect and I can then worry about it. Right now, I'm dealing with the big wing issues, and so shredding is very low on my list. Instead, proper stacking and a nice even fan of the wings is more important to me. (with no split or gap or swept back secondaries-- OR twisted feathers!) I have one single bird that has managed to have the slip with the gap, and twisted secondaries. I am now the new Poultry Superintendent for our County Extension Office, and I'm going to keep her JUST so I can take her and use her as a "bad example" when I do my clinics this coming year! LOL!!! Not only that, but she is showing a very mild case of wry tail... it's like she hit the lottery on problems. She is the perfect bird to do a clinic with! hehehee Anyway, take a picture that shows more of the wing-- like I have done--- (examples of different birds here)

and then a good body shot of how the wing is held naturally like my bird here:

 

[dwegg]

Serama folks tend to enter unrecognized varieties as AOV without specifying WHAT the variety is, and there are a LOT of folks who do not like that.  I am one.  NAME the variety, regardless of whether it is recognized or not.  Not naming the variety is a LOT of what the article in Poultry Press a few months ago was about.  Judges are SUPPOSED TO KNOW which varieties are and are not recognized for EVERY BREED.  The test to become a judge is HARD!!!  They have to know the standard for EVERY RECOGNIZED BREED.  If they do not, they DO NOT PASS THE TEST.  Forgetting it later is NO EXCUSE!  Some judges are better than others, some are pickier, some have specific things they are picky about, etc.

Some shows tend to be double shows every year, others do not.  In 13 years I have only been to one show that was a double.  I have heard about rabbit shows that were triple and quad shows.

I didn't set out to NOT name the variety...it's just that I didn't know that I had to...and I wouldn't have entered my two girls as they are not any variety...I wish someone had asked when I sent my entry form in and said that I didn't name the variety ect...oh well...live and learn...but I did meet a couple of experienced silkie breeders who were more than happy to talk about showing with me so I appreciated that...

 

[peepblessed]

I would like some discussion on red comb/wattles. My understanding is that bright red is a DQ. Darker red would be missing points, but how many and how dark to be passable?

 

[Hawkeye95]

I didn't set out to NOT name the variety...it's just that I didn't know that I had to...and I wouldn't have entered my two girls as they are not any variety...I wish someone had asked when I sent my entry form in and said that I didn't name the variety ect...oh well...live and learn...but I did meet a couple of experienced silkie breeders who were more than happy to talk about showing with me so I appreciated that...

This is exactly why you go! Think about how much you learned that you didn't know before! And it just keeps getting more fun when you know what to expect. Yeah, the person probably should have phoned you or something to ask you about your variety, but if they had a lot of entries, maybe it got missed or they ran out of time. Glad you ran into some nice people to help you out!

I would like some discussion on red comb/wattles. My understanding is that bright red is a DQ. Darker red would be missing points, but how many and how dark to be passable?

Good question. And one I can't answer! I have no idea how much would be deducted. A comb would be DQ'd, but I don't think that wattles would be-- if the comb were nice and dark. Unless-- the wattles were just overly large and very red.. I bet there could be a lot of variables to this question.

 

[littlecritters]

Yeah, nice to know Sonoran doesn't think the comb is too bad.  But my worry would be that his wattles are VERY red.  Definitely a long back.  I think you're being very wise to choose another bird instead.  Trying to pick the best of what you have can be hard when you've started to grow attached to them or they all have one fault or another.    I like the boy below better-- but do check his wings.  I would take red wattles over a bird that has bad wings..  

I couldn't really judge, so I didn't say anything.  Judging wings-- you need a fuller shot of the wing coming off the bird and be able to see the entire spread of the primaries and the secondaries off the body.  I just see tips of feathers.  And I don't worry too much about shredding unless my wings are perfect and I can then worry about it.  Right now, I'm dealing with the big wing issues, and so shredding is very low on my list.  Instead, proper stacking and a nice even fan of the wings is more important to me.  (with no split or gap or swept back secondaries-- OR twisted feathers!)  I have one single bird that has managed to have the slip with the gap, and twisted secondaries.  I am now the new Poultry Superintendent for our County Extension Office, and I'm going to keep her JUST so I can take her and use her as a "bad example" when I do my clinics this coming year!  LOL!!!  Not only that, but she is showing a very mild case of wry tail... it's like she hit the lottery on problems.  She is the perfect bird to do a clinic with!  hehehee  Anyway, take a picture that shows more of the wing-- like I have done--- (examples of different birds here) 

 

 

and then a good body shot of how the wing is held naturally like my bird here:

Thanks for your reply. The pics that I had posted show how some of the feathers are very short, with almost " stubs" instead of nice long quills that are fully feathered. I will try to get better photos.

 

[Hawkeye95]

Thanks for your reply. The pics that I had posted show how some of the feathers are very short, with almost " stubs" instead of nice long quills that are fully feathered. I will try to get better photos.

I went back to look, and I'm just not sure what you're seeing. I did see the body feathers coming over the top of the wings in one picture-- those are short and fluffy. I couldn't see a good span where there were obvious shorter feathers. It may be more apparent to you since you already know what you are looking for in the context of the pictures. And I'm a very visual person, so I'm not a lot of help if I can't see it well!