Successful 100% forage diet experiment (long post)

[NatJ]

I'm left suspecting that the potential for a degree of night vision varies across breeds and individuals.

Some time ago I had a dozen chickens (8 different breeds.) A particular few would be out foraging quite a bit later in the evening than the rest--it looked like some went to roost because it was getting dark, but those few thought it was still light enough to hunt for food.

So I suspected that some chickens just do see better at night than others, which matches what you're finding. There weren't enough of any particular breed to tell whether I was seeing breed differences or individual differences within a breed, and it's been long enough I no longer remember which breeds did what.

I did consider other explanations--whether they were higher or lower in the pecking order (they were somewhere in the middle), or whether they were just hungry (every time I checked, their crops were already full.)

You're looking at different factors than I did, and I'm finding this quite interesting!

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

You're looking at different factors than I did, and I'm finding this quite interesting!

The only possibility I cannot rule out is that the reflection they clearly have isn't caused by a tapetum lucidem but is instead caused by a different structure such as their double retina. Even so, I can't imaging that a structure in their eye that reflects visible light isn't somehow helping their low light vision.

When they get spooked at night they definitely act in such a way that's consistent with them being able to see somewhat. Wild turkeys are the same way. They can see well enough in the night to maneuver around the trees. They often change their roosts throughout the night and can end up several trees way from where they flew up at dark.

 

[AccidentalFarm]

Here's a pic that will hit on three aspects of free ranging at once:

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1. They have night vision. I'm sure not as good as a cat, but any eyeshine is better than none and better than how our eyes process low light.

2. They can take the weather in the open just fine, at least to what north Florida throws at them. Its raining here tonight. The birds are pretty wet and the wind is blowing. Its in the 50s now and will be in the 40s by morning, then we'll probably have a good freeze tomorrow night.

The coldest the outside roosting flock has endured this year has been 20F in the wind and while wet. They were fine. In the mornings of a freeze they come off the roost with frosted feathers. Its a testament as to how well their feathers insulate as the ice isn't melted by the body heat. Not unlike a whitetail deer's coat that will hold snow and ice on the outer later without melting because the body heat is being so well contained underneath. Some will change over to trees on wet nights, but the main outside roosting flock prefers the wide open.

3. Nest boxes like this with fake eggs scattered around the farm about torso to chest high do a great job of causing them to lay where you can find the eggs easily.

So a bit more about the night vision; I went around the farm tonight and took pics of different birds. I noticed they all have eyeshine, but the games/wilds have it much more noticeable from all angles while the layers only have a little bit from some angles.

A group of my Crackers, an American game bantam, an aseel cross, guineas, and a turkey on the ground underneath them. Distance is 15 yards away and I'm shining them with a flashlight. Their eyeshine is visible through the rain.

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So then I went to the coop flock:

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I had to really try to get angles that showed it in the layers. It often didn't appear in the Liege birds either. Both breeds had it but not as intense at in the Crackers or the other gamefowl or game birds. I think the bird right of this Liege is a barnyard mix layer and it often didn't shine either, but in some pics it did. View attachment 2480397

The Liege with the gold hackles seemed to have it in all pics and angles.
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I'm left suspecting that the potential for a degree of night vision varies across breeds and individuals.

Wow. Very cool pictures. It would be interesting to compare general behaviors between the ones with and without shine to see if there is any correlation.

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

Wow. Very cool pictures. It would be interesting to compare general behaviors between the ones with and without shine to see if there is any correlation.

The Wyandottes can be the first ones off the roost in the morning before daylight if I'm putting feed out and in a rush to get gone before work. It will aggravate me because I don't trust them not to get popped by an owl if they're foraging around half an hour before first light. But... it hasn't happened yet.

I used to have a yellow street light on the power poll by my coop and when it worked and was on in the mornings before daylight the chickens would zoom all around the lit hill before daylight. I have wondered whether the street light was enough to effect their laying and molt cycle in the winter. I've been considering getting it fixed.

 

[AccidentalFarm]

The Wyandottes can be the first ones off the roost in the morning before daylight if I'm putting feed out and in a rush to get gone before work. It will aggravate me because I don't trust them not to get popped by an owl if they're foraging around half an hour before first light. But... it hasn't happened yet.

I used to have a yellow street light on the power poll by my coop and when it worked and was on in the mornings before daylight the chickens would zoom all around the lit hill before daylight. I have wondered whether the street light was enough to effect their laying and molt cycle in the winter. I've been considering getting it fixed.

I don't know much about how light affects birds. I've never added light intentionally, but I know a lot of people do. I've always assumed that it's about the waking/sleeping hours ratio rather than a particular type or intensity of light. If that is true, then I'm sure the street light did affect them.

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

Going back to foraging. In the mornings at daylight the 58 free range birds get 3.8lbs of feed between all of them. That works out to roughly .066lbs of feed per bird. The ration is made up of roughly equal parts of cracked corn, sweet feed, and 16% layer crumble. The get no evening feeding.

Normally I double the ration for the winter but now I’m keeping it where it is. They go to roost with full crops and they aren’t varying far from their normal foraging areas so it looks like they’re not struggling to find food.

 

[0die]

Honestly, I think you've missed the whole point of why I'm doing this.

No I get a lot of your points and I'm not at all surprised by your observations. I guess I just have some different interpretations of your observations and how they might be applied.

If you expect everyone to reach the exact same conclusions from what you have observed and reported I think you will be disappointed. Am I offended by your rebuttal? No. Is there value in what you are doing and reporting? Absolutely. I would love to be able to accomplish something similar.

 

[AccidentalFarm]

If you expect everyone to reach the exact same conclusions from what you have observed and reported I think you will be disappointed.

I don't expect anyone to conclude anything in particular about my observations. My opinions of those observations are based on my goals. Your goals might be something else entirely,
but there are many possible and equally desirable outcomes depending on what one values.

I am also not offended, but I want to point out that the only difference between this flock and the usual free-range flock is that they don't have feeders full of commercial chicken food and they are not forced into a coop at night, although they have one to use if they wish. I'm not "doing nothing really to care or maintain them" as you said. They have access to everything they need and the freedom to use or ignore any of it.

Getting all the eggs would be great but free range chickens lay eggs wherever they want regardless of what and where they are fed. Achieving a 100% egg harvest will be a challenge no different for me than it is for anyone else that free ranges their birds.

 

[AccidentalFarm]

Going back to foraging. In the mornings at daylight the 58 free range birds get 3.8lbs of feed between all of them. That works out to roughly .066lbs of feed per bird. The ration is made up of roughly equal parts of cracked corn, sweet feed, and 16% layer crumble. The get no evening feeding.

Normally I double the ration for the winter but now I’m keeping it where it is. They go to roost with full crops and they aren’t varying far from their normal foraging areas so it looks like they’re not struggling to find food.

That's about the same that I do for my barn flock. Their ration works out to slightly more at .077lbs per bird. They get a 16% layer pellet scattered in the run towards dark to bring them all in for the night. They don't get any feed other than that.

Is the sweet feed an all-stock type or is it specifically for poultry?

 

[0die]

I'm not "doing nothing really to care or maintain them" as you said. They have access to everything they need and the freedom to use or ignore any of it.

Point well taken...I should have phrased that a bit better.

It's really from the chickens point of view that I am speaking. I believe you said you are not providing any food for this flock. So when they see you they are probably not seeing "the bringer of food". They see you more as a "neutral but friendly entity" that walks amongst us.

Yes you provide shelter and safety if they so desire but I don't think they can comprehend that concept or corelate that with the human unit..."oh look, here comes the builder of my home and my protector" is probably not on their minds when they see you. Perhaps some lingering memory as a parental unit?

If I'm understanding right, both flocks can fully free range the same full area? So how is the other flock "forced" into the coop at night if they can wander the same woods or do they just return by habit because of the food that is always there?

More interestingly, how has the experimental flock not figured out how to follow the first flock and find free food? Are the two coop far enough apart that neither flock is aware of the other coop? I guess never having been raised together probably look at each other as "rival clans".