'Splain something to me in re to baseball-type caps

[annie3001]

thats disrespectful to others, wearing a hat at a restaurnt. especially a nice fancy one.

 

[Dunkopf]

The only lack of manners that bothers me is stuff that actually affects me. Someone right in front of me letting the door shut in my face. Coughing or sneezing without covering is the rudest. Only hats that bother me are cowboy hats or stovepipe hats in theaters. Other than that I just don't care. Of course, passing gas on an elevator is rude too, unless it's me.

 

[Rozzie]

Again, WHY is it so impolite to wear a baseball cap? Just because it is "tradition" not to wear it? Just because people 200 or 100 years ago considered it impolite, when they lived in a different time & wore different kinds of hats for different reasons?

QUESTION tradition. Don't merely accept the way things have "always" been done.

Edited for typo

 

[al6517]

Quote:
And this thinking is the main reason why the manners of young people are going downhill, this frame of mind is what breeds poor manners and there children will think........ manners what's that. Tolerance is a weakness for those like you who are unwilling to stand for anything.

AL

 

[EweSheep]

They have not been taught or informed by the wait staff or manager that this is a fancy resturaunt.

In a fancy resturaunt you have certain protcols to follow, table manners and remove hats. Some will require you to wear ties. Tradition may die in that regard but some of us like to have that old time tradition and keep it that way. If you don't like it, find another place. Its part of the charm in seeing everyone dressing nicely for a change, after all those casuals and office casuals and hospital gowns. There are boundaries to follow.

If you are in a steak house, mom and pop resturaunt, then you can wear blue jeans, t shirts and hats but most of them are pretty clean. Be respectful to others if you are going to be boasterous.

For fast food places, I don't care if they are dirty or stinky, they need to eat before heading out for their construction or any "grunt" work and we don't have that right to let them know that they have to change clothes, new hats or BO. They know that and they will leave as fast as they can as soon as they get done eating. We dont have to sit next to them if they stink. Find another table. Table manners are out of the window for these places. Heck, some moms would come in PJ's to eat with the kids. Eat and go!

I had to teach hubby about table manners and equiette in the resturaunts about taking his hat off (during CW reenactments). My daughter is taught in table manners, not talkign with her mouth full, napkin on lap (NOT on neck!) or folded nicely on table to wipe fingers on rather on shirts, using her uteniles correctly, etc. I would give her the "stare or glare" look at her with a very strong disapproval if she did something she was not supposed to do. Many people complement her how well her table manners are and not eating like pigs in a trough or face on table and shoving plate to mouth kind of thing. Uh huh! No way!

There are more I can say about it. Kids are getting lazy about it. Only the ones that has been taught by well meaning parents would get the thumbs up from me.

 

[Rozzie]

Quote:
And this thinking is the main reason why the manners of young people are going downhill, this frame of mind is what breeds poor manners and there children will think........ manners what's that. Tolerance is a weakness for those like you who are unwilling to stand for anything.

AL

I disagree. Young adults need to be taught to think for themselves, not just to accept what they've always been told. It often comes as quite a shock to them to be told this by an adult.

Accepting what we are told to do and blindly following along just "because" it's the way it's always been done is silly -- and can be dangerous.

Again, exactly WHY is it so rude to wear a hat inside? Why was the tradition ever created to remove hats when coming inside? I suspect--but have not researched the topic -- that it is because hats were often dusty/dirty from riding in a carriage or from riding a horse, may have been dripping water or snow, or STANK to high heaven because of the materials they were made from (felt, skins, leather).

Lots of other traditions have gone by the wayside in the last several hundred years. What is so special about this particular one that it merits saving? When hats block vision, like a cowboy hat can do, then sure, it makes sense to remove it. That is sensible whether you are male OR female.

Most traditions begin because of some sort of functional reason. Any practical functionality of a standard "men take off hats; women leave them on" rule is long gone.

This sort of reminds me of the cliche where we ask kids "If your friends all jumped off the bridge, would you do it, too?"

How is this any different? Just because people have taken off hats in the past, why should we?

Cultures change. Traditions change. This is just another example. There is nothing sacred about it. And, even if you DO find something sacred about this one, somewhere, I'll guarantee that it won't be sacred in my belief system.

Edited for grammatical correction

 

[sourland]

I find myself agreeing with both Rozzie and Al. I guess it's just a matter of degree and personal bias. I find that as I age into a grumpy old man I become less tolerant of the rudeness of others. What others choose to wear is not a problem to me. Those who blunder through life as if their actions have no impact on others are another story.

 

[al6517]

Rozzie's oppinion on the traditions of certain things does have some merit, and I say some merit. I too also find that over the years I have disregarded some of what may be called traditions but they are minor.

I am just of the mind that if we continue to encourage our youth that not caring what other people think of you is irreponsible. Some view that as an act of independance or defience to the rules of society. Where do we draw the line and who will be left to inforce what is right in the world, I also feel that geography also play's a large part in how people think about how to act and proper behavior. I just think before we throw are lazy arm's up and say Ok do whatever you want we need to look at what will be the ramification of these actions in the long term of this dumbing down of our young people, as an adult you do have to set an example, it's part of your job. All I am saying is that there is middle ground, but one must know the low's & highs first.

AL

 

[darkmatter]

Quote:
Since, it's rare that I take the Missus out to a restaurant other then a special occasion, I don't notice or care how others are attired. I just make sure the Missus isn't stealing off my plate of lobster (or whatever). Having been overseas, I know cultures are different, so I take a live and let live approach. For all I know the hats were covering up skull tattoos gotten while drunk in Hong Kong.

 

[Rozzie]

Quote:
Ah, but I am not advocating doing "whatever you want." I'm advocating thinking about WHY we are doing what we do. I advocate making a conscious decision about our actions based on reason and facts. Traditions can be fine -- even when there is no real reason for following them. However, expecting all of society to follow a tradition just because some within that society want that tradition to continue is unreasonable.

As for laws, well, I firmly believe that civil disobedience is justifiable in many instances. However, a person needs to have a good, well thought out reason for this, and be ready to accept the consequences. Where would civil rights be today without people who stood up against the status quo?

Sure, wearing hats inside is not remotely comparable to civil rights issues (though one might argue that having different "rules" in this area for men and women could make it an off-shoot of such issues). It still illustrates the same concepts. Careful consideration of what has "always" been done, and rejection of that which no longer fits or is no longer appropriate is something that should be lauded. Change always brings discomfort to some within society. This is nothing new. In fact, it's almost tradition.

I am not advocating telling kids / youth / young adults or any other age group to just do whatever they want on a whim. I'm advocating teaching people of any age to use thought, reason, and evidence to make their decisions, not blind faith in how things have "always" been done or blind faith in what "the man" or "the church" says. That's hardly dumbing down our youth.



Disclaimer: "The man" is not intended to refer to gender, but to those in authority or control, whether that be political or social in nature. I shouldn't have to make this statement, but without it, someone will probably misunderstand the usage. Disclaimer #2: By saying "the church" I am not referencing any particular religious denomination or organization, including the Roman Catholic church, which has historically been referenced with the phrase "the Church." Instead, I am referring to religion in general. There. Perhaps I have played the CYA card here...